B1G down to a SINGLE team in the top 20 (none in top 15)

[FeliSilvestris]

What the title says.
Having Maryland done its disappearing act, and with the Badgers in the process of doing the same (now down to #22, from #7 back when the cats beat them, just a few games ago) the B1G could enter selection Sunday with a single team in the top 25.

Of course things could change between now and the end of the BTT. Conceivably one or two of the B1G teams getting votes may crack the top 25 (likely Minny). Then again, conceivably none may. The fact that almost at the end of the regular season the B1G is in this position is quite telling of the strength of the league relative to previous years.

But who cares...the B1G will still get lots of AL-bids nonetheless...5, 6, maybe even 7, because....well... ...the B1G is....the B1G, I guess....RIGHT????????????

Or so we are told.

 

[St_Henry_Buckeye]

Worst I have seen the B1G in a long time.

 

[FeralFelidae]

Or it can be seen as the overall strength of the conference from top to bottom (only one team outside the RPI top 100, I believe) and the teams beat up on each other during conference play.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

Ehhhh... the B1G does kinda stink this year....

That said I have a feeling Minne goes on a nice run in the tourney

 

[Sec.112]

Boy, Feli, do I look forward to when you're able to post something with some complexity. I know you haven't figured this out, but this whole equation combines more than the actual situation of your team and league. If you're really going go out of your way to be a prick, you might want to attempt to be knowledgable in the topic - you know, maybe post-1980s "bracketology" metrics would be a good start. Maybe even consider the complexity of the ENTIRE field - not just your little brush of a painting that has a much larger canvas.

Oh, who am I kidding? I don't give a damn. You shot yourself a long time ago. Keep rambling and throwing the spaghetti. Something will stick.

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

BT will have three teams in the sweet sixteen!

 

[WildcatfanChris17]

The B1G is so deep this year. Any big ten team can beat another big ten team on any given night. The B1G beats up on each other and that's why we only have one team in the top 20. There are no easy games in this conference.

 

[Walker Fan]

Please disregard his posts they are dazed and confused to put it lightly. Almost as clueless as the poster who said that Haas is a better player than Swanigan and will be a better pro.

 

[FeralFelidae]

Why do I get the feeling, Feli, that you don't want NU to make the Dance?

 

[Aging Booster]

Boy, Feli, do I look forward to when you're able to post something with some complexity. I know you haven't figured this out, but this whole equation combines more than the actual situation of your team and league. If you're really going go out of your way to be a prick, you might want to attempt to be knowledgable in the topic - you know, maybe post-1980s "bracketology" metrics would be a good start. Maybe even consider the complexity of the ENTIRE field - not just your little brush of a painting that has a much larger canvas.

Oh, who am I kidding? I don't give a damn. You shot yourself a long time ago. Keep rambling and throwing the spaghetti. Something will stick.

He never misses a chance to be negative. He must have a lot of hate in him or to have had a bad experience at NU. Too bad, but the rest of us have moved on.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

The B1G is so deep this year. Any big ten team can beat another big ten team on any given night. The B1G beats up on each other and that's why we only have one team in the top 20. There are no easy games in this conference.

Human poll respondents are presumably knowledgeable people, whether from the media or coaching world. They should know the difference between on the one hand a good team losing to another good team versus on the other a mediocre team losing to a mediocre-to-bad one.
It is human beings (sports personalities or actual coaches) who are saying that this late in the season the B1G has a SINGLE team in the top 20 (and none in the top 15).

If you want to argue that most sportswriters and coaches involved in rankings are wrong about the (lack of) strength of the B1G go ahead. I doubt you will persuade many reasonable persons, though.

 

[ThatkidfromHolland]

Human poll respondents are presumably knowledgeable people, whether from the media or coaching world. They should know the difference between on the one hand a good team losing to another good team versus on the other a mediocre team losing to a mediocre-to-bad one.
It is human beings (sports personalities or actual coaches) who are saying that this late in the season the B1G has a SINGLE team in the top 20 (and none in the top 15).

If you want to argue that most sportswriters and coaches involved in rankings are wrong about the (lack of) strength of the B1G go ahead. I doubt you will persuade many reasonable persons, though.

You are saying a top heavy big ten implies strength. Chris was talking about the competitive depth. Depends in how you define strength of a conference by just there top teams or top to bottom.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

You are saying a top heavy big ten implies strength. Chris was talking about the competitive depth. Depends in how you define strength of a conference by just there top teams or top to bottom.

In another thread a couple of weeks ago ( HERE ) we already looked at how this year's B1G bottom compares to the previous year's by using Sagarin data. The conclusion was that in terms of actual onfield results (not just the RPI or whichever rating) the bottom was actually WEAKER this year. However, since they are playing a weaker top, the bottom may actually seem stronger this year.
So, the B1G top is DEFINITELY weaker this year (as measured by the number of teams in the top 25, for example). And so is the bottom (at least per Sagarin data). If both top and bottom are weaker, it CAN'T POSSIBLY BE that the league is stronger. It IS weaker.

 

[ThatkidfromHolland]

In another thread a couple of weeks ago ( HERE ) we already looked at how this year's B1G bottom compares to the previous year's by using Sagarin data. The conclusion was that in terms of actual onfield results (not just the RPI or whichever rating) the bottom was actually WEAKER this year. However, since they are playing a weaker top, the bottom may actually seem stronger this year.
So, the B1G top is DEFINITELY weaker this year (as measured by the number of teams in the top 25, for example). And so is the bottom (at least per Sagarin data). If both top and bottom are weaker, it CAN'T POSSIBLY BE that the league is stronger. It IS weaker.

That thread proved your ignorance of basketball. Everyone who knows about basketball can easily see the bottom is much stronger this year. You have a valid argument for the top being weaker I would agree there but the bottom is clearly better this year.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

That thread proved your ignorance of basketball. Everyone who knows about basketball can easily see the bottom is much stronger this year. You have a valid argument for the top being weaker I would agree there but the bottom is clearly better this year.

Yeah, clearly better except that it is (was 2 weeks ago) doing MUCH WORSE against top 25 teams (that the bottom did last year). Couldn't care less that they MAY "LOOK" better on the court, if that doesn't translate into tangible onfield results.
You don't need to know much about bkb to understand w/l records against tough competition.

 

[WildcatfanChris17]

Yeah, clearly better except that it is (was 2 weeks ago) doing MUCH WORSE against top 25 teams (that the bottom did last year). Couldn't care less that they MAY "LOOK" better on the court, if that doesn't translate into tangible onfield results.
You don't need to know much about bkb to understand w/l records against tough competition.

B1G bottom five last year(Kenpom rankings)

Rutgers-279
Minnesota-192
Penn State-140
Illinois-125
Nebraska-85

B1G bottom five this year

Rutgers-138
Indiana-49
Nebraska-93
Penn State-81
Ohio State-65

Bottom of the B1G is much stronger this year than last year.

 

[ThatkidfromHolland]

Yeah, clearly better except that it is (was 2 weeks ago) doing MUCH WORSE against top 25 teams (that the bottom did last year). Couldn't care less that they MAY "LOOK" better on the court, if that doesn't translate into tangible onfield results.
You don't need to know much about bkb to understand w/l records against tough competition.

After this I'm done arguing with you because if you don't get this then you're a lost cause. Top 25 is an extremely poor measurement of the bottom of a conference. You should look at how they play games and records vs overall SOS. Just top 25 games is a very small sample size.

 

[mikewebb68]

What the title says.
Having Maryland done its disappearing act, and with the Badgers in the process of doing the same (now down to #22, from #7 back when the cats beat them, just a few games ago) the B1G could enter selection Sunday with a single team in the top 25.

Of course things could change between now and the end of the BTT. Conceivably one or two of the B1G teams getting votes may crack the top 25 (likely Minny). Then again, conceivably none may. The fact that almost at the end of the regular season the B1G is in this position is quite telling of the strength of the league relative to previous years.

But who cares...the B1G will still get lots of AL-bids nonetheless...5, 6, maybe even 7, because....well... ...the B1G is....the B1G, I guess....RIGHT????????????

Or so we are told.

I am going to have a hearty laugh over this when 6 or 7 BIG teams get in as nearly every bracketologist projects, and you have been proven to be incorrect for the umpteenth time.

#doltsgottadolt

 

[mikewebb68]

Yeah, clearly better except that it is (was 2 weeks ago) doing MUCH WORSE against top 25 teams (that the bottom did last year). Couldn't care less that they MAY "LOOK" better on the court, if that doesn't translate into tangible onfield results.
You don't need to know much about bkb to understand w/l records against tough competition.

Keep using that CAPS LOCK, man. It truly enhances the stellar quality of your posts.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

B1G bottom five last year(Kenpom rankings)
Bottom of the B1G is much stronger this year than last year.

Read before writing. It is NOT about raw ratings but about ACTUAL ONFIELD results.
If last year's B1G bottom was truly weaker than this year HOW/WHY on earth did they manage to do BETTER against the TOP 25 (using Sagarin's data)?
Not such small sample when DOZENS of games are involved.

 

[Catreporter]

Meanwhile, leagues like PAC-12, SEC are top heavy and are expected to get only four teams each into the tourney (I'm rooting hard for those dominant teams right now!). The Mo. Valley has two 20-plus win teams and yet Illinois State may not make it if they get upset early in their tourney. Too many bad teams there and same with the Atlantic 10. Too many bad teams in the BIG cost NU a bid to the NIT last year with a 20-win season. Strength of schedule matters!

 

[WildcatfanChris17]

Read before writing. It is NOT about raw ratings but about ACTUAL ONFIELD results.
If last year's B1G bottom was truly weaker than this year HOW/WHY on earth did they manage to do BETTER against the TOP 25 (using Sagarin's data)?
Not such small sample when DOZENS of games are involved.

Okay, here are the results
B1G bottom five last year

Rutgers 7-25
Minnesota 8-23
Illinois 15-19
Nebraska 15-18
Penn State 16-16

B1G bottom five this year

Rutgers 13-17
Penn State 14-16
Indiana 16-14
Nebraska 12-16
Ohio state 17-13

There are more wins this year in the bottom of the B1G than there were last year. If you're looking for onfield performance, take a look at the W-L record.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

Okay, here are the results
There are more wins this year in the bottom of the B1G than there were last year. If you're looking for onfield performance, take a look at the W-L record.

You should know (without anyone telling you) that you cannot just compare raw W/L records from a year to another, especially including OOC portion, since SCHEDULE STRENGTH varies from team to team and from a season to the next (especially OOC but also IC because of the B1G's non-round-robin portion of the schedule).

That is EXACTLY WHY in the other thread I focused on performance against the top 25 (using Sagarin data). Top 25 means top 25 this year, the previous, and earlier than that (of course, the top-25 teams from last year are not necessarily the same as the top-25 this year, which Sagarin takes care of).

When the comparison was made (a couple of weeks ago) last year's bottom did SIGNIFICANTLY BETTER against last year's top 25, that this year's bottom had done against this year's top-25. That clearly contradicts the claim that this year's bottom is stronger than last year's.