All-Fitz team

[gocatsgo2003]

NVH has been injured a few times and missed games as well and will end up in fewer games than McMannis and his loss in some of those games was pretty important ( wasn't he knocked out of the Neb Hail Mary game?). I put him well above Mabin and very close to McMannis. And while McMannis may have been great on ST his Frosh year, he didn't really play there later in his career. Just saying both have been special players for us. To this point in his career, performance of NVH has been similar to McMannis. ( McMannis In his 4th season, as a senior, he earned first-team All-Big Ten honors after he set career highs in interceptions with five, and recorded 37 tackles, 1.5 tackles-for-loss, and broke up 12 passes). Take those numbers off his totals and you can see how similar they are. NVH second.(Ints 4 vs 5, PBUs 26 vs 28, TFL 6.5 vs 8.5, tackles 164 vs 114, FF( not sure as I am not sure if any were his senior year and at least one was on ST) Does NVH have fewer tackles because he has been better at coverage so is thrown at less? It was my opinion that that was an area that NVH was better. Just saying that at this point in his career, NVH is very similar in his contribution and if he can stay healthy, likely to be drafted as well.

Put away the stats. Sherrick was a CB that teams game planned arpund. VanHoose is a CB that teams game plan toward (mostly because Harris is better, not because VanHoose is poor). I don't think VanHoose is even the best corner on his own team.

And VanHoose has a LOT of work to do demonstrating his man coverage skills if he ever hopes to be drafted. Sherrick was a mid-round pick based almost exclusively on pure athleticism. VanHoose is not that guy.

 

[Gladeskat]

Manipulating his stats does not change my mind that Sherrick is better than Nick. Anyway, teams knew better than to throw to Sherrick's side of the field. Consequently, Mabin had quite a few picks. Maybe a few diving interceptions from out of nowhere will change my mind. He'll get his chances because I think opponents will throw his way rather than test Harris. Nick is quick and might be able to jump out patterns for pick-6's.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Manipulating his stats does not change my mind that Sherrick is better than Nick. Anyway, teams knew better than to throw to Sherrick's side of the field. Consequently, Mabin had quite a few picks. Maybe a few diving interceptions from out of nowhere will change my mind. He'll get his chances because I think opponents will throw his way rather than test Harris. Nick is quick and might be able to jump out patterns for pick-6's.

Yep, there were clearly games last year where they threw away from Harris. How many Soph CB's at NU can we say that about? Let's give Brown some credit for our DB's now he has more raw talent to work with. NVH has been a strong contributor, but barring injury, Harris is going to the league.

 

[hdhntr1]

Put away the stats. Sherrick was a CB that teams game planned arpund. VanHoose is a CB that teams game plan toward (mostly because Harris is better, not because VanHoose is poor). I don't think VanHoose is even the best corner on his own team.

And VanHoose has a LOT of work to do demonstrating his man coverage skills if he ever hopes to be drafted. Sherrick was a mid-round pick based almost exclusively on pure athleticism. VanHoose is not that guy.

You were the one that brought the stats up to show SM superiority. I was just showing that the stats at this point in their respective college careers show no such thing. In fact, the higher number of tackles by SM might indicate that teams were throwing his way more often than they have thrown towards NVH. If they were game planning toward NVH as you suggest, I would expect a higher number of tackles.

 

[Gladeskat]

You were the one that brought the stats up to show SM superiority. I was just showing that the stats at this point in their respective college careers show no such thing. In fact, the higher number of tackles by SM might indicate that teams were throwing his way more often than they have thrown towards NVH. If they were game planning toward NVH as you suggest, I would expect a higher number of tackles.

It might also suggest Sherrick was pretty good at run support, which he was.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

You were the one that brought the stats up to show SM superiority. I was just showing that the stats at this point in their respective college careers show no such thing. In fact, the higher number of tackles by SM might indicate that teams were throwing his way more often than they have thrown towards NVH. If they were game planning toward NVH as you suggest, I would expect a higher number of tackles.

I mentioned Sherrick's KR averages as a reminder to people that he was a pretty darn good returner in his own right. It was by no means the main point of my post. If you really want to go by stats (which I do not recommend and am doing because you seem to like them), Sherrick's tackles will be inflated his first two years because he played on every coverage team we had and used to blow people up.

It was pretty blatant throughout the year that teams were throwing at VanHoose more than Harris. There was a post on these boards from Joe Ganz (Nebraska's offensive GA) indicating that was precisely Nebraska's game plan.

 

[hdhntr1]

I mentioned Sherrick's KR averages as a reminder to people that he was a pretty darn good returner in his own right. It was by no means the main point of my post. If you really want to go by stats (which I do not recommend and am doing because you seem to like them), Sherrick's tackles will be inflated his first two years because he played on every coverage team we had and used to blow people up.

It was pretty blatant throughout the year that teams were throwing at VanHoose more than Harris. There was a post on these boards from Joe Ganz (Nebraska's offensive GA) indicating that was precisely Nebraska's game plan.

In the following draft preview

I basically felt we had more bookend corners that as a pair were as good as we have had. Not a bad problem to have

http://draftbreakdown.com/2016-nfl-draft-prospect-preview-northwestern-wildcats/

If they have targeted him, he has held up pretty well.

 

[NJCat83588]

I basically felt we had more bookend corners that as a pair were as good as we have had. Not a bad problem to have

Agree. Trying to pick which is better is like asking a parent which child they love more. You can't.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

In the following draft preview

I basically felt we had more bookend corners that as a pair were as good as we have had. Not a bad problem to have

http://draftbreakdown.com/2016-nfl-draft-prospect-preview-northwestern-wildcats/

If they have targeted him, he has held up pretty well.

"In coverage, VanHoose looks most comfortable in zone. He has adequate speed, plays the ball well, and is a solid tackler. Another strong season should earn VanHoose a spot in a postseason all star game and a chance to work his way into the later rounds of the draft."

Isn't that basically what I said above?

 

[Cat In The Cradle]

I liken VanHoose more to Mabin -- solid, steady, multi year starter, but not really an impact player.[/QUOTE]

I disagree vehemently.

VanHoose's blocked/returned XP attempt in South Bend represented a three point swing, and presumably played a primary role in Notre Dame's ill advised 2-point attempt, as well as did more to ice the Irish's field goal unit for the balance of the game than any of Fitz's timeouts.

While VanHoose did not singlehandedly win that game or any other last season, his corner play AND his special teams play made him an impact player as much as anyone else on the team.

 

[Gladeskat]

I think , especially on the line, a guy is usually better when he is 22 than 21. Ward got better each year, his Sr year was his best. I think an expectation of progression is reasonable.

Even for you. all-American? meh. All Turk awards, Never!

All-American referred to A-A benchwarmer. You don't think I could be an All-American benchwarmer? I'm wide in the hips.

I could never make the Turk awards or even Turk's Top 22. "Needs work"

 

[DaCat]

I disagree vehemently.

VanHoose's blocked/returned XP attempt in South Bend represented a three point swing, and presumably played a primary role in Notre Dame's ill advised 2-point attempt, as well as did more to ice the Irish's field goal unit for the balance of the game than any of Fitz's timeouts.

While VanHoose did not singlehandedly win that game or any other last season, his corner play AND his special teams play made him an impact player as much as anyone else on the team.

I'm glad we have NVH one more season. Hopefully he has a monster season to make this debate even more interesting. Right now I would definitely put McManis ahead of Nick based on pure athleticism, instincts, and results on the field.

 

[hdhntr1]

I disagree vehemently.

VanHoose's blocked/returned XP attempt in South Bend represented a three point swing, and presumably played a primary role in Notre Dame's ill advised 2-point attempt, as well as did more to ice the Irish's field goal unit for the balance of the game than any of Fitz's timeouts.

While VanHoose did not singlehandedly win that game or any other last season, his corner play AND his special teams play made him an impact player as much as anyone else on the team.

I'm glad we have NVH one more season. Hopefully he has a monster season to make this debate even more interesting. Right now I would definitely put McManis ahead of Nick based on pure athleticism, instincts, and results on the field.[/QUOTE]
SM had a monster SR year. NVH has yet to play his SR year. Since players tend to improve over time, I would expect a pretty good Sr season for NVH if he can stay healthy.

 

[Gladeskat]

SM had a monster SR year. NVH has yet to play his SR year. Since players tend to improve over time, I would expect a pretty good Sr season for NVH if he can stay healthy..

Sherrick didn't really improve his senior year, and didn't improve much over his entire career at NU. He was NFL ready as a freshman, IMO. Afterall, he ended up beating out another NFL player in Cole (a senior) in the latter half of the 2006 season as a true freshman. Sherrick had the big senior year because teams made the mistake of throwing to his side more often that year. Perhaps it was because he was coming off of injury, I don't know.