I’ve changed my mind...

villox

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Aug 19, 2008
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This is what I'm actually afraid of, since Trump has already bashed the post office and there are indications that there have been deliberate slowdowns of the mail system. Usually when Trump accuses people of doing things, it's because he himself is doing them.

Which is why we need vote by mail legislation at the national level.

I too intend to vote in person in November.
 

gocatsgo2003

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Mar 30, 2006
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It is abundantly important that every vote be counted, but let's be clear... 73,000 out of 33,000,000 is 0.22% of all mail-in votes. And that's not the percentage that were excluded due to fraud, inconsistencies, etc., but those that "arrived too late to be counted," which is eminently fixable.

States can simply extend the time by which mail-in ballots must be received to "count." There's no rule that says we must know a winner on election night and, in fact, we should all be resigned to the fact that we probably won't have certified results for weeks or months after November 3.

Let's also not forget who is ultimately in charge of the US Postal System and who could make real, meaningful steps to encourage an open, honest election via mail-in ballots but is instead choosing to take to Twitter to gaslight the entire concept of mail-in votes (while also voting via mail himself). That's probably the most glaring opportunity for malfeasance if people are being honest with themselves.
 
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AZCat

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May 29, 2001
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I have posted on this topic before. In AZ, hardly a blue state, 80% of the electorate votes by mail. I haven't been to a polling place in years. I wonder how Trump was able to carry the state of AZ in 2016 with 80% of the votes cast by mail?

This from the official AZ voting website.

"What are the advantages of voting by mail?

Voting by mail has many advantages: it is more cost-effective for your county to administer, offers voters more time to study the ballot and decide how they want to vote and more flexibility in when they cast their ballot. It is also an important alternative to in-person voting during the era of social distancing. You can join the 80% of Arizona voters who already receive their ballots in the mail to make the process as seamless as possible.

Voting by mail is one way to participate in early voting. The other way is through in-person early voting. Arizona law allows for early voting in every election, beginning 27 days before election day. This process helps accommodate voters with scheduling conflicts, disabilities, or other circumstances that might make it hard to participate on election day......The infrastructure of the voting by mail system is already well established in Arizona. Approximately 80% of Arizona voters chose to vote by mail.

It’s important to note that a voter’s identity is confirmed before their ballot is counted, whether it’s an early ballot or a ballot cast at the polls. When you vote by mail, your signature on the early ballot affidavit is compared to the signature on file with your voter registration record. Voters must sign this envelope in order for their ballot to be counted. County election staff receive professional training to verify the signature on the affidavit envelope matches the signature on the voters' registration record. This is done to ensure the integrity of the early voting process.

If the signature is a match, the ballot proceeds to the Citizens Boards who then prepare the unopened ballots for tabulation. The Citizens Boards are made up of two board members of different political party affiliations. They confirm that the County Recorder verified the voter’s signature and then they remove the ballot from the envelope, taking special care to ensure the privacy of the voters' ballot. The ballots are then transmitted to the tabulation room.

If the county is unable to verify the signature, the county will attempt to contact the voter. Voters have until 5:00 p.m. on the 5th business day after the primary or general election to confirm/correct their signature."

https://www.azcleanelections.gov/how-to-vote/early-voting/ballot-by-mail

It is easy, safe (the dotards Trump & Wickerturk are clueless, as usual, on this topic) & saves the state money by not needing as many polling places (& poll workers since only 20% of AZ voters use polling places).

Thank God it up to each state to run the Federal election as they see fit.

Remember it is OK for Trump, Pence & Barr to vote by mail, but NOT YOU!
 

Mr Wickerpark

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Dec 28, 2016
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I have posted on this topic before. In AZ, hardly a blue state, 80% of the electorate votes by mail. I haven't been to a polling place in years. I wonder how Trump was able to carry the state of AZ in 2016 with 80% of the votes cast by mail?

This from the official AZ voting website.

"What are the advantages of voting by mail?

Voting by mail has many advantages: it is more cost-effective for your county to administer, offers voters more time to study the ballot and decide how they want to vote and more flexibility in when they cast their ballot. It is also an important alternative to in-person voting during the era of social distancing. You can join the 80% of Arizona voters who already receive their ballots in the mail to make the process as seamless as possible.

Voting by mail is one way to participate in early voting. The other way is through in-person early voting. Arizona law allows for early voting in every election, beginning 27 days before election day. This process helps accommodate voters with scheduling conflicts, disabilities, or other circumstances that might make it hard to participate on election day......The infrastructure of the voting by mail system is already well established in Arizona. Approximately 80% of Arizona voters chose to vote by mail.

It’s important to note that a voter’s identity is confirmed before their ballot is counted, whether it’s an early ballot or a ballot cast at the polls. When you vote by mail, your signature on the early ballot affidavit is compared to the signature on file with your voter registration record. Voters must sign this envelope in order for their ballot to be counted. County election staff receive professional training to verify the signature on the affidavit envelope matches the signature on the voters' registration record. This is done to ensure the integrity of the early voting process.

If the signature is a match, the ballot proceeds to the Citizens Boards who then prepare the unopened ballots for tabulation. The Citizens Boards are made up of two board members of different political party affiliations. They confirm that the County Recorder verified the voter’s signature and then they remove the ballot from the envelope, taking special care to ensure the privacy of the voters' ballot. The ballots are then transmitted to the tabulation room.

If the county is unable to verify the signature, the county will attempt to contact the voter. Voters have until 5:00 p.m. on the 5th business day after the primary or general election to confirm/correct their signature."

https://www.azcleanelections.gov/how-to-vote/early-voting/ballot-by-mail

It is easy, safe (the dotards Trump & Wickerturk are clueless, as usual, on this topic) & saves the state money by not needing as many polling places (& poll workers since only 20% of AZ voters use polling places).

Thank God it up to each state to run the Federal election as they see fit.

Remember it is OK for Trump, Pence & Barr to vote by mail, but NOT YOU!
I dont think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting. Since you mentioned Pence and Trump voting by mail and acted like that was the same as these new methods, i suggest you become familiar with the process.
Whatever the case, who is complaining about this? Trump!
Doesnt that suggest that he will be the guilty party of voter suppression? Personally, Im surprised the dems are playing nice and not pushing back harder on all the suppression going on.
Trump will coast to victory and all the people I know in AZ are voting Trump. AZ will push him over the top again.
And lets face it, Biden better give someone the power of attorney to appeal for him since he will be in diapers by then.
 

DaCat

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Gold Member
May 29, 2001
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I dont think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting. Since you mentioned Pence and Trump voting by mail and acted like that was the same as these new methods, i suggest you become familiar with the process.
Whatever the case, who is complaining about this? Trump!
Doesnt that suggest that he will be the guilty party of voter suppression? Personally, Im surprised the dems are playing nice and not pushing back harder on all the suppression going on.
Trump will coast to victory and all the people I know in AZ are voting Trump. AZ will push him over the top again.
And lets face it, Biden better give someone the power of attorney to appeal for him since he will be in diapers by then.
It's sad that you repeat Trump's false talking points verbatim.
 

Mr Wickerpark

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Dec 28, 2016
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It's sad that you repeat Trump's false talking points verbatim.
Biden said Trump delaying the election was his biggest concern. Some way, he may do it. Thats how things start. He probably nedds RBG to keel over though.
 

phatcat

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Nov 5, 2001
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Vis a vis the presidential election, we should just conduct it in the dozen or less states that are competitive. I live in a one party state. The result is a foregone conclusion

/S
 

AZCat

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May 29, 2001
372
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I dont think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting.
I understand the difference completely - as far a fraud goes - ZERO difference!!

As usual, it is you who are clueless to the facts, & are just parroting Trump's UNFOUNDED accusations.

For your point to have any validity, you must explain how an absentee ballot, as compared to a vote-by-mail ballot, is less subject to this "fraud" you & Trump fear?

The US Mail is fine for your driver's liscence, passport, Social Security check, abesntee ballot, etc. but magically a vote-by-mail ballot is subject to fraud, but not an absentee ballot????? - Only in your weak, deluded mind.
 
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Mr Wickerpark

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Dec 28, 2016
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I understand the difference completely - as far a fraud goes - ZERO difference!!

As usual, it is you who are clueless to the facts, & are just parroting Trump's UNFOUNDED accusations.

For your point to have any validity, you must explain how an absentee ballot, as compared to a vote-by-mail ballot, is less subject to this "fraud" you & Trump fear?

The US Mail is fine for your driver's liscence, passport, Social Security check, abesntee ballot, etc. but magically a vote-by-mail ballot is subject to fraud, but not an absentee ballot????? - Only in your weak, deluded mind.
Disappointed that you would take a personal shot against me when my mind has nothing to do with the topic.
Nonetheless, there are clear differences that put an election at more risk. Not sure why we have to discuss this? For starters list that arent updated but more importantly for this election, I would say other things are more concerning.
Further, since we are 3 months away and the planning and preparation in some states havent been finalized, this could become a real nightmare.
 

AZCat

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May 29, 2001
372
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Disappointed that you would take a personal shot against me when my mind has nothing to do with the topic.
Nonetheless, there are clear differences that put an election at more risk. Not sure why we have to discuss this? For starters list that arent updated but more importantly for this election, I would say other things are more concerning.
Further, since we are 3 months away and the planning and preparation in some states havent been finalized, this could become a real nightmare.
Disappointed? The Dread Pirate Roberts sums it up nicely.
Such is the fate of Trolls.

I only questioned your mental acuity after you replied to my post with:

"I dont (sic) think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting."

I told you that I do know the difference between vote-by-mail (80% of AZ voters do it, including myself) & absentee voting & challenged you to explain the difference, which you didn't do.

What is the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting as it relates to Fraud & Rigging? You claim there is a difference but as yet have been unable or unwilling to explain the difference - just like your hero, Donald J. Trump.

The FACT is there is NO DIFFERENCE. You fill out the ballot - sign it - put it in an envelope (in AZ it is postage paid) & mail it or drop it off at a polling place. Thank goodness it is up to the states to determine how they conduct their portion of the Federal Election - not you or Trump!

It is obvious you didn't read the link in my very post on this thread, probably afraid that you might learn something new.

Here it is again for you to ignore. Keep in mind this AZ site was produced under a Republican Governor.

https://www.azcleanelections.gov/how-to-vote/early-voting/ballot-by-mail

"Voting by mail is a safe and secure process that's easy for you, the voter."

The western states have proven that vote-by-mail is efficient, safe, and actually saves the States money.

You little troll heart must be tingling with all of the attention I am giving you.

 
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Turk

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May 29, 2001
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The Corner of Purple and Diehard
Disappointed? The Dread Pirate Roberts sums it up nicely.

Such is the fate of Trolls.

I only questioned your mental acuity after you replied to my post with:

"I dont (sic) think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting."

I told you that I do know the difference between vote-by-mail (80% of AZ voters do it, including myself) & absentee voting & challenged you to explain the difference, which you didn't do.

What is the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting as it relates to Fraud & Rigging? You claim there is a difference but as yet have been unable or unwilling to explain the difference - just like your hero, Donald J. Trump.

The FACT is there is NO DIFFERENCE. You fill out the ballot - sign it - put it in an envelope (in AZ it is postage paid) & mail it or drop it off at a polling place. Thank goodness it is up to the states to determine how they conduct their portion of the Federal Election - not you or Trump!

It is obvious you didn't read the link in my very post on this thread, probably afraid that you might learn something new.

Here it is again for you to ignore. Keep in mind this AZ site was produced under a Republican Governor.

https://www.azcleanelections.gov/how-to-vote/early-voting/ballot-by-mail

"Voting by mail is a safe and secure process that's easy for you, the voter."

The western states have proven that vote-by-mail is efficient, safe, and actually saves the States money.

You little troll heart must be tingling with all of the attention I am giving you.

And that's why Wicker says you do not understand the difference because you say there is no difference. That's nuts!
From the foundation, the voting rolls are in sore need of updating. In a close election, this could prove significant, especially with mail in ballots when someone never requested an absentee. No doubt, with certainty, ballots will be delivered to addresses where the voter is simply not there anymore. You take this too lightly. Oftentimes, elections simply aren't challenged this way or the election simply isn't close enough. And in all cases, even the ones I won, politics was key. The determining body was key in each of the 7 Local and National elections I was the primary arguer and convinced the Federal authority. Even against "Top" attorneys. But top attorneys are useless if their clients are damn near stupid as hell and don't know or haven't safeguarded the process, preparation, method, etc.

Down here in Palm Beach, we have dumb asses in charge and some of them have little or no formal education that is considered specific to these things. I'm sure Palm Beach County isn't the only county in the US who has complete shit for brains handling precincts, etc. People who handle these elections historically do not know the processes like they ought to.

And the great difference between absentees and mail in, is that most of these states simply do not even have the preparation plans yet. I will agree with you that Trump is screaming foul over this moreso than he should, but it shows his vigilance in what he will do if he loses. One can't discard the fact that he also 'moreso' has the SCOTUS than Biden, or so it seems. He also has the DOJ in his hand now after 3 years. And he is the establishment and has access to things that Biden does not.Things like the USPS which will scale back intentionally. Only losers appeal. Either Trump or Biden will appeal. You don't think Biden will appeal the mail voting process? He hasn't said he won't.

An interesting case will be the new rules in Nevada which Trump said he will challenge this week. At minimum he will cause mass confusion and people will be wondering, "Should I mail it in or not if it's not going to count?" Not saying that is a valid question but when the attorney general doesn't refute grave possibilities and a sitting President points to challenging things, then I think you and others are taking this WAY TOO LIGHTLY. The constitution has implicit law which safeguards a fair election. One can't just use the explicit language that claims a President must be inserted on this date. All thoughout it implies a fair election and doesn't give any suggestion that fraud or unfair voting can be acceptable.

Look, Trump has literally bended immigration laws 180 degrees in ways that I never thought were legal. At the end of the day, 5 SCOTUS judges said Black, and 4 said white. And they read the same damn document. The law has fallen. It is now of private interpretation. I mean, it has been truly amazing how he got alot of what he wanted in banning mosl muslim immigrants.
 

Gladeskat

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Feb 17, 2004
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Disappointed? The Dread Pirate Roberts sums it up nicely.


It is obvious you didn't read the link in my very post on this thread, probably afraid that you might learn something new.

You little troll heart must be tingling with all of the attention I am giving you.

Learning and knowledge are evil things for Turk. He likes to promote flat-out ignorance by keeping things fake.

Yes, he's laughing in his puerile spitball way.
 
Last edited:

Turk

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Learning and knowledge are evil things for Turk. He likes to promote flat-out ignorance by keeping things fake.

Yes, he's laughing in his puerile spitball
Knowledge is a process. It has everything to do with hearing. And if you don't thnk Biden will appeal the mail in balloting, if he loses, then you are nuts. Just for volume sake, Trump has the power to limit the USPS or manipulate. Look, there are dozens of pitfalls in this and the preparation and administration of this is going to be a complete disaster even if it is legit on paper. Those who will be in charge will necessarily make big mistakes. And if you think that all of those in charge of the county elections are smart people then you are fooling yourself. Many undesireable areas have complete dumb asses handling things. I could probably pick and choose what precinct is going to F up the counting and process of the ballots. Trust me, it won't be that hard.

The difference is that most Presidents just roll with however it ends up.

Stick to pulling wings off of God's creatures Glades. That and drinking cheap beer. On that note, I'm walking over to the square grouper to have some IPA sweetwater 420 as all beer is only $3 a bottle on Mondays!

You should come down some time and crash at my place and see Jerry and Coral.
 

Gladeskat

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Feb 17, 2004
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Nah, the difference is Trump is outright projecting onto a process that has already been shown to be secure and accepted in RED states. Looks like he's setting up excuses for himself...just like he did in 2016.

Trump is mentally unfit for the presidency and needs to be removed from office.
 

Gladeskat

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Gold Member
Feb 17, 2004
46,256
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Knowledge is a process. It has everything to do with hearing. And if you don't thnk Biden will appeal the mail in balloting, if he loses, then you are nuts. Just for volume sake, Trump has the power to limit the USPS or manipulate. Look, there are dozens of pitfalls in this and the preparation and administration of this is going to be a complete disaster even if it is legit on paper. Those who will be in charge will necessarily make big mistakes. And if you think that all of those in charge of the county elections are smart people then you are fooling yourself. Many undesireable areas have complete dumb asses handling things. I could probably pick and choose what precinct is going to F up the counting and process of the ballots. Trust me, it won't be that hard.

The difference is that most Presidents just roll with however it ends up.

Stick to pulling wings off of God's creatures Glades. That and drinking cheap beer. On that note, I'm walking over to the square grouper to have some IPA sweetwater 420 as all beer is only $3 a bottle on Mondays!

You should come down some time and crash at my place and see Jerry and Coral.
I should! I could play with my new favorite toy for introverts, a Minelab Excaliber ii. Lots of "treasure" to be found after a storm. Any long fishing piers down there? I could pay for the trip off of the lead sinkers I'd find.
 

AZCat

Well-Known Member
May 29, 2001
372
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And that's why Wicker says you do not understand the difference because you say there is no difference. That's nuts!
From the foundation, the voting rolls are in sore need of updating. In a close election, this could prove significant, especially with mail in ballots when someone never requested an absentee. No doubt, with certainty, ballots will be delivered to addresses where the voter is simply not there anymore. You take this too lightly. ......BLAH, BLAH, BLAH.
Let me know when you have some actual facts instead of your uninformed opinion.


Trump must read your inane posts and even he knows you are full of it! But keep flailing away & displaying your IGNORANCE on the topic. It is most entertaining.
 
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willycat

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Jan 11, 2005
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I dont think you understand the difference between absentee voting and mail ballot voting. Since you mentioned Pence and Trump voting by mail and acted like that was the same as these new methods, i suggest you become familiar with the process.
Whatever the case, who is complaining about this? Trump!
Doesnt that suggest that he will be the guilty party of voter suppression? Personally, Im surprised the dems are playing nice and not pushing back harder on all the suppression going on.
Trump will coast to victory and all the people I know in AZ are voting Trump. AZ will push him over the top again.
And lets face it, Biden better give someone the power of attorney to appeal for him since he will be in diapers by then.
Turk your racist lies are getting very old and thinking the moderators should take a closer look at your rants, even if they might be your neighbors.
 

willycat

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Gold Member
Jan 11, 2005
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And that's why Wicker says you do not understand the difference because you say there is no difference. That's nuts!
From the foundation, the voting rolls are in sore need of updating. In a close election, this could prove significant, especially with mail in ballots when someone never requested an absentee. No doubt, with certainty, ballots will be delivered to addresses where the voter is simply not there anymore. You take this too lightly. Oftentimes, elections simply aren't challenged this way or the election simply isn't close enough. And in all cases, even the ones I won, politics was key. The determining body was key in each of the 7 Local and National elections I was the primary arguer and convinced the Federal authority. Even against "Top" attorneys. But top attorneys are useless if their clients are damn near stupid as hell and don't know or haven't safeguarded the process, preparation, method, etc.

Down here in Palm Beach, we have dumb asses in charge and some of them have little or no formal education that is considered specific to these things. I'm sure Palm Beach County isn't the only county in the US who has complete shit for brains handling precincts, etc. People who handle these elections historically do not know the processes like they ought to.

And the great difference between absentees and mail in, is that most of these states simply do not even have the preparation plans yet. I will agree with you that Trump is screaming foul over this moreso than he should, but it shows his vigilance in what he will do if he loses. One can't discard the fact that he also 'moreso' has the SCOTUS than Biden, or so it seems. He also has the DOJ in his hand now after 3 years. And he is the establishment and has access to things that Biden does not.Things like the USPS which will scale back intentionally. Only losers appeal. Either Trump or Biden will appeal. You don't think Biden will appeal the mail voting process? He hasn't said he won't.

An interesting case will be the new rules in Nevada which Trump said he will challenge this week. At minimum he will cause mass confusion and people will be wondering, "Should I mail it in or not if it's not going to count?" Not saying that is a valid question but when the attorney general doesn't refute grave possibilities and a sitting President points to challenging things, then I think you and others are taking this WAY TOO LIGHTLY. The constitution has implicit law which safeguards a fair election. One can't just use the explicit language that claims a President must be inserted on this date. All thoughout it implies a fair election and doesn't give any suggestion that fraud or unfair voting can be acceptable.

Look, Trump has literally bended immigration laws 180 degrees in ways that I never thought were legal. At the end of the day, 5 SCOTUS judges said Black, and 4 said white. And they read the same damn document. The law has fallen. It is now of private interpretation. I mean, it has been truly amazing how he got alot of what he wanted in banning mosl muslim immigrants.
Moderators, just more racist rants! Five said black and four said white. WTH!
 

willycat

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Gold Member
Jan 11, 2005
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Biden said Trump delaying the election was his biggest concern. Some way, he may do it. Thats how things start. He probably nedds RBG to keel over though.
Moderators, Turk/wicker has has used this , hope RBG dies over and over! Why is he being allowed to post as two separate accounts? Why?