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Go Cats but this could be a major thing in Florida in a day or two

Tell me about it..

My brother is on Siesta Key and right now they have a bull's eye on them. They're heading inland tomorrow.

They're still cleaning up from Helene.
 
Tell me about it..

My brother is on Siesta Key and right now they have a bull's eye on them. They're heading inland tomorrow.

They're still cleaning up from Helene.
Not good. I had family on Anna Maria until recently and they got hammered pretty hard there already.
 


Positive vibes to everyone in the Southeast.

In 11 years in Atlanta, my family hosted friends evacuating to escape hurricanes four different times. Hurricane season is no fun.
 
Places where building a home is a bad idea
1) Gulf Coast shore or Mid-Atlantic barrier islands
2) Pretty much any river floodplain
3) California coastal cliff
4) Central Street
Regarding #3, I live in Del Mar where the train tracks that are part of the SD-LA train corridor are endangered. It will only cost at least $2B to move around 5-10 miles of this bluff segment of train track inland. Bluff instability has disrupted freight and passenger train traffic for years and it’s only going to get worse up and down the route.
 
Yikes, that thing looks nasty. Thoughts, prayers, etc. to those in Florida.

We got hit by a Cat 2 (Beryl) in July, and it caused a lot of damage here 80 miles from the coast. I can only imagine the impact of a Cat 4 or 5 with a direct hit on Tampa. 😧
 
Regarding #3, I live in Del Mar where the train tracks that are part of the SD-LA train corridor are endangered. It will only cost at least $2B to move around 5-10 miles of this bluff segment of train track inland. Bluff instability has disrupted freight and passenger train traffic for years and it’s only going to get worse up and down the route.
That would be a much better investment than that knucklehead bullet train to nowhere.
 
That would be a much better investment than that knucklehead bullet train to nowhere.
I agree but the costs of moving the segment from Solana Beach/Del Mar inland is going to be brutal no matter what option is chosen. Costly tunneling will be involved and the communities and traffic circulation impacted by the construction will disrupting for years. Good chance the bluffs will collapse before the project is completed to move the tracks. Bluff erosion in the San Clemente area has already disrupted the line for weeks. The bullet train is a waste. I’m a rail fan but this bullet train project needs a quick demise. There are already huge cost overruns.
 
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Just got in my home after 18 month rebuild from Ian. Got flooded by Helene (minor). Now nervously watch this storm. I have more gray hair these days.

Whats the insurance situation down there?
I'm imagining you either "self-insure" (no insurance) or you pay hefty (ungodly?) premiums to not-so-reputable insurers who may not be there if you need them...

Or is the federal government carrying all of this?
 
I wish we had a "Cat 5" defense. That would be something.

Seriously, a hot Gulf is bad news for the entire Southeast. Suddenly, the Heartland doesn't seem so bad.
Rather than moving to North Carolina, I have stayed in Minnesota to wait for North Carolina to move here. Currently it's somewhere along I65 south of Chicago.
 
Whats the insurance situation down there?
I'm imagining you either "self-insure" (no insurance) or you pay hefty (ungodly?) premiums to not-so-reputable insurers who may not be there if you need them...

Or is the federal government carrying all of this?
Insurance is available, currently. However, with the continued storms, it is going to get harder and harder to find. Prices are up meaningfully. Not sure how anyone will continue to insure ground level homes close to the shore with water levels and floods/surge increasing. More and more people are on the coast, and more density means more losses during storm season. We happen to be elevated (stilted) so we are mostly worried about the winds. Self insurance works if you don't have a mortgage. A lot of people who live on the coast have been in these homes for a long time, are not wealthy and will struggle to rebuild and pay high insurance premiums.
 
There was an article in the NYT the other day about the regions that are likely to be hit by hurricanes, have major wildfires or floods and extreme heat are also a lot of the most popular places people are moving to.
 
There was an article in the NYT the other day about the regions that are likely to be hit by hurricanes, have major wildfires or floods and extreme heat are also a lot of the most popular places people are moving to.
"Stupid is as stupid does." Don' t need the NYT to tell us what we already know.
 
Insurance is available, currently. However, with the continued storms, it is going to get harder and harder to find. Prices are up meaningfully. Not sure how anyone will continue to insure ground level homes close to the shore with water levels and floods/surge increasing. More and more people are on the coast, and more density means more losses during storm season. We happen to be elevated (stilted) so we are mostly worried about the winds. Self insurance works if you don't have a mortgage. A lot of people who live on the coast have been in these homes for a long time, are not wealthy and will struggle to rebuild and pay high insurance premiums.
Thanks for that info.

I heard just today on Bloomberg that "all the major insurers have left Florida" and "the burden for all this damage is falling more and more on the federal government - in other words the American taxpayer."

To me, its similar to building homes on a flood plain for the Mississippi or the Missouri rivers. There are known financial risks and for many that beachfront home is just another investment - not really any different than buying a stock - except you can't live inside a stock.

Somehow I am much more sympathetic to the people who actually live in their home year round (or 6 months and a day) and aren't just owning property as a business venture.
 
"Stupid is as stupid does." Don' t need the NYT to tell us what we already know.
I think the changes in climate are making all local weather much more volatile.
Extended droughts can happen anywhere.
So can tornadoes.
So can torrential rains and floods.
So can gigantic hailstorms.
The insurers know this.

When you add energy to a closed system, it gets more volatile.
 
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Thanks for that info.

I heard just today on Bloomberg that "all the major insurers have left Florida" and "the burden for all this damage is falling more and more on the federal government - in other words the American taxpayer."

To me, its similar to building homes on a flood plain for the Mississippi or the Missouri rivers. There are known financial risks and for many that beachfront home is just another investment - not really any different than buying a stock - except you can't live inside a stock.

Somehow I am much more sympathetic to the people who actually live in their home year round (or 6 months and a day) and aren't just owning property as a business venture.
The Federal Government isn’t insuring these properties for free. The premiums are high and the coverage ( level of service) is deemed to be subpar. I don’t anyone that wants to take the Government policy but they have no choice.
 
Thanks for that info.

I heard just today on Bloomberg that "all the major insurers have left Florida" and "the burden for all this damage is falling more and more on the federal government - in other words the American taxpayer."

To me, its similar to building homes on a flood plain for the Mississippi or the Missouri rivers. There are known financial risks and for many that beachfront home is just another investment - not really any different than buying a stock - except you can't live inside a stock.

Somehow I am much more sympathetic to the people who actually live in their home year round (or 6 months and a day) and aren't just owning property as a business venture.
As somebody who until recently owned a portion of a property on one of Tampa’s barrier islands that just got crushed twice in two weeks, the New York Times doesn’t know what the **** it’s talking about. The insurance market in Florida is bad, but has remained in existence and functional as of three weeks ago.
 
The US government provides flood insurance through FEMA. I believe that is the only flood insurance available. FEMA is working its way out of preexisting coverages that it provided as insurer of last resort for older existing properties in flood prone areas. They publish flood zone maps and have restrictions on what they will insure for new building construction. This insurance program is intended to be self-funding although it is under financial pressure now due to the frequency of major flood events.

The US government does not provide homeowners insurance which includes wind coverage. As insurers have left this market several States have created insurance pools, including Florida and NC. These programs are also intended to be self-funding.
 
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FEMA offers flood insurance. Depending upon the program it can be cheap or expensive (grandfathered program = cheap). FEMA coverage is terrible in terms of what it pays for, and is limited to $250k. Excess flood coverage is available for a price (all things have a price). As stated above, Wind/Homeowners is private and expensive. As premiums go up, insurers and re-insurers will re-enter the market to make better profits. I view Florida a bit like California and other locations with mud slides, fires and related risk. We have increased density in all these locations so it is logical that insured losses will go up. But, premiums also go up and the number of people who buy insurance goes up. Warren Buffet has played this game over the years. Now, the poor folks in North Carolina who never in this world thought they would need flood insurance are in a tough spot - they will need as much outside help as they can get.
 
Just go.t word on my house Ormond Beach. No problems. Lost power for less than 12 hours. But I'm in Maine
Good to hear Jack. I knew you were on your way to Maine when you called from NC, but I was concerned about your house in Florida.
 
Got an old friend in Tampa suburb. Was told by her hotels that people are fleeing to are gouging the evacuees. That is sad and evil incarnate
Think you friend in hotel business has a masters in self preservation. I have a place in the Florida panhandle, did not raise the price a dime when the demand soared because if the lack of availability.
 
I wish we had a "Cat 5" defense. That would be something.

Seriously, a hot Gulf is bad news for the entire Southeast. Suddenly, the Heartland doesn't seem so bad.

Places like Iowa got hit hard with flooding and hail, and Ohio had a record no of tornadoes.

Mostly only smaller, regional insurers left in FL which have left many homeowners stuck with most of the cost of paying for a new roof, as they are only paying for minimal "repairs."
 
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