2017 grad transfer options

[FeliSilvestris]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems we still have a scholarship available for the 2017 year, Right? (unless Vassar is still counting somehow). Is so, it seems the remaining options are very limited.

Some of the still uncommitted grad transfers that may be worth keeping an eye on are:

Gonzaga guard Bryan Alberts who appears to be down to 3: Long Beach St, VCU, & Weber State, and seems to have 2 years of eligibility which may actually be bad for NU.

NMSU 6-5 G Jalyn Penny had a decent RS SO season (averaging 6.4 points, 4.1 rebounds and 27 minutes per game) but didn't do as well this past season. In 3 seasons he did win 2 WAC titles and made the NCAAT twice.

Dartmouth Center Cole Harrison has serious size at 6' 11", 245 lbs, but it is unclear that he can help a B1G team outside practices. He hasn't played much there.

It seems that Alberts may be the least weak remaining alternative, but his wanting 2 years could be a deal breaker.

Anybody else?

 

[seavue617]

Let's just use the ride for a 2018. Lots more talent there.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

Let's just use the ride for a 2018. Lots more talent there.

How would a ONE-YEAR grad transfer affect the availability of 2018 scholarships? If one comes for the 2017-18 year, his scholarship would be released for the 2018-19 class and beyond.
If he wants a second year that'd be different.

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

Correct me if I am wrong, but it seems we still have a scholarship available for the 2017 year, Right? (unless Vassar is still counting somehow). Is so, it seems the remaining options are very limited.

Some of the still uncommitted grad transfers that may be worth keeping an eye on are:

Gonzaga guard Bryan Alberts who appears to be down to 3: Long Beach St, VCU, & Weber State, and seems to have 2 years of eligibility which may actually be bad for NU.

NMSU 6-5 G Jalyn Penny had a decent RS SO season (averaging 6.4 points, 4.1 rebounds and 27 minutes per game) but didn't do as well this past season. In 3 seasons he did win 2 WAC titles and made the NCAAT twice.

Dartmouth Center Cole Harrison has serious size at 6' 11", 245 lbs, but it is unclear that he can help a B1G team outside practices. He hasn't played much there.

It seems that Alberts may be the least weak remaining alternative, but his wanting 2 years could be a deal breaker.

Anybody else?

I'm certain CC is feverishly looking into your recommendations right now!

 

[FeliSilvestris]

I'm certain CC is feverishly looking into your recommendations right now!

My recommendation is NOT to waste a 1-year scholarship if at all possible... that is, within reason, to strive to field a 13-player team this coming season...it seems a one-year grad transfer would be ideal for this purpose, since it would preserve all flexibility for 2018 and beyond. Unfortunately the remaining options seem limited (especially if one takes Alberts off the list).

Perhaps you know of other interesting possibilities...if you do, please, go ahead and list them...It's an honest suggestion...You may know something I don't.

EDIT: Actually, considering that one "normal" transfer will be sitting out, without a grad transfer, there would be only 11 scholarship players available to play...that may be OK if there are no significant injuries...but that is a humongous IF, especially when we are talking about NU BkB.

 

[YesterdaysCat]

I'm certain CC is feverishly looking into your recommendations right now!

Well, don't you agree with him that we should be trying to get a legit D-I body for 2017-18, even for practice? People say Kreisberg didn't work out, but for all we know, he was important in practice and as a teammate. The last guy on the bench can have some impact. It would be a shame if we didn't try to bring in somebody. It's not like we can't afford it.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Well, don't you agree with him that we should be trying to get a legit D-I body for 2017-18, even for practice? People say Kreisberg didn't work out, but for all we know, he was important in practice and as a teammate. The last guy on the bench can have some impact. It would be a shame if we didn't try to bring in somebody. It's not like we can't afford it.

Because none of the top grad transfers left are likely to pick a place to be a "practice body."

 

[YesterdaysCat]

Because none of the top grad transfers left are likely to pick a place to be a "practice body."

I don't think that there are any "top grad transfers" left at this point anyway. You're looking at "grad transfers left" (minus the "top").

 

[gocatsgo2003]

I don't think that there are any "top grad transfers" left at this point anyway. You're looking at "grad transfers left" (minus the "top").

The tallest midget is still the tallest. The top guys remaining will likely still have options to go places where they can play significant minutes, not eat an otherwise-empty scholarship at the end of NU's bench.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

Dartmouth Center Cole Harrison has serious size at 6' 11", 245 lbs, but it is unclear that he can help a B1G team outside practices. He hasn't played much there

FWIW, out oh HS Harrison did get a bunch of D1 offers...Obviously none from major conferences...but still...probably means little or nothing...nonetheless here is a link:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...an-center-cole-harrison-commits-to-dartmouth/

 

[YesterdaysCat]

The tallest midget is still the tallest. The top guys remaining will likely still have options to go places where they can play significant minutes, not eat an otherwise-empty scholarship at the end of NU's bench.

There are fewer than 20 guys left who are eligible immediately and would only need a slot for 2017-18. More than a few of them would be lucky to get a few minutes of time anywhere. Maybe it's more of a question of whether or not we should bother with them. I would still say yeah if they qualify, etc. Unless our walk-ons are way better. Judging by some of the 20 guys' resumes, maybe so.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

The tallest midget is still the tallest. The top guys remaining will likely still have options to go places where they can play significant minutes, not eat an otherwise-empty scholarship at the end of NU's bench.

You may be assuming too much...spending a season in the B1G could be attractive to some, if it comes to that...and they are mature enough to know injuries do happen, and once they strike a lot of plans change...as it is a BkK team is relatively thin just by the nature of the sport...it may only take a single injury for a 'practice' player to become The only back up...I have no idea what they are looking for...but they won't have a lot of choices this late.

 

[YesterdaysCat]

FWIW, out oh HS Harrison did get a bunch of D1 offers...Obviously none from major conferences...but still...probably means little or nothing...nonetheless here is a link:
https://www.washingtonpost.com/news...an-center-cole-harrison-commits-to-dartmouth/

His numbers are way worse then Jeremiah Kreisberg's were at Yale and Harrison missed all of last year to boot. You'd think a 6-11 body is worth a one-year slot except when healthy he struggled to get 3-5 MPG in the Ivy League. What does that suggest?

 

[FeliSilvestris]

His numbers are way worse then Jeremiah Kreisberg's were at Yale and Harrison missed all of last year to boot. You'd think a 6-11 body is worth a one-year slot except when healthy he struggled to get 3-5 MPG in the Ivy League. What does that suggest?

See my comments in the OP. That we are discussing him is telling of the situation in which we have found ourselves. That said, out of HS he looked like a decent 6-10 C project, which is why he got 13 D1 offers (none from major conferences)... See below a HS recruiting video, which shows decent skills for a big man, at that stage...perhaps he hasn't developed much since...who knows...if you find other interesting 2017 candidates please post.

 

[IdahoAlum]

I'd guess NU is out of the market at this point.

 

[rwhitney014]

See my comments in the OP. That we are discussing him is telling of the situation in which we have found ourselves. That said, out of HS he looked like a decent 6-10 C project, which is why he got 13 D1 offers (none from major conferences)... See below a HS recruiting video, which shows decent skills for a big man, at that stage...perhaps he hasn't developed much since...who knows...if you find other interesting 2017 candidates please post.

View embedded media

That you started a thread on a message board continuing on months of listing grad transfers in an offseason where the program has taken in a transfer already is not indicative of any situation in which Northwestern basketball finds itself. You raised a point and now are holding its raising as evidence of the postulation you wish to prove. Objection, your honor.

This is perhaps the deepest roster the program will have ever had. Injuries can happen. Every basketball team in the country is limited by the number of scholarships it has. This staff has aggressively courted grad transfers before. They have either failed this time around to land one they wanted or they decided that none of the options fit an assessed need. Anyone can have their opinions on which of those is true and what they qualitatively mean.

However, these intimations that something is wrong, that the staff is negligent in their plans on how to fix it and that we the fans need to sound an alarm is just old and tired.

 

[ColumbusCatFan1]

You may be assuming too much...spending a season in the B1G could be attractive to some, if it comes to that...

Another aspect to consider is the transfer rule itself.

Any eligible student athlete needs to pursue a graduate degree in a subject not offered at their current institution. If a player knows they will just be a "practice body", the scholarship takes on even more importance. NU, as outstanding of an institution as it is, may not have what the student athlete is looking for.

At that point, is warming the bench on a tournament caliber team (assuming the staff is interested) worth pursing a degree the prospective student athlete may not be interested in?

 

[FeliSilvestris]

This is perhaps the deepest roster the program will have ever had. Injuries can happen. Every basketball team in the country is limited by the number of scholarships it has. This staff has aggressively courted grad transfers before. They have either failed this time around to land one they wanted or they decided that none of the options fit an assessed need. Anyone can have their opinions on which of those is true and what they qualitatively mean.

The fact is there is a scholarship that can be given out to a qualifying grad transfer for the upcoming season (without affecting future seasons). Keeping the scholarship open for a year helps nothing at all. It seems there are still POTENTIAL grad transfers out there who conceivably could help the team (more than just leaving the spot open). 11 players to cover 5 playing positions might be OK IF there are no major injuries...huge IF this early...that's the issue.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

I'd guess NU is out of the market at this point.

You are entitled to your guess...then again, for as long as potential grad transfers remain uncommitted the potential exists for a match.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

You are entitled to your guess...then again, for as long as potential grad transfers remain uncommitted the potential exists for a match.

...and for you to get up on your soap box and proselytize about a topic on which you are no more an expert than anyone else on these boards.

 

[rwhitney014]

The fact is there is a scholarship that can be given out to a qualifying grad transfer for the upcoming season (without affecting future seasons). Keeping the scholarship open for a year helps nothing at all. It seems there are still POTENTIAL grad transfers out there who conceivably could help the team (more than just leaving the spot open). 11 players to cover 5 playing positions might be OK IF there are no major injuries...huge IF this early...that's the issue.

Let's draw a cross-sport comparison: In baseball, the WAR stat attempts to quantify a player's value over a normalized replacement player. WAR can be positive and it can be negative. Sometimes the nothing option is better. So, to repeat: if the coaches have not filled that open slot, it's because they missed on guys they wanted or they didn't deem the available players to be worth

That said, the fact is, you're arguing about a guy who played 51 games over 3 seasons for a bottom-half Ivy League program. In those 51 games, he played 280 total minutes - under 6 per game. He averaged 1.4 points, 1.4 rebounds, and more turnovers than steals and assists combined. His head coach had this to say:

“Cole only got in for two minutes today and unfortunately for him, we need something to happen in those two minutes,” Cormier said. “It’s not fair, but we can’t waste possessions getting him time, because that can cost us games. He’s got to show us in practice. If this was the end of the season, we’d be trying to get him some more experience, but I’m not into that right now. We’re into winning games.”

Source: http://www.vnews.com/Archives/2015/12/DartmouthHoop-ctw-vn-010116

And that was before a season-ending injury kept him out all of last season. This is the player you're fighting over.

Man, there are problems to solve all around this world. This ain't one. Go pick another.

 

[willycat]

...and for you to get up on your soap box and proselytize about a topic on which you are no more an expert than anyone else on these boards.

It's really not someone getting up on soap box but someone suggesting that having 12 potential players available rather then 11 is definitely worth discussing. Unless you would rather get on your soapbox and add nothing.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

It's really not someone getting up on soap box but someone suggesting that having 12 potential players available rather then 11 is definitely worth discussing. Unless you would rather get on your soapbox and add nothing.

Cute that you've got your buddy's back.

 

[willycat]

Cute that you've got your buddy's back.

really you should just go back where your arrogant outbursts are somewhat tolerated because you obviously no very little about basketball and recruiting.

 

[rwhitney014]

It's really not someone getting up on soap box but someone suggesting that having 12 potential players available rather then 11 is definitely worth discussing. Unless you would rather get on your soapbox and add nothing.

We have 13 players available and a 14th sitting out for a transfer year.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

really you should just go back where your arrogant outbursts are somewhat tolerated because you obviously no very little about basketball and recruiting.

...says the guy who insists that I shut up if I have nothing substantative to say...

PS -- no/know.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

We have 13 players available and a 14th sitting out for a transfer year.

You should do your counting again. If you are counting walkons, we are talking about scholarship players. Other teams have walkons too, so they aren't an advantage over the competition.
Walkons can be a nice surprise. Who could possibly forget Reggie Hearn (a sure inductee into the Walk-On Hall of Fame)? But with hundreds of D1 programs able to offer scholarships, the odds of a walkon becoming a solid contributor are extremely low. Case in point, the Dartmouth center mentioned in the OP had 13 D1 offers, and had difficulty getting playing time in the Ivy league ... for perspective, compare his case to someone who had ZERO D1 offers....a sobering thought.

 

[willycat]

We have 13 players available and a 14th sitting out for a transfer year.

Sorry but thought we were talking schlorship players. Also that transfer in guy counts towards the 13 allowable rides.

 

[willycat]

...says the guy who insists that I shut up if I have nothing substantive to say...

PS -- no/know.

Actually I was just noting your deep knowledge on the football board. When I write my next thesis, I'll keep in mind, no/know.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Actually I was just noting your deep knowledge on the football board. When I write my next thesis, I'll keep in mind, no/know.

So now it was a backhanded compliment? Solid backpedal. Also didn't realize basic grammar was restricted only to theses.

 

[Walker Fan]

Newsflash: Chris Collins and his staff knows talent and will make the best choice for the deepest roster in NU's bball history for the all important 13th scholarship opening.

I think FS is 0 for 100 in his predictions of who should be given scholarships. Let's make it 0 for 101. Should not be shocker to anyone.

 

[willycat]

So now it was a backhanded compliment? Solid backpedal. Also didn't realize basic grammar was restricted only to theses.

Ah, true to form. In case you haven't noticed there are more then a few posters that are taken aback by your caustic responses, as informed as they may be.

 

[willycat]

Newsflash: Chris Collins and his staff knows talent and will make the best choice for the deepest roster in NU's bball history for the all important 13th scholarship opening.

I think FS is 0 for 100 in his predictions of who should be given scholarships. Let's make it 0 for 101. Should not be shocker to anyone.

Agree that Collins and staff are very good talent evaluators but really don't remember FS making any player predictions but just posted resumes of possible grad transfers.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Ah, true to form. In case you haven't noticed there are more then a few posters that are taken aback by your caustic responses, as informed as they may be.

Oh no. Whatsoever shall I do?

 

[YesterdaysCat]

Oh no. Whatsoever shall I do?

I love it when you smack him down. Am I a bad person?

 

[rwhitney014]

You should do your counting again. If you are counting walkons, we are talking about scholarship players. Other teams have walkons too, so they aren't an advantage over the competition.
Walkons can be a nice surprise. Who could possibly forget Reggie Hearn (a sure inductee into the Walk-On Hall of Fame)? But with hundreds of D1 programs able to offer scholarships, the odds of a walkon becoming a solid contributor are extremely low. Case in point, the Dartmouth center mentioned in the OP had 13 D1 offers, and had difficulty getting playing time in the Ivy league ... for perspective, compare his case to someone who had ZERO D1 offers....a sobering thought.

Isn't it really annoying when someone takes a fact where you know they know the context but presents it out of context anyway, as if it's proof of something?

Wait, really? This dude has 13 offers? I had no idea!!!

Hearn was a preferred walk-on who took unofficial visits to Butler and Notre Dame. Schools ranging from Virginia to UChicago wanted him on campus to visit with the chance to join the basketball teams. He was a one-in-a-thousand type of guy.

For the record, Kreisberg played three years for one of the better Ivy programs. In two of those years he averaged around 25 minutes a game with more than 7 points and around 5 rebounds. The third season his numbers went down a bit, be he still played 5 times the minutes and scored 5 times the points and had 3 times the rebounds of this other guy.

He came here and was a good guy, or so say friends of mine who know him. Nothing wrong with that.

At the time, we had Olah on the roster as our center. Kreisberg was a similar size and style of player to Olah. We ran offensive and defensive sets where he theoretically could have played a reasonable facsimile to the guy who was starting at the position.

Today, the roster looks more like what Collins always said he envisioned. The bigs are smaller, more mobile and more athletic. They are active rebounders who use positioning rather than sheer size. They are not Olah. We don't play a style these days where a guy with this skill set, whatever it is, fits our team. He wouldn't play. But he would take coaching time away from others who need it. And on a team with big dreams, that's not worth it.

 

[spartcat]

Another reason to pass on these guys is international prospects. There are some great players elsewhere that can more than just fill a spot. VV is still one of my favorite 21st century Cats. If by some chance we're healthy next year, I'm not sure where or how we could use another player, but that's always a possibility. I have no idea how international recruiting works, but it can work.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

He wouldn't play. But he would take coaching time away from others who need it. And on a team with big dreams, that's not worth it.

First, re-read the OP. You seem to have misapprehended that there is ONLY ONE grad transfer candidate left nationwide....In the OP I mentioned THREE (3)...and of course there are many more...many in relative terms given how late it is, but since we only have ONE spot available, having at least a double-digit number of them in principle available warrants a discussion.

In the OP I indicated that it is unclear to me that the Dartmouth center can help, but he has at least one desirable property (size)...the video linked above suggests that even out of HS he was a moderately skilled big guy for his size and position, which is why he got 13 D1 offers...still he may not be the best available option..look at the other two mentioned...or better yet, see if you can find additional interesting prospects...there may well be.

 

[FeliSilvestris]

Another reason to pass on these guys is international prospects. There are some great players elsewhere that can more than just fill a spot. VV is still one of my favorite 21st century Cats. If by some chance we're healthy next year, I'm not sure where or how we could use another player, but that's always a possibility. I have no idea how international recruiting works, but it can work.

Are you talking about international grad transfers? I do not believe the concept exists. This thread focuses on grad transfers under the assumption that the staff would rather keep its options open for 2018 and beyond...I suspect the vast majority of non-transfer international players planning to join college teams this coming season have already found schools...those planning on starting in the 2018-19 year can indeed be considered as any other recruit would. Those are outside the scope of this thread.
Incidentally the NMSU guy mentioned in the OP is a Canadian, FWIW.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

First, re-read the OP. You seem to have misapprehended that there is ONLY ONE grad transfer candidate left nationwide....In the OP I mentioned THREE (3)...and of course there are many more...many in relative terms given how late it is, but since we only have ONE spot available, having at least a double-digit number of them in principle available warrants a discussion.

In the OP I indicated that it is unclear to me that the Dartmouth center can help, but he has at least one desirable property (size)...the video linked above suggests that even out of HS he was a moderately skilled big guy for his size and position, which is why he got 13 D1 offers...still he may not be the best available option..look at the other two mentioned...or better yet, see if you can find additional interesting prospects...there may well be.

Misapprehended, eh? I don't think anything you've "misapprehended" warrants any kind of discussion.