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We have no answer for big guys under the basket

charcat

Well-Known Member
Apr 11, 2006
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Limited rebounds mean you have to shoot 50%+ to keep up. Early in the game Michigan was cold, but got 3 rebound in a row. Makes up for lousy shooting. Boxing out guys was not happening
 
Limited rebounds mean you have to shoot 50%+ to keep up. Early in the game Michigan was cold, but got 3 rebound in a row. Makes up for lousy shooting. Boxing out guys was not happening
The frustrating thing is everyone keeps talking about how tall we are. Also, when Collins first took over, this team did box out hard and rebounded fairly well despite not being very big. It was one thing that got me excited about CCC after years of watching Carmody teams concede every rebound. The fact that this current team is getting so badly outrebounded is really concerning.
 
We are taller, but we are less athletic than most teams. That plays a big role in why we lose rebounds. Our guys need to be concentrated on moving to boxing out quickly as a fraction of a second will allow a faster player to avoid it altogether.
 
Every one of our players needs to spend hours every day in the weight room this offseason. Part of the reason we don't get any calls is we don't have the bulk that other teams have, so we make contact without moving the opponent off the ball, and our opponents push us aside with ease when it comes to rebounding.
 
We are taller, but we are less athletic than most teams. That plays a big role in why we lose rebounds. Our guys need to be concentrated on moving to boxing out quickly as a fraction of a second will allow a faster player to avoid it altogether.
Think it's time to admit that Young is not a Div. I center. Give Jones more of his minutes and also play Nance at the 5, keeping him away from attempting to shoot 3's. I also can't understand why every offense set starts with our center up at the top of the 3 point line. The big man needs to be down low and someone like Beran up top.
 
Think it's time to admit that Young is not a Div. I center.

He is a freshman with a ton of fight in him. Going against a conference having the best crop of big man I can remember: Garza, Oturu, Wesson, Peske, Cockburn, Smith... Leave the kid alone. For a freshman he chooses his spots pretty well. When you are limited physically, like he is, timing is everything. You develop go to moves, you make a difference when the opportunity is there.

every offense set starts with our center up at the top of the 3 point line.

"Modern" motion offense. Pardon was forced to do the same. Oturu is doing the same in Minnesota and he is one of the best bigs in the country. Set picks, dribble hand offs, work for the guards to get lanes open to penetrate.

Works for Villanova for example, positionless basketball some call it. For us and our guards it often just ends up with the defender of the big guy floating inside quite far from him. For Minny for example, seems like a huge waste of drawing double teams down low on Oturu.

For me it often seems like forcing your roster to your idea of what offense should look like. If that's the case, you better recruit for the offense. If not, seems much more adequate to adjust your offense to the strengths you have.
 
He is a freshman with a ton of fight in him. Going against a conference having the best crop of big man I can remember: Garza, Oturu, Wesson, Peske, Cockburn, Smith... Leave the kid alone. For a freshman he chooses his spots pretty well. When you are limited physically, like he is, timing is everything. You develop go to moves, you make a difference when the opportunity is there.



"Modern" motion offense. Pardon was forced to do the same. Oturu is doing the same in Minnesota and he is one of the best bigs in the country. Set picks, dribble hand offs, work for the guards to get lanes open to penetrate.

Works for Villanova for example, positionless basketball some call it. For us and our guards it often just ends up with the defender of the big guy floating inside quite far from him. For Minny for example, seems like a huge waste of drawing double teams down low on Oturu.

For me it often seems like forcing your roster to your idea of what offense should look like. If that's the case, you better recruit for the offense. If not, seems much more adequate to adjust your offense to the strengths you have.
Ok but Jones does not look limited physically. I know I see a lot of teams centers start out up high but it seems like they release quicker and get down low.
 
What I see a lot of is an opponent guard type charging in to get the rebound in a lot of open space while we box out their bigs and watch the ball.

It kills me how consistently our guys are standing around watching the ball come to them while our opponents are charging, leaping, grabbing for it instead.

Young might benefit from whatever training increases verticals though. He tends to have decent positions but his opponents just go over him.
 
Ok but Jones does not look limited physically. I know I see a lot of teams centers start out up high but it seems like they release quicker and get down low.

Per 40 stats (pts/trb/ast/stl/blk/to/pf):
-13.8/9.6/2.3/0.9/0.5/2.1/3.4
-11.7/8.1/0.5/0.9/1.2/2.1/9.1

Jones had two good games. We are all salivating. And he should see his minutes increase. Even playing at the same time as Young. But do you see that last number?

Next year he might be a starter. Who knows
 
Per 40 stats (pts/trb/ast/stl/blk/to/pf):
-13.8/9.6/2.3/0.9/0.5/2.1/3.4
-11.7/8.1/0.5/0.9/1.2/2.1/9.1

Jones had two good games. We are all salivating. And he should see his minutes increase. Even playing at the same time as Young. But do you see that last number?

Next year he might be a starter. Who knows
Yes I see it and he obviously needs to cut down on his fouling but I also noticed the trb. number. Just thinking he has a lot more upside then Young.
 
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Yes I see it and he obviously needs to cut down on his fouling but I also noticed the trb. number. Just thinking he has a lot more upside then Young.
I like Jones a lot, but Young has done very well relative to Jones so far, and it's not just the foul issue. For the season Young is averaging 9.5 rebounds per 40 minutes versus 8 for Jones, and Young has an assist to TO ratio over 1.1, while Jones's is 0.25. I think the upside for Jones is better, but I think Young will be a valuable player for us for the next 3 years - he belongs.
 
I like Jones a lot, but Young has done very well relative to Jones so far, and it's not just the foul issue. For the season Young is averaging 9.5 rebounds per 40 minutes versus 8 for Jones, and Young has an assist to TO ratio over 1.1, while Jones's is 0.25. I think the upside for Jones is better, but I think Young will be a valuable player for us for the next 3 years - he belongs.
In addition, while Jones has had good offensive moments the last two games, he's also a combined -33 in those games. Defensively we are getting absolutely roasted when he is on the court. Young is +9 over the last two games and to be honest, I'm not sure why he didn't get more than 15 minutes last night.
 
Ok but Jones does not look limited physically. I know I see a lot of teams centers start out up high but it seems like they release quicker and get down low.

maybe - but jones also got pushed underneath the basket and dunked on by davis.

and young had 8 boards in 16 minutes and jones had 4 rebounds in 19 minutes
 
Per 40 stats (pts/trb/ast/stl/blk/to/pf):
-13.8/9.6/2.3/0.9/0.5/2.1/3.4
-11.7/8.1/0.5/0.9/1.2/2.1/9.1

Jones had two good games. We are all salivating. And he should see his minutes increase. Even playing at the same time as Young. But do you see that last number?

Next year he might be a starter. Who knows

did the same for Beran and Boo. and they have fizzled.
 
If you are advocating for Jones to play more fine. However, the ripping on Young who is in his first year is just becoming obnoxious.
I don't understand. How is saying that I and I'm sure others think that Jones will be a better player than Young. ripping?
 
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