NIL article

[phatcat]

A) the kids deserve the money
B) I feel hopeless for NU

Big Money Donors Have Stepped Out of the Shadows to Create ‘Chaotic’ NIL Market

Less than a year into the NIL Era, officials say the college sports landscape is dramatically shifting back into the booster-driven world that plagued it decades ago.

www.si.com

 

[FeralFelidae]

I would have played football for a free NU degree.

 

[IMC Cat]

This quote from the article stuck out to me:
“Everything now comes down to how willing are your boosters and how rich are your boosters. You’re pretty much f----- if you don’t have the booster bank.”

I think NU has plenty of mega-rich donors, the problem is we're not willing. Or they're not interested in sports and would much rather earmark their donations for anything else.

Blue blood schools paying 5-stars millions to attend won't sink NU, but the Minnesota's, Iowa's and Purdue's of the world paying 3 and 4-star recruits $50k each for simply enrolling there will absolutely crush NU in the years to come. Not to mention any over--acheiving underclassmen on NU's roster will be bought by schools with NIL banks.

 

[FeralFelidae]

This quote from the article stuck out to me:
“Everything now comes down to how willing are your boosters and how rich are your boosters. You’re pretty much f----- if you don’t have the booster bank.”

I think NU has plenty of mega-rich donors, the problem is we're not willing. Or they're not interested in sports and would much rather earmark their donations for anything else.

Blue blood schools paying 5-stars millions to attend won't sink NU, but the Minnesota's, Iowa's and Purdue's of the world paying 3 and 4-star recruits $50k each for simply enrolling there will absolutely crush NU in the years to come. Not to mention any over--acheiving underclassmen on NU's roster will be bought by schools with NIL banks.

Nope; I'd rather let it die.

 

[phatcat]

Even MAC programs have larger enrollments than us, although, apparently they are even less supportive than our alumni, given low attendance and worse facilities. One of the problems is that we will be awash in B1G money, but it cannot be used for NIL.

 

[FeralFelidae]

Even MAC programs have larger enrollments than us, although, apparently they are even less supportive than our alumni, given low attendance and worse facilities. One of the problems is that we will be awash in B1G money, but it cannot be used for NIL.

I already have a favorite professional team.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

I would have played football for a free NU degree.

If only you could play. 👍

 

[Eurocat]

 

[fcmchi]

Athletic commissioners realize NIL is a quagmire and are asking for help from the U.S. Congress in regulating it.

SEC, Pac-12 commissioners seek NIL help in D.C.

SEC commissioner Greg Sankey and Pac-12 commissioner George Kliavkoff met with U.S. senators on Thursday to ask for legislative help surrounding name, image and likeness policies.

www.espn.com

 

[Sheffielder]

I think we all agree that NIL makes most of us like college football less.

But I will also agree with anyone asking, "why are people thinking the answer here has to be to pay students less than they're worth?"

College football has never, EVER been pure as the white snow...going all the way back to Alonso Stagg asking the U of C administration to give his star player's dad a job so he wouldn't have to quit college to go back and work on the family farm (I may not have that story precisely right, but that's the gist of it).

Do we not agree this has been happening in the shadows the whole time, like our parents having sex? And now we're just revolted by it being so far out into the open?

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

I am not revolted at all nor do I like it any less. College colleges are getting nearly 8 figures a year, teams are building shrines. Some of the money absolutely should go to the labor. The term “student-athlete” was a joke 4 decades ago. Anyone that thinks the scholarship was adequate compensation for what value these players brought to the institution is sadly mistaken. Now the pendulum has swung in the opposite direction in favor the athletes not the institution. You have to wonder how long the institutions will continue to accept that. At some point it won’t be worth it to them to be the Washington Generals to the Globetrotters.

 

[AdamOnFirst]

I think we all agree that NIL makes most of us like college football less.

But I will also agree with anyone asking, "why are people thinking the answer here has to be to pay students less than they're worth?"

College football has never, EVER been pure as the white snow...going all the way back to Alonso Stagg asking the U of C administration to give his star player's dad a job so he wouldn't have to quit college to go back and work on the family farm (I may not have that story precisely right, but that's the gist of it).

Do we not agree this has been happening in the shadows the whole time, like our parents having sex? And now we're just revolted by it being so far out into the open?

What an apt, if gross, metaphor.

 

[phatcat]

I think we all agree that NIL makes most of us like college football less.

But I will also agree with anyone asking, "why are people thinking the answer here has to be to pay students less than they're worth?"

College football has never, EVER been pure as the white snow...going all the way back to Alonso Stagg asking the U of C administration to give his star player's dad a job so he wouldn't have to quit college to go back and work on the family farm (I may not have that story precisely right, but that's the gist of it).

Do we not agree this has been happening in the shadows the whole time, like our parents having sex? And now we're just revolted by it being so far out into the open?

The deep-pocket schools are doing a way better job of screwing us than my parents ever did, and they had 6 kids

 

[LincolnParkCY]

Nope; I'd rather let it die.

Seems rather extreme.

These athletes help bring in millions, while also financing opportunities for other athletes. They are major economic activities in most communities. And we want to throw it all away because we no longer can shoehorn big business into an antiquated amateurism model?

Residential higher education is increasingly a competitive luxury good. High major college athletics a primary way for many to differentiate their product, lure students on campus, and charge more.

Let’s keep what is best about the collegial model- the player’s association with school, and let go of the notion it was about illiquid compensation. Get employment and CBA so they can be compensated to standards typical students are not

 

[FeralFelidae]

Residential higher education is increasingly a competitive luxury good. High major college athletics a primary way for many to differentiate their product, lure students on campus, and charge more.

It's a luxury good? I've been told by members of this board that an athletic scholarship is something of no value, that it's worthless. But it's also a luxury good? I am confused.

To charge more? That's a good thing? Tuition prices are insane. The middle class are expected to take on increasingly more debt in pursuit of higher education, while athletes who choose their school based on NIL payments take a "worthless" athletic scholarship so that a supposed institution of learning can differentiate themselves via athletic performance so that they can continue to charge more for those who actually want to pursue an education.

There are plans afoot to forgive student loans. It makes me sick that the taxpayer is being asked to bail out ridiculous tuition payments for something so worthless.

 

[LincolnParkCY]

It's a luxury good? I've been told by members of this board that an athletic scholarship is something of no value, that it's worthless. But it's also a luxury good? I am confused.

To charge more? That's a good thing? Tuition prices are insane. The middle class are expected to take on increasingly more debt in pursuit of higher education, while athletes who choose their school based on NIL payments take a "worthless" athletic scholarship so that a supposed institution of learning can differentiate themselves via athletic performance so that they can continue to charge more for those who actually want to pursue an education.

There are plans afoot to forgive student loans. It makes me sick that the taxpayer is being asked to bail out ridiculous tuition payments for something so worthless.

You’ll have to explain the contradiction to me and show me where it’s been claimed worthless. Are you sure it wasn’t contended it was insufficient rather than worthless

Players are part of what makes it a luxury good. They add value to the campus and university compared to those that don’t have high major athletics. That’s why we care that they transfer and can be bought away, where no such restrictions are desired for regular students on scholarship. We have an entire industry, recruiting, that is dedicated to minute differences in these players. We have message boards in which we talk about POTENTIAL students.

Confining a big business to amateurism doesn’t keep costs down. It results in expensive arms race spending as we use buildings as a proxy for paying players. It prevents things like CBA that can prevent fear spending and escalation. Haven’t you noticed how much more ADs are spending on the same sports?

You seem more envious than logical on this.

 

[FeralFelidae]

You’ll have to explain the contradiction to me and show me where it’s been claimed worthless. Are you sure it wasn’t contended it was insufficient rather than worthless

Players are part of what makes it a luxury good. They add value to the campus and university compared to those that don’t have high major athletics. That’s why we care that they transfer and can be bought away, where no such restrictions are desired for regular students on scholarship. We have an entire industry, recruiting, that is dedicated to minute differences in these players. We have message boards in which we talk about POTENTIAL students.

Confining a big business to amateurism doesn’t keep costs down. It results in expensive arms race spending as we use buildings as a proxy for paying players. It prevents things like CBA that can prevent fear spending and escalation. Haven’t you noticed how much more ADs are spending on the same sports?

You seem more envious than logical on this.

You'll either have to believe me or not about people on this board calling athletic scholarships worthless. I'm not going to dig through months and months of posts to do your homework for you. CatManTrue and willycat were two offenders; you can ask them.

I watched amateur athletics because they were amateurs, students playing to earn their degrees. Now that they are hired guns playing for cash, that appeal is gone. I already have a favorite pro team.

 

[StreamCat]

You'll either have to believe me or not about people on this board calling athletic scholarships worthless. I'm not going to dig through months and months of posts to do your homework for you. CatManTrue and willycat were two offenders; you can ask them.

I watched amateur athletics because they were amateurs, students playing to earn their degrees. Now that they are hired guns playing for cash, that appeal is gone. I already have a favorite pro team.

The only thing that will keep me going to games is the fun of friends and family communing at tailgate parties. If the Cats win, fine. If they lose, also fine. It won’t take much to price me out of going. We can tailgate on my deck.

 

[phatcat]

You'll either have to believe me or not about people on this board calling athletic scholarships worthless. I'm not going to dig through months and months of posts to do your homework for you. CatManTrue and willycat were two offenders; you can ask them.

I watched amateur athletics because they were amateurs, students playing to earn their degrees. Now that they are hired guns playing for cash, that appeal is gone. I already have a favorite pro team.

I will help you, and you don't have to search. An athletic scholarship to a FB/MBB player is worthless, particularly at a state school but also at NU, to a different (not lesser) extent.

My reasoning and assumptions:

- Let's start with a typical, Midwestern state school, and let's say the cost of attending is 30k a year. Choices: a) break your body and end up with CTE, working year-round, often over holidays, away from family, and you have about a 5% chance of getting an NFL tryout. Make no mistake, with summer practices, training, etc, these are full-time jobs. OR: b) get a job at like Home Depot on nights, weekends and summer, make around the same amount of money and don't kill yourself for dear ole alma mater.
- But what about the kids that couldn't get into the school but for athletics? WHAT? People cheat and let in non-students just to play football? /s If so, why are they there except for our (paid) entertainment?
-But -even with the Home Depot job, I cannot keep up with expenses, it's still too much! OK, go to a local school and live at home. or go to Juco for 2 years and transfer.
- But - NU is way more expensive! Except, it's not. Unless the aid policies have changed radically since I was part of the Alumni Recruiting group, NU remains need-blind when admitting student. So, let's say a poor kid is in the lowest percentile of ability to get into NU (low grades, scores, extra-curricular, lesser-known high school.) Last person on the wait-list to get in. They get aid based on need, not ability. So, I am going to go with the assumption that this poor family's EFC (expected family contribution) is similar to the cost of going to a state school - i.e., it's NOT the 70k scholarship that Fitz purports it to be, it's a 35k scholarship if you take away the aid that the kid would have gotten anyway. Also, if you can't afford it, go somewhere else?
But - there are exceptions - certain kids can't go to juco or live at home. Certain EFC's are just too much, more than the Home Depot job pays. And so on. Fine, make exceptions for the 10% of exceptions.
But - they pay for non-revenue athletes! Why? Why do revenue athletes have to have these tin cans tied to their tails? That's even more burden on them. Further, why favor hundreds of revenue and non-revenue athletes over non-athletes, in terms of cost of attendance?


I'm an economist, not a scientist. This type of economic model doesn't exist anywhere else except horse racing. The value adders' compensation is structurally restricted to a faux-value scholarship, whereas fatcats (not phatcat) make millions.

My proposal would be to abolish the worthless athletic scholarship, which skews the economics. Develop a pay structure for the athletes, NIL or otherwise, and let admissions/financial aid figure out the rest, like any other student. It isn't as if non-scholarship schools such as D3 don't have coaches that favor athletes for admissions. A school can do that if they want, although some here would say that NU would never, ever (ever) do this, particularly for Bball.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

You'll either have to believe me or not about people on this board calling athletic scholarships worthless. I'm not going to dig through months and months of posts to do your homework for you. CatManTrue and willycat were two offenders; you can ask them.

I watched amateur athletics because they were amateurs, students playing to earn their degrees. Now that they are hired guns playing for cash, that appeal is gone. I already have a favorite pro team.

Worthless is in the eye of the beholder. For some that never graduate or never actually learn life skills, worthless is close to reasonable. For some, like Sam Gerak a scholarship is absolutely a tremendous value.

If you don’t see that there has been exploitation of some athletes going on for years you either have never been close to a D1 program or you aren’t paying attention. I wish D1 revenue college athletics was like your idealistic view, but if you have been watching P5 football for the last half century you haven’t been watching students playing to earn their degrees. If you want to live in that world, you might want to watch the Wrestling team or the LaCrosse team.

 

[mkilla]

It appears that NIL wasn't the doomsday scenario that was predicted unless Pat Ryan backed up the Brink's truck onto campus during the OV weekend.

 

[phatcat]

It appears that NIL wasn't the doomsday scenario that was predicted unless Pat Ryan backed up the Brink's truck onto campus during the OV weekend.

Serious question - did I miss anything about where any of the recent commits were given NIL deals?

I would love to be wrong, and, as I've said elsewhere, I would eat a murder of crows to be wrong. But I doubt it. I am relieved by the recruiting success, but I don't see us sustaining any momentum unless someone, somewhere, puts together a competitive NU NIL program to attract and KEEP (see portal) good players. It doesn't have to be aTm, but it needs to be reasonable. It can't be nothing*. Look at it this way. Let's say one of our shiny, new recruits tears it up in his first year on the field and becomes a Frosh All American. But - we keep losing. Is it within the realm of possibility that he might transfer to a successful program with an NIL program? Or, on a more basic level, if you were one of these kids that committed, but then later got an aTm offer that included $100k NIL money, would you keep the commitment?

*unless the world changes, the schools, the NCAA and the courts agree on some sort of competitively balanced player compensation plan.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

It appears that NIL wasn't the doomsday scenario that was predicted unless Pat Ryan backed up the Brink's truck onto campus during the OV weekend.

Big NIL money seems to be for the very elite recruits. We are never in on them anyways.

 

[AdamOnFirst]

It appears that NIL wasn't the doomsday scenario that was predicted unless Pat Ryan backed up the Brink's truck onto campus during the OV weekend.

I agree this is worth watching, at least so far. We'll see what happens with guys like Jenkins, AA, etc. The NIL/Transfer interplay thing also lurks. But it's a good sign.

Of course, maybe a really coordinated NIL group that is somehow keeping things super quiet just happened to visit with kids during their OVs and shoe them all the opportunities in Chicago. We'll see.

 

[FeralFelidae]

Of course, maybe a really coordinated NIL group that is somehow keeping things super quiet just happened to visit with kids during their OVs and shoe them all the opportunities in Chicago. We'll see.

I thought one of the "good" things about NIL is that it's all "out in the open" now?