Drew Peterson decommits from Minnesota
- Thread starter Kat burglar
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And very few universities turn profits off their sports programs. There is a common misperception that they do. If you want college athletics to continue and you want to take away a cut from revenue streams to athletic departments, understand that you will probably jeopardize certain sports that lose even more money.
I don't see the connection between winning collegeiate championships or not and whether students should be compensated. These athletes get free rides, worth tens of thousands of dollars, sometimes at elite institutions. If the response is, "Well, be real, they're majoring in football or basketball," then let them suffer in the rank injustice of sitting in class at Northwestern or Duke and then soon make the jump to some professional league. You'll notice that these dummies never lack for food, Air Jordans, video game consoles, nor much of anything else. Go figure, huh? Oh, the humanity!
Please! You obviously haven’t been around many D1 “student athletes” if you think they never lack for “much of anything else”.
I can’t wait for, “I’m transferring because I feel I’m worth a lot more endorsement money than I’m actually getting. No way *insert teammate* should get more than me.”
I can’t wait for the next “I’m resigning my position as Head Coach at Memphis because Florida State just offered me a lot more money than I’m actually getting.
It is, bud. I'm longing...longing...for you to share with me the tales of woe and deprivation of our oppressed college athletes. Lay it on me. I'm a corn-fed country boy. I can handle it.
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Are you compensated for your talent, the time you put into your craft, and the revenue generated off your hard work? If so, then you surely can appreciate why others want the same opportunity. We all live in and enjoy a (formerly!) robust economy driven by capitalism. Some athletes deserve a slice of the pie they’ve helped bake.
And to be clear, the most talented ones will still be vastly under-compensated relative to the value they generate. Further, neither the school or NCAA is paying them. They’ll just simply get to profit off of others using their name, image, and likeness.
Ok, Cleetus. You seem to think these “dummies” never seem to lack for anything. Air Jordan’s, video game counsels, food or much of anything else. Based on what the stories Jed at at Country store told you about the new BMW the third string PG just bought to tool around campus. Please tell me ole wise one, how many of these low income kids magically have the same disposal income as kids from higher income families? Corruption?
I personally witnessed numerous D1 Athletes that didn’t have sh*& to spend around campus. Not enough money to take out a date for movie and dinner. Clothes that were pretty much given to them from the athletic department. The rest of their wardrobe was subpar. So no, I haven’t noticed like you they “never lack for anything “. You must have a keen eye being around so many of them.
Also, where did anyone ever call them oppressed? Your characterization of never lacking for anything is untrue for a lot of athletes. It’s ignorant.
Sounds like your typical college student. The different is most o the other kids will also exit school thousands of dollars in debt.
As the other guy said, that sounds like millions of college students. You may want to look up the definition of "oppressed," because that is precisely how you characterize these poor lads. The whole premise behind all the talk of paying college athletes is the oppressor/oppressed belief system, in which the athletes are being exploited because they aren't getting cuts of the revenues generated by their programs. Of course, they ignore or minimize the tens of thousands of dollars each receives by gaining free tuition, being admitted with academic bona fides that would otherwise cause them not to get a sniff from these schools, tutoring, Mickey Mouse majors summer jobs lined up for them. Do you know how many college students would kill to have those things provided for them? I guess if they don't appreciate all those things and wish to major in football or basketball, they're just going to have to suffer through it. I'm playing the world's smallest violin as we speak.
And no, I don't claim most are driving around in BMWs. I would be interested, however, in some past athletes you witnessed who lacked any essentials during their college journeys. Who are some of them?
It’s means the players have special talent to get a full ride scholarship. Why should you be compensated? If you were part of something that brought in millions to the university, you would have been compensated.
I absolutely believe there is exploitation. I personally seen players that were “pushed” through the system by taking Mickey Mouse classes to remain eligible. They never graduated in many cases. I have seen guys that were in college that would have trouble naming the Twelve months if you spotted them 10. You call getting a free education and I call it bringing revenue to the school. Don’t get me wrong, they go in with eyes wide open, most realize it is professional sports or bust. So I ask, why not give the revenue makers a piece of the revenue?
I am not going to name people I have crossed paths with lacked these essentials, but there were plenty. All I will say is I was part of a D1 program and frequently interacted with revenue producing athletes that were there in hopes of getting a professional contract and not necessarily there for a degree. Sad, but it is real.
They have to take classes, just like everyone else, but unlike everyone else, they don't have time to make some spending $$ by working part-time jobs (which is what I and many of my friends did).
Plus, there are students w/ other talents who get full rides (music, theater, etc.) and at certain schools, the top students get free tuition (and they don't to do anything beyond the normal course of being a student).
And esp. these days, being an athlete (for a revenue-generating sport) has become an all-year round endeavor.
Most college kids have the summer to work and make a good amount of spending $$.
FB players have to report to camp so only have part of the summer and many employers want workers who can work the entire summer
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Tuition is an inflated #.
And actually schools make out w/ scholarship athletes since the athletic dept. pays full freight when the majority of the student body gets financial aid.
And it's the athletes in the non=revenue generating sports that actually make out.
Basically the FB (and to a lesser extent, BB) players subsidize/pay for the scholarships for the non-revenue sports (a form of socialism), in addition to paying for the insane salaries of coaches coaching students/amateurs.
There have already been schools cutting non-revenue sports and that would increase substanially if there is no FB this fall.
People aren't paying big $$ to watch these millionaire coaches.
Used to think that these athletes had it good, but changed my mind after seeing the amount of time commitment it took, but the real deal-breaker were the injuries many of them ended up suffering (esp. the FB players).
Had friends who had a long list of injuries and some of them you wouldn't wish on anyone.
Are you trying to tell me other students don’t have special talents!? And I agree, and full ride is pretty dang awesome. Ask some other students on campus if they’d accept a full ride.
Maybe not, but they sure do get lots of other special privileges not privy to the general student population. Let’s not pretend they’re paying for all their meals...
Can’t understand this concept that we can’t allow student athletes to benefit from their own marketability — at no cost to the school or NCAA. If any average student had a special talent that someone was willing to compensate them for there would be objection whatsoever. If some local booster wants to pay an athlete to endorse his business, have at it.
You’re missing the point. Those endorsements will be massively abused/manipulated by schools that can afford to do so, leaving most D1 schools far in the dust. The collegiate athletics you’ve loved for so long will be utterly gutted, and what will remain is a professional league of 30 or so schools. If that’s what you want, great. For many, it sounds awful. We already have a professional leagues, they’re called the NBA, NFL, etc.
And they get full-rides as well, w/o having to commit 30+ hrs/week to an extracurricular activity, much less having to endure getting their bodies pummeled.
Plus, there wouldn't be the same $$-making limitations on these students.
A world-class violinist would get a full-ride and still be allowed to perform for a fee and get endorsements.
What was more stupid was the NCAA preventing Jeremy Bloom from receiving endorsements for skiing for 2 years and then banned him from playing FB when he accepted sponsorship $$ to pay for his Olympic training.
The NCAA has been and continues to be a joke.
They don't care about the student-athlete; what they care about is continuing the system that fills the pockets certain groups, including Emmert's.
Actually know quite a few who got offered full-rides at schools like Yale and Princeton (didn't end up going).
WashU, in particular, is known for handing out scholarships for high scoring applicants, and most state universities have Honors programs where a certain % of students are on scholarship.
Granted, these are for the elite of the elite (musicians, smarts, etc.), but they also weren't required to basically work a 30+ hr job while at school, during school breaks and part of their summers.
At specialty schools like the Curtis Institute of Music, every student is on scholarship.
At Julliard, the top students are on scholarship; Robin Williams attended Julliard on full scholarship even tho he came from an affluent family.
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Like I’ve said before. If they feel they’re being taken advantage of, they can play small college where the schools never turn a profit.
That’s great, but my question was “What percentage of the general general population is on a full ride?” Can we quit with the farce that tons of other students are also on full rides?
Why aren't any tears shed over the plight of the poor, exploited baseball players? Nor the golf or tennis players? You know what I'm talking about. You probably know why. The stereotype is of the poor, black athlete with poor academic abilities, raised by his single mama, conned out of cash by the universities that make a killing of him, who is there to play sports, not learn. In contrast, the mostly white baseball players who come from two-parent homes and decent high schools, well, no one objects, just as they don't object when they leave college early to play minor league ball. You will never hear any hint of "exploitation" associated with college baseball players at even the powerhouse baseball programs.
If it really is true that most D-1 male, high-major conference players are there to major in sports and squander a free education with infinite supports, then the problem is with the subculture in our society that propagates these self-destructive values and habits. Throwing some money at these kids won't improve their lives. Most will also squander the money and most will not go on to lucrative careers in professional sports.
Sorry, but that's a silly question.
What % of the general student pop. has a talent where schools or other organizations are willing to pony up $$?
And once again, what other "students" (even those on academic scholarships) are required to spend 30+ hours/wk on what is essentially a job?
Um, b/c there are other avenues for baseball, golf and tennis players?
Many baseball players put of HS opt for the minor leagues.
There are tennis and golf players (if they are good enough) who turn pro and don't go to college, or go for a year or just a semester/quarter (like Matt Fitzgerald who left NU after a quarter).
Now, we're starting to see it for men's BB w/ the G-League starting to attract more of the top players out of HS (can earn as much as $1 mil/yr), and there are professional develoment programs/leagues for ice hockey and soccer.
But for the vast majority of non-revenue sports athletes, they (mostly white) actually are working/benefiting from the system.
Not many people are willing to pay to watch them play - certainly not enough to pay for their schollies, much less the salaries of their coaches and the facilities.
The revenue generated from FB and to a lesser extent, men's BB pays for all that.
Athletes in the non-revenue sports know that they are getting a good deal, basically getting subsidized by the FB and BB players.
That's why there is so much pressure for there to be a CFB season.
W/o CFB this fall, the athletic budget for many schools will turn red.
Taking this from a diff. POV - why should FB and men's BB coaches get paid astronomically more than coaches of other teams, including women's BB?
Don't they all coach student-athletes and are trying to turn young men and women into upright and upstanding adults?
Got a cure for the coronavirus can sell you if you believe all that.
If all student-athletes are to be treated the same, shouldn't the compensation for the coaches be as well (or at least not that stark of a disparity)?
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In baseball, the signing bonus value for about the first 12-15 rounds is at least equivalent to the value of a 4 year full ride. The value of the first few rounds is significantly higher. This is a real professional option. In Hockey, the best players turn professional at 18 and many are in the NHL by 21. In most schools, the Baseball and Hockey program lose money. There is a reason there is a full roster of scholarship players for revenue sports and a roster made up of partial scholarships for non-revenue sports. These programs don’t generate a profit, this is why there is no outrage.
Yes, Football and Basketball are the revenue sports and this is where athletic departments need to make their money. It’s in their best interest to get the best players, not necessarily the best students. Institutional misplaced goal? Files counter to University mission statements? Could be. These sports are dominated by Black players, so it stands to reason that they are significantly impacted by the inability to capitalize on their image. However, star players like Trevor Lawrence or Joe Burrow are probably impacted at least as much as anyone.
In my Olympic sport, we shared the weight room facilities with the Basketball team a few day a week. I got to casually know many of them. We didn’t hang out, but got to know something about their history just by being around them. The best guy on the team was a White guy that was a rural town and by everything I saw was dirt poor. He sure didn’t strike me as a Rhodes Scholar in my interactions and hearing him talk about his classes, it was clear they were picked with the intention of keeping him eligible. He had a cup of coffee in the NBA but never really stuck. Ended up playing oversees. Came back to the USA and by his mid -30’s was in jail for distribution of Cocaine. I doubt any endorsement program would have changed this outcome, but it highlights that here is a guy that only was in college to be a professional athlete. Why not let them capitalize on THEIR image? Maybe some of them will actually do something good with the money like jump start their Careers outside the game.
Aren't there stipends for living expenses for athletes now? Some professor had an idea to pool money for player likenesses like is done for college research teams that generate cash. Otherwise, wouldn't most of the serious money be going to the "stars"? Aren't universities spending millions giving the players training, not to mention life skills and contacts? Just a few questions I have.
No it isn’t. It exhibits just how fortunate these guys are to be getting a full ride and left with no college debt.
It’s not the 1980’s anymore. TV networks and contracts have changed everything.
"These guys have it good enough already, so they don't deserve any more" isn't a sound logic. Do you also think we should tax any income above $1 million a year 100% because that should be plenty for any individual to get by and there are other people starving in the streets? I'd guess there's some that think so, but I wouldn't have expected you to say that.
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