But the idea that successful athletic programs can help support the academic side is not... academic.
Shouldn’t we be hearing about transfers fairly soon?
- Thread starter freewillie07
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But the idea that successful athletic programs can help support the academic side is not... academic.
Hey we all like to root for a winner. Then you have to ask yourself at what price? Do you buy players like they do in the SEC? Or do you rent borrowed talent for a few months like Kentucky and Duke? Do you recruit student athletes who are more representative of your student body? Do you make reasonable exceptions that still give you a chance to compete without significantly compromising your integrity? Everybody’s gotta make their own decisions, but no one approach fits everybody.
Nobody is proposing “buying” players. Up for discussion is whether the parameters to which NU’s admissions office holds prospective student-athletes (both transfers and out of high school) truly “safeguard” the sanctity of the NU degree and/or have an impact on the school’s reputation (both athletic and academic).
Maybe if they had a 10,000 seat arena they just might generate bit more in profits.
Well the SEC apparently does, so if you want a truly level playing field you might have to start there. I’m at the point where I say hey, what is the real point of college athletics? We all talk about it like it’s the “ front porch of the university” and I suppose there is some truth to that. But if we are all honest with ourselves, we really like to associate with winners. Nothing wrong with that, but again at what price? NU already makes significant allowances for athletes. Where do you draw the line? At one point Duke said screw it, we’ll let anybody in and we don’t expect them to stay more than 6 or 7 months. As you chip away at entrance standards it becomes easier to accept the notion that the basketball program stands alone from the university. Then you truly are simply rooting for the laundry. Which serves some folks just fine. But I find NU a distinct institution and I find it much easier to care about its successes because of what it has to overcome.
At what point has Duke said "screw it"? When good academic are mentioned Duke, Vanderbilt are mentioned along with NU. Doesn't seem like their BB programs have hurt their school reputations.
99% of the populace doesn’t make this distinction, nor do they hold it against Duke as an academic institution.
Which conference is home to the championship? How many seats at the final four table did the SEC get?
You can win with lesser known or regarded talent than five stars. But you probably can’t w a bunch of marginal threes and fours.
Generally you ask fo a program to be self sufficient. Your figures look like it is. So while it looks like a profit, how much of that "profit" is used to fund women's sports programs ? There is really no profit
Let me know when you arrive in 2019. You're stuck in 1959. Attendance is down for many sports because people prefer to stay home. Where attendance is up, it's up for places where the atmosphere is a draw. I don't think having a 10 to 12,000 seat arena is much fun with 1500 people for a nonconf matinee snoozefest.
I don't disagree with that. I'm simply addressing this misunderstanding or canard that, "Well, it's worth bringing in substandard students who are good at basketball because it brings in massive profits, which enhance the college experiences of all students."
a. For all but a few programs, it does not bring in big profits.
b. When you sell your soul and become a basketball/football factory, you choose to take scholarships and spots away from genuine students for athletes, most of whom are bound for minor league professional sports, which will not provide a stable income for most of them.
c. When you sell your soul in this fashion, grander-scale corruption usually follows, because you have to find way to "cheat" academically to keep these not-so-bright athletes eligible.
d. The largesse that comes from these programs probably isn't spent any better than the other funds are spent by higher education. Fancier residence halls, climbing walls, more diversicrats and provosts, more athletic facilities do not enhance the learning of all students. Actually, most of those things actually work against learning.
You're worried about this in the beginning of May? In the unlikely event that you are, I am guessing that we have a walkon or two or another contingency plan for any practices that are allowed this time of year (if any) unless you believe our coaching staff is brain-dead...
No, I don't think the staff are brain dead. But a couple of walk-ons for practice doesn't sound like a way to get the team ready for B1G play. NU need at least 2 transfers to be able to work out effectively, given that someone is always banged up during the course of a season. Dominos are falling around the transfer market but none of them are falling NU's way. Just an unfortunate situation the Cats are in.
C'mon! Get with the program! Stop being such a "glass is half-empty" Debbie Downer! Get with the group! We think every turn of events is a good thing! Regardless! You're either with us or against us!
But it's May, and a lot of other teams are in similar situation until the hundreds of transfers remaining sign with teams. Does the NCAA even allow us to conduct formal practices now? It is six months before the season, just sounds to me like you're making a lot out of a little, imo. We had situations under Carmody where we didn't have 10 scholarship players available for practice during the actual season, don't recall anyone even batting an eye about that at the time...
That's the new standard? If you're doing better than Carmody, things are fine and you shouldn't question the state of the program? You have tremendously low expectations, don't you, when it comes right down to it? Or are you just making excuses and contorting yourself so that you can avoid having any sort of balanced perspective rather than dull, homerist, rah-rah apologism?
Perhaps a better way to go about this is to ask you what Collins and Company would have to do for you to be critical? Serious question.
I'm not contorting anything. It is FREAKIN' MAY! MAY!
And to answer your question, CC would have to not make the Dance like Carmody didn't, and not recruit two top-50 classes in a row like Carmody didn't, and win 100 games less quickly than Carmody did... see where I am going here? If you can't, I will use a simple two-word phrase so that you get the point-- Carmody sucks.
I would add that the transfer portal continues to be fluid, with new entrants every day. Illinois just had a player enter this afternoon. and currently has only 10 scholarship players as well. And they are actually in BETTER shape than a lot of teams
https://herald-review.com/sports/il...cle_6f26ad64-8572-55c2-b66d-0868a063a904.html
https://herald-review.com/sports/il...cle_6f26ad64-8572-55c2-b66d-0868a063a904.html
I think you're a closet Caromdy Lover, given how often you fixate upon the man. It's okay. You can come out of the closet.
And yes, you do contort yourself into a pretzel all the time to make anything negative seem as if, at worst, it is no big deal. Welsh-Ryan could be burning with Collins holding the matches and you would point out that, finally, the program would get the type of massive arena the program deserves after making it to the Tournament three seasons ago. Plus, the heating system did always stink, anyways.
In 25+ years of surfing the interwebs, I've been a regular or a lurker at a lot of hoops forums. The only one where all recruits are above average, all new assistant hires are good ones and the current staff knows exactly what it's doing all the time, is this forum. If you look back at comments on every guy who has transferred out, be it to NW Oklahoma School for the Deaf and Hard of Hearing or Tippecanoe St., they were, to a man, top recruits or sleepers. Every single one. Incredible! Then they leave and it turns out they just weren't all that good, after all, but that's not the fault of the coaches for bringing them in and/or not developing them. No sir.
Ba, ba, ba, but, Carmody!
But sports tend to be the front porch of the university. Like it or not. Applications went way up when we went to RB and donations increased quite a bit as well. Having a bad program makes it more of a joke. While it might be difficult to get to the level of a DUKE, it is still important to have a respectable program.
You used walls of text signifying nothing, so I will keep it brief for you. The Dance. A win in the Dance. Two top-50 recruiting classes in a row. Fastest coach to 100 wins, by far. Carmody sucks.
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Mutltiple times under Carmody, most recently in the 2011-12 season, when we had as few as SEVEN scolarship players available in a loss to Wisky.
You have an excellent memory. I went back and looked at that roster. NU had just 10 scholarship players that season. They finished 7th in the B1G, with an 8-10 conference record. That will be an interesting benchmark for the 2019-20 team, which has the two best ever recruiting classes and likely the same number of scholarship players when the transfer dust settles. Thanks for reminding us.
This isn’t true. There are plenty of concerns or questioning from the board on the state of the program. In fact, it is on ALL of the items you mention. No doubt, it is predominately glass half full material, but so is most ever other fan board. Have you lurked on the Fighting Undies board? Not much different than here.
There was outright criticism of Vassar's game when he signed which countered the hyperbolic "he's a one and done with that athleticism." There were questions about Lindsey's games and critical posts about his AAU play. Questions about Bouie's shot. I could go on and on.
I think the bigger point is that players and teams are evaluated on a spectrum and fans to tend to see the most positive end. Isn't that normal?
I think some of the sustained criticism on this board is unique....NU fans working hard to prove to other NU fans that one assessment is correct and the other is incorrect. Whether that's leveraging advanced stats or a charitable look at history or whatever. The continual effort to push the narrative that Collins sucks or Carmody sucks or a couple of the top recruits in NU's history just aren't that good and never were draws enmity like shit draws flies.
At the end of the day, we are here to support our team which we know has challenges that very few (and perhaps no) other mens' bball team has. We're not here to defend our thesis.
So, yeah, if there is a continual thread through your posts that criticize the team and staff that this board is about, you are asking to be shat upon.
Sorry MIke, but your response is short because what he said was irrefutable. So, you predictably, simply throw garbage back at the wall of words hoping that something sticks. Unfortunately, you have used all those lines longer than I have been b1tching and so the ring hollow.
So, by having 10 scholarship players, when three became unavailable, they were still able to field a 7 man rotation. Which is something often done in college basketball.
Let's see - a 9 man scholarship team suffering a similar fate of three guys down would have six to play with. Doable. Not advisable nor likely a good game. But hey, it will be the hardest working, best character six guys out there making us proud - well, except for getting their collective butts kicked in...but who cares, it's not like they are there to compete in some silly game anyway.
I disagree with your premise here but it would explain a lot. I imagine many folks believe the ultimate purpose of the Board is to support the team. I disagree. If you want to do that, join a booster club - N club, I think?
I contend, and believe others too, that this Board serves to be a place for people, be it fans of NU, of college ball, of the B1G, whatever, to discuss the various NU athletic teams, for better or worse.
And like many similar Boards, there are proponents of admin, coaches, players, each other as well as critics. And that serves one of many purposes, which thereby drives traffic, allowing for advertising and with it, the ability to maintain the site.
I suppose one could argue the Rock could be a place folks go to support the teams as a sole purpose - being a private, paid website.
But if anyone was successful in driving away one side of our regular arguments, this place would become dead as Scout. Kum-by-la is boring - no one wants to read it endlessly. Need proof - read Scout. Or read the Rock from about 6 months ago before Lou made a conscious effort to drive some more content.
Hell, simply go through the threads and check the view counts compared to these free boards. Without the banter - there would not be enough traffic to drive ad revenue.
So - those that want to attack comet, me, anyone else voicing an opinion they don't like - you should use ignore. Driving guys away brings this website one step closer to death. Ask Lou how firm the existence of the Wildcat report is today. If he answers, if he knows, I think you will be in for a little surprise.
Let me shorten it.
Criticism is tolerated...even embraced.
Obsession with criticism because that's your point of view gets pushback.
If that's viewed as "attacking" then perhaps a little self reflection would be good.
Criticism is tolerated...even embraced.
Obsession with criticism because that's your point of view gets pushback.
If that's viewed as "attacking" then perhaps a little self reflection would be good.
No, push back is discussion. But when folks around here start making it personal - I'm thinking back to the Va v Doc wars - well, Doc is gone. And some traffic with him.
I'm happy to self reflect....all done and still feel good about this place. I can get frustrated, like many of you, and reflect it in my posts. I can get personal, like many have with me - but I'm thick skinned.
I don't know Comet, as one example, but Mike's very old BC routine now being applied to him is boring. And if he becomes offended and goes away - some traffic with go with it.
Party on Wayne - I'm still having fun.
You seem to be fan, at times but your constant criticism get very, very old. Why are you unhappy?
With the MBB program? I think I have voiced my concerns pretty darn vocally.
As a person, well I guess Lara’s departure is a bummer, but over time, I’m a pretty happy guy. I have a good life. So I’ll assume you meant with the MBB. So, RTFF.
Btw, does mikes endless rainbows and unicorns routine get old? How about gcg and his bashing routine?
Lots of schticks around here. Wrassler.
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