The All Turk Preseason Top 20 Players

[Turk]

I'm thinking Jackson #1 or Van Hoose.
I'm also thinking 3 DB's in the top 10.
I think Shuler and Dickerson have potential that they may realize this year. That will be reflected in the Top 20 preseason rankings as well.

 

[julescat]

Which Dickerson?

 

[NJCat83588]

Which Dickerson?

Methinks both.

As an aside, picking the Top 20 essentially just names the starters. I'm only "interested" in who he has in his top 6 or 7. I'd go:
Jackson
Lowry
VanHoose
Harris
Jones
Igwebuike

 

[phatcat]

Methinks both.

As an aside, picking the Top 20 essentially just names the starters. I'm only "interested" in who he has in his top 6 or 7. I'd go:
Jackson
Lowry
VanHoose
Harris
Jones
Igwebuike

Comments on your comments.

- If our eventual QB doesn't end up in our Top 7, I think we are in deep water
- You say "Jones" and I immediately thought "which?". Weird that we only have one Jones to follow. Used to be difficult to "keep up with the Joneses" (ba dum bump)
- Three DB's in your group. Great that we have that talent level even after Campbell's departure, and PLEASE pressure the QB to give them a chance to do their stuff. Wasn't it great in the 95 season to be like "go ahead and pass" (until the Rose Bowl) since we had such top flight guys back there?
- More on DB's. In the fairly recent past, it was excruciating to see our team fight and claw for a lead, sometimes a large one, only to see it melt because we simply couldn't stop the other teams' passing attacks. There was no single cause - bad schemes, bad coaching, no pass rush, poor matchups. Remember - Trevor is the first B1G QB draftee in a while and there have only been a couple in the last several years, so we weren't exactly getting beaten by NFL caliber QBs very often.

 

[Gladeskat]

There are still two Jones, Joe the LB and Christian the WR. I hope Joe emerges this year.

 

[NJCat83588]

Comments on your comments.

- If our eventual QB doesn't end up in our Top 7, I think we are in deep water
- You say "Jones" and I immediately thought "which?". Weird that we only have one Jones to follow. Used to be difficult to "keep up with the Joneses" (ba dum bump)
- Three DB's in your group. Great that we have that talent level even after Campbell's departure, and PLEASE pressure the QB to give them a chance to do their stuff. Wasn't it great in the 95 season to be like "go ahead and pass" (until the Rose Bowl) since we had such top flight guys back there?
- More on DB's. In the fairly recent past, it was excruciating to see our team fight and claw for a lead, sometimes a large one, only to see it melt because we simply couldn't stop the other teams' passing attacks. There was no single cause - bad schemes, bad coaching, no pass rush, poor matchups. Remember - Trevor is the first B1G QB draftee in a while and there have only been a couple in the last several years, so we weren't exactly getting beaten by NFL caliber QBs very often.

Comments on your comments on my comments:

- I agree with you about the QB. Problem is, right now we have no clue who it will be. I am not expecting great things from that position in 2015, as inexperience may trump talent. Deep doo-doo indeed.
- The starting DBs, assuming all are healthy, will be very solid and deep. Could be a top 5 DB corps in the Big 10. OSU will be the best, they always are, but NU will be in the conversation. Ironic that after years of some people complaining about DBs and RBs, this season those position groups could be among the very best in the Big 10.

 

[shakes3858]

Comments on your comments on my comments:

- I agree with you about the QB. Problem is, right now we have no clue who it will be. I am not expecting great things from that position in 2015, as inexperience may trump talent. Deep doo-doo indeed.
- The starting DBs, assuming all are healthy, will be very solid and deep. Could be a top 5 DB corps in the Big 10. OSU will be the best, they always are, but NU will be in the conversation. Ironic that after years of some people complaining about DBs and RBs, this season those position groups could be among the very best in the Big 10.

2 years ago MSU had the best DBs in the big ten. Not even close. Wasn't a fan of OSU's defense that year. They were athletic, but they didn't play the right way. Take a look when they played Michigan that year. They gave up 450 yards and 4 TDs and no INTs to Devin Gardner.

 

[hdhntr1]

Comments on your comments.

- If our eventual QB doesn't end up in our Top 7, I think we are in deep water
- You say "Jones" and I immediately thought "which?". Weird that we only have one Jones to follow. Used to be difficult to "keep up with the Joneses" (ba dum bump)
- Three DB's in your group. Great that we have that talent level even after Campbell's departure, and PLEASE pressure the QB to give them a chance to do their stuff. Wasn't it great in the 95 season to be like "go ahead and pass" (until the Rose Bowl) since we had such top flight guys back there?
- More on DB's. In the fairly recent past, it was excruciating to see our team fight and claw for a lead, sometimes a large one, only to see it melt because we simply couldn't stop the other teams' passing attacks. There was no single cause - bad schemes, bad coaching, no pass rush, poor matchups. Remember - Trevor is the first B1G QB draftee in a while and there have only been a couple in the last several years, so we weren't exactly getting beaten by NFL caliber QBs very often.

In 1995, we had solid guys back there but so much was about the pressure. And the BIG was not really a throwing league back then so our backs were really good at supporting against the run.

 

[hdhntr1]

Comments on your comments on my comments:

- I agree with you about the QB. Problem is, right now we have no clue who it will be. I am not expecting great things from that position in 2015, as inexperience may trump talent. Deep doo-doo indeed.
- The starting DBs, assuming all are healthy, will be very solid and deep. Could be a top 5 DB corps in the Big 10. OSU will be the best, they always are, but NU will be in the conversation. Ironic that after years of some people complaining about DBs and RBs, this season those position groups could be among the very best in the Big 10.

DBs should be a good group. But if we do not get pressure on opposing QB, they could be made to look pretty pedestrian

 

[stpaulcat]

I'm thinking Jackson #1 or Van Hoose.
I'm also thinking 3 DB's in the top 10.
I think Shuler and Dickerson have potential that they may realize this year. That will be reflected in the Top 20 preseason rankings as well.

I don't get it--if your gonna have a top 20, why not make it top 22 so you have the entire offense and defense covered?

 

[Turk]

2 years ago MSU had the best DBs in the big ten. Not even close. Wasn't a fan of OSU's defense that year. They were athletic, but they didn't play the right way. Take a look when they played Michigan that year. They gave up 450 yards and 4 TDs and no INTs to Devin Gardner.

Very good points Shakes

 

[Turk]

I don't get it--if your gonna have a top 20, why not make it top 22 so you have the entire offense and defense covered?

Stpaulcat, during this pre-season, I'll find it difficult to round up 20 names, with the last half probably ending up there based strictly on potential or one game experience. One brother asked about our QB situation and that a QB should be in the top 7. I'm sure I will be very uncomfortable putting any QB in the top 7 prior to Kenosha, although an injury to any of the 3 QB's in Kenosha may be more harmful than an injury to a player that is rated in my top 7. It's really hard to be fair to Oliver in this situation since I only observed him in one game. It's tough to be fair with watching a kid in one season, let alone one game. So, I doubt any QB ends up in the top 20.

 

[Turk]

Which Dickerson?

Cameron

It was incredibly tough watching him play in a few games as his confidence was all but shot, but it was also easy to see his potential, and it flashed at times last year. His blocking was extraordinary, and when he did catch the ball, the guy just wouldn't go down. Gotta give points to his YAC. It didn't matter if it was downfield against a safety/LB or a quick LOS grab, he never went down easy. In fact, I'd like to see us toss him the ball more on the quick LOS toss when the matchup and defense allows it. If the field is spread, I can't see any LOS catch by him going for less than 5 yards until they gang tackle him. As far as last year, I think it is reasonable to assume that his broken hand had something to do with his tentativeness with catching the ball with his hands and using his chest or shoulder.

 

[julescat]

Cameron

It was incredibly tough watching him play in a few games as his confidence was all but shot, but it was also easy to see his potential, and it flashed at times last year. His blocking was extraordinary, and when he did catch the ball, the guy just wouldn't go down. Gotta give points to his YAC. It didn't matter if it was downfield against a safety/LB or a quick LOS grab, he never went down easy. In fact, I'd like to see us toss him the ball more on the quick LOS toss when the matchup and defense allows it. If the field is spread, I can't see any LOS catch by him going for less than 5 yards until they gang tackle him. As far as last year, I think it is reasonable to assume that his broken hand had something to do with his tentativeness with catching the ball with his hands and using his chest or shoulder.

Yes. I agree and believe that Cameron is going to have a great year. I believe that his drops last season were very much due to his injury and surgery. I'm quote optimistic for the season.

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

Alviti will surprise people!

 

[NJCat83588]

Alviti will surprise people!

Hope so.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Which Dickerson?

Garrett Dickerson is going to be a beast and it could be next year.

 

[NUCat320]

Garrett Dickerson is going to be a beast and it could be next year.

I agree, if given the chance. Gotta make it a point to get him on the field.

 

[NJCat83588]

I agree, if given the chance. Gotta make it a point to get him on the field.

He got a lot of playing time last season, mainly as a traditional blocking TE though. Not sure if the NU offense can target 2 TEs'/1 TE and 1 SB in the passing game.

 

[NUCat320]

He got a lot of playing time last season, mainly as a traditional blocking TE though. Not sure if the NU offense can target 2 TEs'/1 TE and 1 SB in the passing game.

The WR corps, I believe, is a weakness. Dickerson lined up off the line a few times during the season (particularly against ND) and Vitale has the versatility to set just about anywhere. Use Vitale like the Pats used pre-penitentiary Aaron Hernandez, and use Dickerson as something closer to a traditional TE/wing.

 

[NUCat320]

He got a lot of playing time last season, mainly as a traditional blocking TE though. Not sure if the NU offense can target 2 TEs'/1 TE and 1 SB in the passing game.

The WR corps, I believe, is a weakness. Dickerson lined up off the line a few times during the season (particularly against ND) and Vitale has the versatility to set just about anywhere. Use Vitale like the Pats used pre-penitentiary Aaron Hernandez, and use Dickerson as something closer to a traditional TE/wing.

 

[Cat In The Cradle]

To me the Top 20 players - or Top 5 players for that matter - are not necessarily those who excel or have proven themselves already but those harboring the greatest margin for improvement to their performance on behalf of the team, the maturity to create fewer mistakes, and the wherewithal to broaden the dynamic on either side of the ball or on special teams. In retrospect, for example, Justin Jackson was a Top 5 player on the team last year. For any true freshman to earn a significant degree of playing time is no given in any Fitzgerald coached team let alone his becoming the reliable feature running back that he was. Same with any position. Walt Harris, another example, stepped up his game and exceeded the usual year-by-year progression for his position by a large margin. Then there is the flip side to all of this: there always seems to be a handful of players, applicable to both the trenches and skill positions, who experience a notable regression from the previous year. I wish football allowed WIP-like statistics to better quantify each player's performance like baseball but it is more of a team sport. Alas!

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

To me the Top 20 players - or Top 5 players for that matter - are not necessarily those who excel or have proven themselves already but those harboring the greatest margin for improvement to their performance on behalf of the team, the maturity to create fewer mistakes, and the wherewithal to broaden the dynamic on either side of the ball or on special teams. In retrospect, for example, Justin Jackson was a Top 5 player on the team last year. For any true freshman to earn a significant degree of playing time is no given in any Fitzgerald coached team let alone his becoming the reliable feature running back that he was. Same with any position. Walt Harris, another example, stepped up his game and exceeded the usual year-by-year progression for his position by a large margin. Then there is the flip side to all of this: there always seems to be a handful of players, applicable to both the trenches and skill positions, who experience a notable regression from the previous year. I wish football allowed WIP-like statistics to better quantify each player's performance like baseball but it is more of a team sport. Alas!

CITC- "Walt" Harris?

 

[Cat In The Cradle]

ahem . . . Matt.