Fitz will be fine

[Pulmocat]

After speaking to a person involved in the formal investigation of the alleged hazing within the football program I have no doubt Fitz will be vindicated and move on to bigger opportunities.

NU on the other hand is going to be writing a huge check to him.

 

[HawkCat]

After speaking to a person involved in the formal investigation of the alleged hazing within the football program I have no doubt Fitz will be vindicated and move on to bigger opportunities.

NU on the other hand is going to be writing a huge check to him.

I can see him doing a TV gig for a while. He would be really good at that.

 

[Darren72]

After speaking to a person involved in the formal investigation of the alleged hazing within the football program I have no doubt Fitz will be vindicated and move on to bigger opportunities.

NU on the other hand is going to be writing a huge check to him.

Would love to hear more.

 

[ashley0623]

I hope this has legs. Braun being named interim keeps the door open.

 

[peatymeanis]

I hope this has legs. Braun being named interim keeps the door open.

They call this the bargaining stage of grief

 

[corbi296]

I hope this has legs. Braun being named interim keeps the door open.

The door open for what? Fitz’s reinstatement? While I would love nothing more, I just don’t see how that can happen.

 

[JournCat]

He will get better offers out of this firing than had he overseen two more seasons like the last two. NU’s incompetence made him a martyr. What a gift.

 

[TheC]

There's no complete vindication from this. Unless every aspect of this story is fabrication, which at this point seems unlikely, Fitz will always be tarnished by this. Opinions will always remain split on how much he is to blame for this and as long as that is the case, he will not be vindicated entirely. While I do believe he will probably get another coaching job someday - even a head coaching job - there is no way he ends up in front of a tv camera.

(And in 5 years, when he is a talking head on the ESPN college football round table show, I hope this post is buried too deep in the Rivals archives to ever find)

 

[curdog]

There's no complete vindication from this. Unless every aspect of this story is fabrication, which at this point seems unlikely, Fitz will always be tarnished by this. Opinions will always remain split on how much he is to blame for this and as long as that is the case, he will not be vindicated entirely. While I do believe he will probably get another coaching job someday - even a head coaching job - there is no way he ends up in front of a tv camera.

(And in 5 years, when he is a talking head on the ESPN college football round table show, I hope this post is buried too deep in the Rivals archives to ever find)

I think “full” vindication is very unlikely, “largely” vindicated is a distinct possibility. If the report shows that some of the daily allegations were exaggerated and/or these were non-systemic (one offs), then I could see him getting another coaching gig in college. It really all depends on what the report says.

 

[Frabjous]

Good to know that Fitz will not be subsisting on government surplus cheese and living in a refrigerator box.

 

[SteveNU]

A) We're never going to see the report

B) The hazing was acknowledged by 11 current or former players (plus the letter from the team). It happened. There's no walking back reality. The rest of the world has clearly stated Fitz deserved to be fired whether he knew or not. There's literally no information that could come out that would "vindicate" him.

 

[curdog]

A) We're never going to see the report

B) The hazing was acknowledged by 11 current or former players (plus the letter from the team). It happened. There's no walking back reality. The rest of the world has clearly stated Fitz deserved to be fired whether he knew or not. There's literally no information that could come out that would "vindicate" him.

Disagree, some version of the report is going to be released (beyond the already released summary). Either through litigation or public outcry.

 

[curdog]

A) We're never going to see the report

B) The hazing was acknowledged by 11 current or former players (plus the letter from the team). It happened. There's no walking back reality. The rest of the world has clearly stated Fitz deserved to be fired whether he knew or not. There's literally no information that could come out that would "vindicate" him.

We all agree that some type of hazing occurred. What was the exact nature? How often did it occur? Over how many years? How many players involved? I believe all of this information will come out eventually.

 

[TheC]

We all agree that some type of hazing occurred. What was the exact nature? How often did it occur? Over how many years? How many players involved? I believe all of this information will come out eventually.

Not everybody. There is a whole thread on here arguing over the definition of what "is" is.

 

[curdog]

Not everybody. There is a whole thread on here arguing over the definition of what "is" is.

Yeah, I saw some of those. I’ll leave that for the lawyers to sort out. The summary of the report says hazing occurred so to me that’s definitive.

 

[corbi296]

A) We're never going to see the report

B) The hazing was acknowledged by 11 current or former players (plus the letter from the team). It happened. There's no walking back reality. The rest of the world has clearly stated Fitz deserved to be fired whether he knew or not. There's literally no information that could come out that would "vindicate" him.

Twitter is not the rest of the world. My guess is that there are many more people like Jim O’Oddennel from tha Daily Herald who today published a column expressing that he thought FItz got railroaded. I completely agree. The world is just not that black and white. Fitz’s punishment did not fit the crime nor was it reflective of the tremendous positive contribution he made and was continuing to make at NU. NU is certainly not better off without FItz and I am not sure the Athletic Department at NU will ever recover from his loss.

 

[villox]

Twitter is not the rest of the world. My guess is that there are many more people like Jim O’Oddennel from tha Daily Herald who today published a column expressing that he thought FItz got railroaded. I completely agree. The world is just not that black and white. Fitz’s punishment did not fit the crime nor was it reflective of the tremendous positive contribution he made and was continuing to make at NU. NU is certainly not better off without FItz and I am not sure the Athletic Department at NU will ever recover from his loss.

I think Fitz and the entire program learned its lesson. We saw what a future without him looked like, even if briefly, and it was bleak. The players and he will be well behaved from now on, the stadium will get built, and we’ll win the Big Ten in 4 years.

 

[SadCat]

I think Fitz and the entire program learned its lesson. We saw what a future without him looked like, even if briefly, and it was bleak. The players and he will be well behaved from now on, the stadium will get built, and we’ll win the Big Ten in 4 years.

Whatever you are smoking—do you happen to have any extra to spare? 😂

 

[villox]

Whatever you are smoking—do you happen to have any extra to spare? 😂

Yes, but you’re going to have to haze me first.

 

[corbi296]

I think Fitz and the entire program learned its lesson. We saw what a future without him looked like, even if briefly, and it was bleak. The players and he will be well behaved from now on, the stadium will get built, and we’ll win the Big Ten in 4 years.

Not exactly how I would write up but something along of the lines of that plus a 4-6 game suspension. I see zero wrong with that approach and would have found it fairer and 100% more in NU’s best interests than how things unfolded. Especially Considering I see exactly zero victims who were truly “harmed” here.

 

[BillMedleyFan]

Coaches that got fired for non performance reasons

Mike Leach: Coached again and repaired his image

Art Briles: Never coached again

Jim Tressel: Coached on FCS level

Joe Paterno: passed away a few months after being fired.

Greg Schiano: Wasn’t fired, but connection to PSU cost him Tennessee job. Eventually landed back at Rutgers

Butch Jones: Fired for performance, but a lot of controversy and allegations with him at Tennessee. Now head coach at Arkansas State.

 

[ashley0623]

Jim Tressel didn’t coach again. He became a university president.

 

[WaveJumper]

Fitz’s punishment did not fit the crime nor was it reflective of the tremendous positive contribution he made and was continuing to make at NU. NU is certainly not better off without FItz and I am not sure the Athletic Department at NU will ever recover from his loss.

I have waited several days to post my take on this, trying very hard to cool off, to the point to try to have a logical thought process prevail.

Corbi:

Over many threads, I have disagreed with your stance on various issues. We've definitely had a different perspective on many things.

But I have to say, I agree 100% with your above statement. By the way, Gary Barnett said the same thing.

I don't think most people on this board, or those associated with the athletic department and university, have really, thoughtfully, considered the long term effects {that the ill-conceived action(s) and ill-conceived process that was followed}, will have on the unversity and football program.

Schill and Gragg are perfect examples of well educated, well credentialed idiots. This whole situation (every step) was handled by lightweights in the area of expertise and leadership that their position level requires. I was a corporate "C" level officer, so I think I have the chops to make that statement. Neither Schill or Gragg may not know, or have any idea, how much their mishandling has hurt the university and progaram, and how much more it can, and probably, will be hurt.

I'm pretty old, and it pains me to make this statement, but, unfortunately, I think it will turn out to be true - I do not think I will ever see NU footbll return to a respectable level of performance. Even Big 10 membership could be threatened notwithstanding being a charter member.

What so many players, coaches, administraters, and others that worked so hard to build, may never come back - solely because two well educated idiots yielded to outside pressure. They had no idea on how to handle the situation properly, without caving. One of them, thought so little of the most important day of his career, that he was on a european vacation when he, absolutely, should have been on campus. His actions are indefensible, period.

I do not make little of the charge of "sexual hazing". What I critisize, is the way it was handled. Both the president and AD are in over their heads and should be replaced ASAP - they gave Fitz no quarter, and they deserve none. The monetary damage alone will be staggering. If they both still have a job at NU in 30 days, I will have lost any respect I still have for the university leadership and will NEVER give it another dime.

I am so pi$$ed at the completely ball-less and incompetent decision making "leaders" that I am tempted to dig up my brick in the south endzone plaza.

 

[NUChicago]

I have waited several days to post my take on this, trying very hard to cool off, to the point to try to have a logical thought process prevail.

Corbi:

Over many threads, I have disagreed with your stance on various issues. We've definitely had a different perspective on many things.

But I have to say, I agree 100% with your above statement. By the way, Gary Barnett said the same thing.

I don't think most people on this board, or those associated with the athletic department and university, have really, thoughtfully, considered the long term effects {that the ill-conceived action(s) and ill-conceived process that was followed}, will have on the unversity and football program.

Schill and Gragg are perfect examples of well educated, well credentialed idiots. This whole situation (every step) was handled by lightweights in the area of expertise and leadership that their position level requires. I was a corporate "C" level officer, so I think I have the chops to make that statement. Neither Schill or Gragg may not know, or have any idea, how much their mishandling has hurt the university and progaram, and how much more it can, and probably, will be hurt.

I'm pretty old, and it pains me to make this statement, but, unfortunately, I think it will turn out to be true - I do not think I will ever see NU footbll return to a respectable level of performance. Even Big 10 membership could be threatened notwithstanding being a charter member.

What so many players, coaches, administraters, and others that worked so hard to build, may never come back - solely because two well educated idiots yielded to outside pressure. They had no idea on how to handle the situation properly, without caving. One of them, thought so little of the most important day of his career, that he was on a european vacation when he, absolutely, should have been on campus. His actions are indefensible, period.

I do not make little of the charge of "sexual hazing". What I critisize, is the way it was handled. Both the president and AD are in over their heads and should be replaced ASAP - they gave Fitz no quarter, and they deserve none. The monetary damage alone will be staggering. If they both still have a job at NU in 30 days, I will have lost any respect I still have for the university leadership and will NEVER give it another dime.

I am so pi$$ed at the completely ball-less and incompetent decision making "leaders" that I am tempted to dig up my brick in the south endzone plaza.

Well put, hopefully other C level folks on the board see this as well.

 

[julescat]

Or, Fitz has been a con man all along. The requirements for him to keep his very sweet job were at the lowest standard imaginable. He didn't have to win. He failed to keep decency in his program. For that he was and should have been whacked.

The guys in the University President and AD seats have certainly not performed well. Fine to whack those guys too, in my opinion. But Fitz completely failed in this.

What a horrible week but this investigation has gone on for a long time and the bias, I'm sure, was to find nothing too, too big. That's not how it turned out.

I'm pretty much done with interest in the NU programs. It's been fun along the way, even from the Dark Ages but even the great times now seem very icky to me. I don't care how other programs behave and how other fan bases and administrations choose to tolerate it but I despise behavior like has been described within the NU program.

 

[mountaindrew]

Whatever you are smoking—do you happen to have any extra to spare? 😂

You beat me to it, Sad...

... and so nice to see you (among MANY others) come out of the woodwork suddenly.

 

[mountaindrew]

I have waited several days to post my take on this, trying very hard to cool off, to the point to try to have a logical thought process prevail.

Corbi:

Over many threads, I have disagreed with your stance on various issues. We've definitely had a different perspective on many things.

But I have to say, I agree 100% with your above statement. By the way, Gary Barnett said the same thing.

I don't think most people on this board, or those associated with the athletic department and university, have really, thoughtfully, considered the long term effects {that the ill-conceived action(s) and ill-conceived process that was followed}, will have on the unversity and football program.

Schill and Gragg are perfect examples of well educated, well credentialed idiots. This whole situation (every step) was handled by lightweights in the area of expertise and leadership that their position level requires. I was a corporate "C" level officer, so I think I have the chops to make that statement. Neither Schill or Gragg may not know, or have any idea, how much their mishandling has hurt the university and progaram, and how much more it can, and probably, will be hurt.

I'm pretty old, and it pains me to make this statement, but, unfortunately, I think it will turn out to be true - I do not think I will ever see NU footbll return to a respectable level of performance. Even Big 10 membership could be threatened notwithstanding being a charter member.

What so many players, coaches, administraters, and others that worked so hard to build, may never come back - solely because two well educated idiots yielded to outside pressure. They had no idea on how to handle the situation properly, without caving. One of them, thought so little of the most important day of his career, that he was on a european vacation when he, absolutely, should have been on campus. His actions are indefensible, period.

I do not make little of the charge of "sexual hazing". What I critisize, is the way it was handled. Both the president and AD are in over their heads and should be replaced ASAP - they gave Fitz no quarter, and they deserve none. The monetary damage alone will be staggering. If they both still have a job at NU in 30 days, I will have lost any respect I still have for the university leadership and will NEVER give it another dime.

I am so pi$$ed at the completely ball-less and incompetent decision making "leaders" that I am tempted to dig up my brick in the south endzone plaza.

Wave, I truly hope you have sent these thoughts off to the BoT. If they don't know directly how alums/donors like you think and feel about Schill and Gragg, they will have a reason to sit on their hands.

 

[Pasadena Bound]

I have waited several days to post my take on this, trying very hard to cool off, to the point to try to have a logical thought process prevail.

Corbi:

Over many threads, I have disagreed with your stance on various issues. We've definitely had a different perspective on many things.

But I have to say, I agree 100% with your above statement. By the way, Gary Barnett said the same thing.

I don't think most people on this board, or those associated with the athletic department and university, have really, thoughtfully, considered the long term effects {that the ill-conceived action(s) and ill-conceived process that was followed}, will have on the unversity and football program.

Schill and Gragg are perfect examples of well educated, well credentialed idiots. This whole situation (every step) was handled by lightweights in the area of expertise and leadership that their position level requires. I was a corporate "C" level officer, so I think I have the chops to make that statement. Neither Schill or Gragg may not know, or have any idea, how much their mishandling has hurt the university and progaram, and how much more it can, and probably, will be hurt.

I'm pretty old, and it pains me to make this statement, but, unfortunately, I think it will turn out to be true - I do not think I will ever see NU footbll return to a respectable level of performance. Even Big 10 membership could be threatened notwithstanding being a charter member.

What so many players, coaches, administraters, and others that worked so hard to build, may never come back - solely because two well educated idiots yielded to outside pressure. They had no idea on how to handle the situation properly, without caving. One of them, thought so little of the most important day of his career, that he was on a european vacation when he, absolutely, should have been on campus. His actions are indefensible, period.

I do not make little of the charge of "sexual hazing". What I critisize, is the way it was handled. Both the president and AD are in over their heads and should be replaced ASAP - they gave Fitz no quarter, and they deserve none. The monetary damage alone will be staggering. If they both still have a job at NU in 30 days, I will have lost any respect I still have for the university leadership and will NEVER give it another dime.

I am so pi$$ed at the completely ball-less and incompetent decision making "leaders" that I am tempted to dig up my brick in the south endzone plaza.

Wave Jumper… excellent post. You capture so much of what I have been thinking. Gragg and Schill are hired hands and really screwed this up. They will both move on (hopefully soon) but their ineptitude will negatively impact NU for years.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

He failed to keep decency in his program

That is your opinion. My opinion is that he ran a stellar program that made Northwestern proud. I think the coaches and players are honorable people and in some cases, role models.
I certainly object to your gross mischaracterization of a bunch of productive, hard-working Northwestern students as "indecent."
I would add that people who have not personally participated in team sports should not be judging locker room conduct in sports.

Football is a violent game. Northwestern willingly subjects its students to degradation, humiliation and physical injury every time they take the field. In order to make money.

This whole thing and many of the commenters reek with hypocrisy.

 

[WaveJumper]

I would add that people who have not personally participated in team sports should not be judging locker room conduct in sports.

This was one of my original thoughts, but as much as I would like to agree with it, I can't totally endorse it.

Before I start my reply, I want to make it totally clear that I, in no way, support deviant sexual acts as a form of hazing.

Hoiwever, having said that, and as a member of several "locker room" team sports, I totally understand your frustration with those who haven't been fortunate enough to have that experience. They haven't been there, they don't know, and never will know. From the comments I've read on these threads, I think there's a lot of them on this board.

The simple fact is that hazing is an accepted, tradition in male dominated team sports. It always has been, and always will be. Trust me, you will not change that - ever. There will always be the duct taping, analgesic balm in the jock, and even worse stuff (that I've experienced). If you think you will totally eliminate some form of hazing, you are pi$$ing in the wind. Whenever you get an aggressive group of young men on a team, they will ALWAYS practice the rite of passage. It's like the sun coming up - count on it.

So the thing is, those of us who have gone through it, probably have a little different perspective than those who haven't. We probably expect it and accept it more, But, I also think that those of us who have gone through that rite of passage would draw a very hard line at sexual misconduct, unless you include pi$$ing on a teammates leg in the shower, sexual misconduct.

 

[fcmchi]

This was one of my original thoughts, but as much as I would like to agree with it, I can't totally endorse it.

Before I start my reply, I want to make it totally clear that I, in no way, support deviant sexual acts as a form of hazing.

Hoiwever, having said that, and as a member of several "locker room" team sports, I totally understand your frustration with those who haven't been fortunate enough to have that experience. They haven't been there, they don't know, and never will know. From the comments I've read on these threads, I think there's a lot of them on this board.

The simple fact is that hazing is an accepted, tradition in male dominated team sports. It always has been, and always will be. Trust me, you will not change that - ever. There will always be the duct taping, analgesic balm in the jock, and even worse stuff (that I've experienced). If you think you will totally eliminate some form of hazing, you are pi$$ing in the wind. Whenever you get an aggressive group of young men on a team, they will ALWAYS practice the rite of passage. It's like the sun coming up - count on it.

So the thing is, those of us who have gone through it, probably have a little different perspective than those who haven't. We probably expect it and accept it more, But, I also think that those of us who have gone through that rite of passage would draw a very hard line at sexual misconduct, unless you include pi$$ing on a teammates leg in the shower, sexual misconduct.

WaveJumper,

Played high school football for the then maximum three years, ran track and wrestled for one year in high school, played one year of football in college until an injury ended my organized sports career.

All male. No hazing. I don’t understand it nor see the need for it. The drudgery of practice, the hostility of the opposing fans, the adulation of ours, the highs of winning, the lows of losing: those were the bonds that tied us together.

And all that was in the dark ages of the 1960’s.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

This was one of my original thoughts, but as much as I would like to agree with it, I can't totally endorse it.

Before I start my reply, I want to make it totally clear that I, in no way, support deviant sexual acts as a form of hazing.

Hoiwever, having said that, and as a member of several "locker room" team sports, I totally understand your frustration with those who haven't been fortunate enough to have that experience. They haven't been there, they don't know, and never will know. From the comments I've read on these threads, I think there's a lot of them on this board.

The simple fact is that hazing is an accepted, tradition in male dominated team sports. It always has been, and always will be. Trust me, you will not change that - ever. There will always be the duct taping, analgesic balm in the jock, and even worse stuff (that I've experienced). If you think you will totally eliminate some form of hazing, you are pi$$ing in the wind. Whenever you get an aggressive group of young men on a team, they will ALWAYS practice the rite of passage. It's like the sun coming up - count on it.

So the thing is, those of us who have gone through it, probably have a little different perspective than those who haven't. We probably expect it and accept it more, But, I also think that those of us who have gone through that rite of passage would draw a very hard line at sexual misconduct, unless you include pi$$ing on a teammates leg in the shower, sexual misconduct.

Well thats the thing - what is the line?

If players are "encouraged" by their teammates to do something, is that really the same thing as being "forced' to do it?

 

[Gladeskat]

So the thing is, those of us who have gone through it, probably have a little different perspective than those who haven't. We probably expect it and accept it more, But, I also think that those of us who have gone through that rite of passage would draw a very hard line at sexual misconduct, unless you include pi$$ing on a teammates leg in the shower, sexual misconduct.

Who hasn't peed on a teammate's leg in the shower? That said, I never saw anything close to hazing in HS and college sports where people are coerced into doing stuff. I cannot recall even one instance of bullying or hazing.

The closest thing I can come up with was the tradition of shaving one's head for football at my high school, but nobody was punished or shamed for opting out.