Coach Baldwin

[mcdadenets50]

Pat Baldwin's name is out there for the head job at Milwaukee.

Jeff Goodman

✔@GoodmanESPN
One name that will likely be in mix to replace LaVall Jordan at Milwaukee is Northwestern assistant Pat Baldwin. Was a candidate last year.

10:54 AM - 13 Jun 2017

 

[Sec.112]

Man, I'm surprised it's taken this long for his name to show up on the head-coaching merry-go-round - especially in NU circles. His presentation screams solid head coach. He recruits and we've seen he's involved in strategy.

 

[Jonny2TheP]

Man, I'm surprised it's taken this long for his name to show up on the head-coaching merry-go-round - especially in NU circles. His presentation screams solid head coach. He recruits and we've seen he's involved in strategy.

Pat's resume stands on its own and he's deserving of a D-1 coaching job. Not taking anything away from that when I say this...but the cynic in me has to at least wonder "At what point does the fact that his son is going to be a top recruit start playing into a school's decision to hire him?". Surely can't hurt his prospects of getting a head coaching job...

 

[rwhitney014]

Selfishly, I hope he sticks around a while longer. (I also think he can do better than Milwaukee, which hasn't had a ton of success outside of Bruce Pearl and will never be more than #3 in its own town.)

But there's no reason why he shouldn't start popping up on these lists with regularity.

 

[willycat]

Pat's resume stands on its own and he's deserving of a D-1 coaching job. Not taking anything away from that when I say this...but the cynic in me has to at least wonder "At what point does the fact that his son is going to be a top recruit start playing into a school's decision to hire him?". Surely can't hurt his prospects of getting a head coaching job...

If his son turns out to be a top recruit, then Milwaukee U. will not be in the picture.

 

[Max_Power]

Potentially

If his son turns out to be a top recruit, then Milwaukee U. will not be in the picture.

His son is a top recruit.

 

[willycat]

Potentially


His son is a top recruit.

Good for him. Does he have any offers? NU interest? I was just saying that Milwaukee U. likely doesn't have a shot at him, no matter who the coach is.

 

[NURoseBowl]

Good for him. Does he have any offers? NU interest? I was just saying that Milwaukee U. likely doesn't have a shot at him, no matter who the coach is.

Would think you're correct here, and if UW-M isn't in the picture, it wouldn't be hard to imagine Pat steering his son toward Evanston.

 

[rwhitney014]

If his son turns out to be a top recruit, then Milwaukee U. will not be in the picture.

Ray McCallum, Jr. was a top-20 recruit in the country and played for his father at Detroit Mercy, also in the Horizon League. This is all surmising, but it wouldn't be unprecedented.

 

[IdahoAlum]

Patrick Jr. still has four years of high school to go, I don't think Sr. would let that stand in his way of a head coaching job now.

 

[Kelly_32]

Baldwin can't coach. He needs to stay at Northwestern forever.

 

[Max_Power]

Good for him. Does he have any offers? NU interest? I was just saying that Milwaukee U. likely doesn't have a shot at him, no matter who the coach is.

I was not arguing with you. Just wanted to take the "if" out.

 

[Jonny2TheP]

Ray McCallum, Jr. was a top-20 recruit in the country and played for his father at Detroit Mercy, also in the Horizon League. This is all surmising, but it wouldn't be unprecedented.

Yeah, and to be clear, I was not insinuating that this would be the motivation of any school, or that Pat needs his son's skills to get a head coaching job, but I also don't think it's a completely unfair thought, although admittedly cynical.

 

[Figrating]

CC & PB are just getting started. I'd hate to see them separated so soon and I doubt the Milwaukee gig is attractive enough to cause it. Let's send Milwaukee resumes of the #2 guy at MSU, UW and Purdue.

And I'd think he'd want his son at NU which should glue his ass where it is for another 8 years.

 

[NUCat320]

If his son turns out to be a top recruit, then Milwaukee U. will not be in the picture.

I don't know if he was a Baldwin Jr. or Baldwin Jr'ish level of recruit, but Ron Hunter recruited his son RJ to Georgia State, the NCAA Tournament, and an early entry into the first round of the NBA draft. Urban commuter school with no tradition at all.

Upthread someone mentioned Detroit, which was the other example I thought of.

Kids never see their dads who coach. Assuming they like their dads, it's an amazing opportunity. For that and many other reasons, I hope Pat Sr. remains at NU for several years.

 

[hdhntr1]

Yeah, and to be clear, I was not insinuating that this would be the motivation of any school, or that Pat needs his son's skills to get a head coaching job, but I also don't think it's a completely unfair thought, although admittedly cynical.

Reasonable as we have seen plenty of places hire fathers or others and suddenly the kid goes there.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

I also think he can do better than Milwaukee, which hasn't had a ton of success outside of Bruce Pearl and will never be more than #3 in its own town.

At the risk of stating the obvious, if Mil was to offer Pat the job it would mean a substantial pay raise. Their previous coach was making at leat $350K (possibly plus bonuses). As an assistant at NU, Pat is likely to be making well below 200K (some 'bigger' B1G programs are paying about that). Say Pat makes 150K, then the offer may mean a cool $200K pay raise. Since he'd get 4-5 years semi guaranteed, the difference approaches $1 MM in total.

Yes, he may turn it down hoping for something better...then again, he may take it, thinking that if he does just reasonably well (considering THEIR level of past accomplishment) he could also be hired away from there by a bigger program anyway (and having actual HC experience shouldn't hurt his prospects with bigger programs).

I'd bet if he was offered the job (big IF) he'd take it.

 

[Deeringfish]

How old is he? Maybe he is at a point where being happy and enjoying his work, makes his salary at NU adequate.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

At the risk of stating the obvious, if Mil was to offer Pat the job it would mean a substantial pay raise. Their previous coach was making at leat $350K (possibly plus bonuses). As an assistant at NU, Pat is likely to be making well below 200K (some 'bigger' B1G programs are paying about that). Say Pat makes 150K, then the offer may mean a cool $200K pay raise. Since he'd get 4-5 years semi guaranteed, the difference approaches $1 MM in total.

Yes, he may turn it down hoping for something better...then again, he may take it, thinking that if he does just reasonably well (considering THEIR level of past accomplishment) he could also be hired away from there by a bigger program anyway (and having actual HC experience shouldn't hurt his prospects with bigger programs).

I'd bet if he was offered the job (big IF) he'd take it.

Or it just results in a pay raise for him at NU.

 

[Medill90]

At the risk of stating the obvious, if Mil was to offer Pat the job it would mean a substantial pay raise. Their previous coach was making at leat $350K (possibly plus bonuses). As an assistant at NU, Pat is likely to be making well below 200K (some 'bigger' B1G programs are paying about that). Say Pat makes 150K, then the offer may mean a cool $200K pay raise. Since he'd get 4-5 years semi guaranteed, the difference approaches $1 MM in total.

Yes, he may turn it down hoping for something better...then again, he may take it, thinking that if he does just reasonably well (considering THEIR level of past accomplishment) he could also be hired away from there by a bigger program anyway (and having actual HC experience shouldn't hurt his prospects with bigger programs).

I'd bet if he was offered the job (big IF) he'd take it.

Don't know this for a fact but I'd wager that the entire salary structure of NU mens bball is in the process of great change. The head coach's salary is now underwritten by a multi-million dollar endowment. I doubt that is so money can be returned to the university. I expect that the salaries of assistant coaches were substantially raised as part of that event. In addition, NU does the "house" thing for some. NU buys a house and the coach lives it in at next to no cost. So, lots of ways to narrow the salary gap and make it a tougher decision.

My take on Baldwin is he can do better than UW-M. If he hangs tight a few years he'll walk into major program as head coach, perhaps even NU. Tougher in some ways to succeed at a lesser school than a major program. Two cents, for what it's worth.

 

[NUCat320]

@Medill90 interesting on "the house thing".

I recall an article prior to a BCS or whatever game, when Kevin Wilson had NU left for Oklahoma , and he specifically mentioned the cost of housing. Basically "I get something modern and huge in Oklahoma for the cost of something old and tiny in Evanston."

 

[FeliSilvestris]

I expect that the salaries of assistant coaches were substantially raised as part of that event. In addition, NU does the "house" thing for some. NU buys a house and the coach lives it in at next to no cost. So, lots of ways to narrow the salary gap and make it a tougher decision.
My take on Baldwin is he can do better than UW-M. If he hangs tight a few years he'll walk into major program as head coach

What makes you think that other B1G programs (especially the 'bigger' ones) aren't doing the same? I got the $200K salary from a strong B1G program...they may also be providing their coaches the same "extras" that NU offers (if any)...but they aren't paying their assistants HC money...nor should NU.

Ultimately NU wants to pay COMPETITIVE salaries. That does NOT mean paying assistants HC-money (even mid-major-type HC money), which other B1G programs aren't doing either.

If PB is good enough for a mid-major HC job, NU should be happy a staff member and alumn will be getting a HC shot at a mid-major and wish him the very best....And then try to hire yet another strong coach who might get his HC shot a few years down the road...it goes with having a strong staff...other programs with a strong staff go through the same periodically and are able to survive just fine...so can NU.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

I recall an article prior to a BCS or whatever game, when Kevin Wilson had NU left for Oklahoma , and he specifically mentioned the cost of housing. Basically "I get something modern and huge in Oklahoma for the cost of something old and tiny in Evanston."

Maybe he did, but that's expected because a major metropolis, like Chicago, offers its residents a lot more in terms of culture, entertainment, shopping, restaurants, etc., etc., etc. So, you pay more, but you also get more....NU students also pay more for housing (or or off campus) than they would if they attended a university in a nondescript college town in the middle of nowhere...for the same reasons.
KW is free to say what he wants, but anyone can think of a lot of reasons why a FB coach may want to move from NU to OU which have nothing to do with housing.

 

[wildcat1066]

http://www.mlive.com/sports/2017/06/with_three_new_faces_rebuildin.html

An article from our local paper that might be of interest regarding assistant coaching salaries and the new coaches in the Big 10. From a Michigan / MSU perspective.

 

[TheC]

@Medill90 interesting on "the house thing".

I recall an article prior to a BCS or whatever game, when Kevin Wilson had NU left for Oklahoma , and he specifically mentioned the cost of housing. Basically "I get something modern and huge in Oklahoma for the cost of something old and tiny in Evanston."

Yes, but you then have to live in Oklahoma.

 

[Medill90]

What makes you think that other B1G programs (especially the 'bigger' ones) aren't doing the same? I got the $200K salary from a strong B1G program...they may also be providing their coaches the same "extras" that NU offers (if any)...but they aren't paying their assistants HC money...nor should NU.

I don't know that other programs aren't doing this. I do know that the other Big Ten schools are public universities so purchasing private residences may not be as easy to get approved.

Ultimately NU wants to pay COMPETITIVE salaries. That does NOT mean paying assistants HC-money (even mid-major-type HC money), which other B1G programs aren't doing either.

I want to thank you for capitalizing the most IMPORTANT words in each sentence. Had you not, I would have been LOST as a reader. And I'm sure your comments are NEW news to the board so that's appreciated as well.

If PB is good enough for a mid-major HC job, NU should be happy a staff member and alumn will be getting a HC shot at a mid-major and wish him the very best....And then try to hire yet another strong coach who might get his HC shot a few years down the road...it goes with having a strong staff...other programs with a strong staff go through the same periodically and are able to survive just fine...so can NU.

I'll take what's behind door number three: Keep Baldwin even if we need to overpay a bit. Make him assistant head coach. NU buys a North Shore private residence that is the dream of the Baldwin family and lets them live there. And the entire Baldwin clan goes to NU.

 

[EvanstonCat]

At the risk of stating the obvious, if Mil was to offer Pat the job it would mean a substantial pay raise. Their previous coach was making at leat $350K (possibly plus bonuses). As an assistant at NU, Pat is likely to be making well below 200K (some 'bigger' B1G programs are paying about that). Say Pat makes 150K, then the offer may mean a cool $200K pay raise. Since he'd get 4-5 years semi guaranteed, the difference approaches $1 MM in total.

Yes, he may turn it down hoping for something better...then again, he may take it, thinking that if he does just reasonably well (considering THEIR level of past accomplishment) he could also be hired away from there by a bigger program anyway (and having actual HC experience shouldn't hurt his prospects with bigger programs).

I'd bet if he was offered the job (big IF) he'd take it.

If we stood pat, perhaps.

Collins saw the benefit of the Duke plan with longevity of assistant coaches. He'll let Pat leave one day, but there is still much too learn. We haven't been to the Final Four yet. We haven't won a B1G.

I think Collins will insist on pay raises for his assistants so mid-majors can't poach him. And I think Dr. Jim will accommodate. It's not like another $200K will break the bank for us when we're bringing in all that B1G money.

 

[mcdadenets50]

PantherU.com @PantherU
I've talked to well over a dozen D-I coaches. There's a general consensus that Pat Baldwin is likely the front runner for the Milwaukee job.

9:10 PM - 18 Jun 2017


Justin Lettenberger @uwmbb33
I've been hearing Northwestern Asst. Coach, Pat Baldwin was the next in line last year if Lavall Jordan didn't accept the job.

5:48 PM - 14 Jun 2017

 

[hdhntr1]

Baldwin can't coach. He needs to stay at Northwestern forever.

If he can't coach why do we want him to stay???

 

[hdhntr1]

Yeah, and to be clear, I was not insinuating that this would be the motivation of any school, or that Pat needs his son's skills to get a head coaching job, but I also don't think it's a completely unfair thought, although admittedly cynical.

Didn't St Louis make a move like that?

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

I think Collins will insist on pay raises for his assistants so mid-majors can't poach him.

Some guys just prefer to be a head coach even if the pay is slightly less. If Baldwin is one of those guys, nothing we do will keep him around long.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

Some guys just prefer to be a head coach even if the pay is slightly less. If Baldwin is one of those guys, nothing we do will keep him around long.

And it won't be less. NU will NOT pay more than what other B1G programs are paying for a given position (nor should). If 'bigger' BkB programs are paying about $200K to their assistants (who are quite reputable also) NU won't pay $350K, which would be almost twice as much. And if NU did (humongous IF) it would affect the pay scale not just for the BkB staff, but for the entire athletic program (the market has set a relation for example between say a FB position coach and a mens BkB assistant...and a W-BkB assistant, etc they have to be consistent with each other). It could be a huge amount of money just to keep one coach (who may leave anyway, if he keeps on getting offers from bigger programs).

 

[Kelly_32]

If he can't coach why do we want him to stay???

It was sarcasm. Note the winky face.