Can Baseball be successful at NU?
- Thread starter DaCat
- Start date
Spring approaches and what better time for optimism? Yes indeed, the Cats can be successful on the diamond. The coaching staff sounds like a breath of fresh air.
I coach baseball. Own a travel program that has sent a few dozen kids d1. I love northwestern, but would have never in a million years sent a kid there for baseball under Stevens. I had an all state shortstop with a 30ACT who's dream school was NU. I wanted Stevens or another coach to take a look at him but couldn't get them to return a single call or email. This happened two separate times with me, and one player wound up Ivy League and the other at U of I. If he would have just replied to me and said "thanks but we're not interested, he's not good enough," I would have been more than fine with that.
I stay in touch with the U of I player almost daily and he said he and his team LOVED Allen at Illinois. Great coach, cares about his players grades, etc. they hated to see him go.
I absolutely think Allen will turn NU into a decent program. It'll never be a powerhouse cuz NU has extremely limited scholarships and is expensive to begin with, but baseball has turned into a white collar sport that people with money play, so they should start landing decent recruits willing to pay to play there. Maybe middle of the pack B1G, especially with the new field.
I stay in touch with the U of I player almost daily and he said he and his team LOVED Allen at Illinois. Great coach, cares about his players grades, etc. they hated to see him go.
I absolutely think Allen will turn NU into a decent program. It'll never be a powerhouse cuz NU has extremely limited scholarships and is expensive to begin with, but baseball has turned into a white collar sport that people with money play, so they should start landing decent recruits willing to pay to play there. Maybe middle of the pack B1G, especially with the new field.
Good to hear the high opinion of Spencer Allen. The stories that emerge of Stevens do not paint a flattering picture.
After that great start against Nevada, it looks like the Cats dropped the last two games this weekend. Pitching depth may be thin.
After that great start against Nevada, it looks like the Cats dropped the last two games this weekend. Pitching depth may be thin.
I wish the B1G would show more baseball. And even when they do, it's NEVER NU.
Not positive on the actual limit for NU, but the NCAA limit is 11.70/ team. I wanna say NU is closer to 9, but that's a complete guess
Other than being in a decent climate, what is Vanderbilt's secret to success in your opinion? or is weather the major swing factor?
For college baseball, weather does play a major role, because the season starts in February. Northern teams often have to practice indoors and then take multiple long road trips to start the season, whereas southern schools play home games immediately and have been practicing outside almost entirely.
It's very difficult for the northern schools to compete with the southern schools...
That might change now with the new stadium and coach. You also have the remember there are two PRO baseball teams in Chicago so that could affect decisions on what teams to cover, but I am sure it had more to do with the abysmal record of Stevens' teams, especially in the last few years. NU lacrosse, on the other hand, gets plenty of coverage from BTN.
Have the White Sox joined the Big Ten? Maybe they could actually have a winning record if so.
Yet lacrosse still doesnt get enough coverage. I still see the same canned, studio shows rebroadcast all day and night, day after day. I know covering sports live is expensive, but the BTN is based in Chicago and they used to show more student-produced productions. Not as much now.
Well that answers the question of what happened to the kid who started the first game.
I love Coach Allen and staff. I think the staff will maximize what we can do.
In fairness to Coach Stevens, I will say that 30+ years is a long time. He was notably a good recruiter back at the beginning of his tenure. Probably got stagnant and while that's not a GOOD thing for the program, I can certainly see how it happened.
Reality is, it's going to take a lot of breaks to win the Big Ten or get to the NCAA Tournament at this point. At least as long as it's not a fully funded scholarship sport. It's not like we can count on walk-ons like a state school might when it's almost 70K a year to attend.
Coach Allen will turn it around. Lack of talent has never been an issue and I'm almost positive we now have the full 11.7. Things are changing and there is no reason that this team can't be at the top of the conference every year.
The 11.7 will help --- but it's still weighted so far against us given the cost of schools.
Just harder to get the depth needed to be a true conference contender.
I will say I think we'll be as good as we can be with Coach Allen and staff. Fantastic, fantastic staff.
Just harder to get the depth needed to be a true conference contender.
I will say I think we'll be as good as we can be with Coach Allen and staff. Fantastic, fantastic staff.
Maybe but they should either match schlorship with the other conference schools or drop it and make way for a new basketball arena.
I read that's there are under 12 scholarships and there are maybe 30 guys on the team. So wondering if other conference schools give more then 12. Looking forward to reading the answer.
What part of lunker saying "the full 11.7" leads you to believe that other schools can give 12?
It's impossible to have 11.7 players, but baseball is not a "head count" sport. In baseball, the equivalent of 11.7 full scholarships can be given out proportionally to 20 different guys if you want. Football, on the other hand, is a head count sport in which the 85 full scholarships can't be divided up to cover more than 85 guys at a time.
See above
But obviously a half scholarship for an in-state kid at a state school is going to leave a family with a much smaller amount left to come up with than a half scholarship for a kid at Northwestern
THAT is where it gets tough to compete -- especially to build the depth necessary to compete in a 56 game season in 3 months. Northwestern will always have its top of the line guys that get drafted, at least it should. But you need more than a couple of draft guys per class to be competitive.
Talk about a dry spell, I believe the Cats last BIG baseball championship was in 1957 when the soon-to-be-Reds pitcher Jay Hook was on the team. And it was a little controversial because I think we had so many rainouts that the team finished with a 6-2 league record, beating out the second place team, who had played more games, by percentage points.
I think NU needs to sell it as we can give you $40k off tuition and they can give you only $20K (or whatever the amounts are). Use it as psychological thing. "We're giving your son a bigger scholarship at a more expensive, prestigious university with a brand-new stadium happening etc."
I assume if kids get a partial baseball scholarship, they are still eligible for other academic scholarships etc. which would help ease the burden of the high tuition. I'm not sure what the tuition is at Vanderbilt but they manage to do okay as a private institution in the SEC. The only thing NU can't really control is the weather. The field renovation and other investments should definitely make the program more competitive.
Next time somebody tells you that "my kid has a full ride to play baseball" know in the back of your head they're likely lying. It's rare to get a full ride, as the scholarships are divided out amongst 25ish guys.
Very true.
Although, in the case of NU they do have significant academic scholarship money available to hopefully help too. This actually may be an advantage vs. a U of I, for example, which may not have much academic money available at this point in time.
The NCAA limit is the same for all teams but as I understood, NU was never able to use the full allotment for other reasons (probably a lot to do with title 9. I think it is also true of the Wrestling team and maybe others as well. Not sure how many they actually gave out but not using the full number definitely limits competitiveness. Like fighting with one hand tied behind the back.
I love this post. I hear it almost daily from parents. I never say "you're lying" but the biggest scholarship I've seen given out was 70% and that was to a LHP who threw 95MPH who was ultimately a 4th round pick. That is HUGE in baseball. Most players are more like 25-40ish%.
I have never thought about why vandy is so good at baseball. I honestly don't have an answer for it. They have a player now from simeon who's gonna be a top 10 pick - Cory Ray - and he's from englewood. There's no way he can afford a Vanderbilt education even with a scholarship. I guess my answer would be the combination of weather, SEC baseball and recent prestige would be the simple way to put it. I'd guess that a Vanderbilt cost of tuition is similar to northwestern. I have no clue though
Corey Ray is at Louisville, and is a heck of a player.
The Chicago area player at Vanderbilt is Ronnie Coleman although he and Corey Ray played together growing up.
The cost of tuition at Vanderbilt is somewhat lower than NU, but, still in the upper level of cost.
My son trained with Ronnie Coleman for quite a few years and the amount of time Ronnie put in to get where he is was remarkable.
The Chicago area player at Vanderbilt is Ronnie Coleman although he and Corey Ray played together growing up.
The cost of tuition at Vanderbilt is somewhat lower than NU, but, still in the upper level of cost.
My son trained with Ronnie Coleman for quite a few years and the amount of time Ronnie put in to get where he is was remarkable.
Baseball is a primarily southern, primarily suburban sport. Kids that have the money to pay for the travel associated with year-round teams also have the money to pay for at least *part* of a private education. It's possible that, as a result, Vandy can give full rides to select players, or that athletic plus grants combine to cover the 100%.
Also, because there is so much money available to players out of high school, those with financial issues can choose to ride the MiLB buses at 18.
If your ultimate goal is to play baseball professionally, your best bet is often to play professionally at the age of 18. College baseball is a luxury good.
NU did not fully fund the allowed 11.7 scholarships. A coach confided that Money raised by baseball alumni reduced the contribution from NU's athletic department-talk about being the"red headed stepchild"
You can malign Coach Stevens but Sisaphys had an easier job
College baseball is now a reasonable path to the majors, although signing at eighteen can still be an advantage. I could have signed with the Braves or Phillies out of high school but after American Legion seasonended. However, the Florida Rookie league during the Vietnam War was not an attractive situation. Attending NU ended any interest the pros had in me. Playing in 30-40 degree weather ended my enthusiasm for the game as well
I hope NU baseball prospers but the underlying problems persist. NU has a small student body to supply walkons and cost above scholarship is very high. I do not believe you can combine a partial baseball ,academic or need based scholarship to offset family's responsibility
You can malign Coach Stevens but Sisaphys had an easier job
College baseball is now a reasonable path to the majors, although signing at eighteen can still be an advantage. I could have signed with the Braves or Phillies out of high school but after American Legion seasonended. However, the Florida Rookie league during the Vietnam War was not an attractive situation. Attending NU ended any interest the pros had in me. Playing in 30-40 degree weather ended my enthusiasm for the game as well
I hope NU baseball prospers but the underlying problems persist. NU has a small student body to supply walkons and cost above scholarship is very high. I do not believe you can combine a partial baseball ,academic or need based scholarship to offset family's responsibility
Similar threads
