Nothing against Braun, he's in a tough spot. Which is the smarter school? Duke has figured it out and NU hasn't. Can the AD get it up for that? Can NU get it up for that? IMO, NU is so preoccupied with being an Ivy League-like school, that they can't see the their a** from a hole in the ground. Meanwhile, Duke could give a crap--they're just good all around. NU's Admin is as chicken-sh** as it was in the 1960's when I attended. They've just somehow managed to up the threshold to get accepted. And by god, that's their story and they're sticking to it.
It's time for a total reboot...
- Thread starter stpaulcat
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I’ve had this complaint for years. If you want to be an institution of excellence, then strive for excellence in everything! If you have a sports program or an arts program or an engineering program, then, dammit… go get the best kids at those things. Who gives a **** about SAT scores in the real world.
Now? Again? Three games in? Talk about instability!
We wait until the season is over.
If the team plays like today we will be 1-11. If we then replace Braun, we hire the most shameless motherfreaker we can find who is a beast on the recruiting trail. And we tell him to do at NU what Sanders did at Colorado. Find the best guys he can on the portal and "fire" the current team. I know that sounds mean....because it is. I know that sounds like something Northwestern would not do......because normally we would not. But in this day and age of instant gratification demanded by both the fans and the media, waiting until the 105 guys on the current team "churn out" will mean we will have at least three more years like this one. There won't be enough superstars on the team left, they will get impatient and leave.
We should as a matter of decency say if football is really their passion that we will help them transfer but conversely if they want to stay at NU we will have academic scholarships for them so they can bring to a conclusion what they started. We can tell them their football skills are no longer required but we don't have to shaft them and I am not suggesting we do.
Maybe we just had a bad day. Or maybe Duke is really good (and thus we are not as bad as we looked, we just ran into a brick wall). But today we looked like one of those "University of Southern North Dakota at Hoople" teams that are paid to play teams like Ohio State and Alabama early and end up losing by fifty points with the game over after the first drive.
We wait until the season is over.
If the team plays like today we will be 1-11. If we then replace Braun, we hire the most shameless motherfreaker we can find who is a beast on the recruiting trail. And we tell him to do at NU what Sanders did at Colorado. Find the best guys he can on the portal and "fire" the current team. I know that sounds mean....because it is. I know that sounds like something Northwestern would not do......because normally we would not. But in this day and age of instant gratification demanded by both the fans and the media, waiting until the 105 guys on the current team "churn out" will mean we will have at least three more years like this one. There won't be enough superstars on the team left, they will get impatient and leave.
We should as a matter of decency say if football is really their passion that we will help them transfer but conversely if they want to stay at NU we will have academic scholarships for them so they can bring to a conclusion what they started. We can tell them their football skills are no longer required but we don't have to shaft them and I am not suggesting we do.
Maybe we just had a bad day. Or maybe Duke is really good (and thus we are not as bad as we looked, we just ran into a brick wall). But today we looked like one of those "University of Southern North Dakota at Hoople" teams that are paid to play teams like Ohio State and Alabama early and end up losing by fifty points with the game over after the first drive.
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Duke's arguably the 2nd best team that we play this year behind only Penn State. Top 3 for sure with Penn State and Iowa but I think Duke is more complete than Iowa (especially on offense).
No reason to overreact to today's result. Duke's been in a much better situation than us the past 2 years.
No reason to overreact to today's result. Duke's been in a much better situation than us the past 2 years.
If all this B1G money and "superconference" stuff means anything, we ought to poach Elko, or at least poach Duke's S & C coach.
If we are going to participate in the B1G’s lucrative TV contract, we have an obligation to field competitive teams, revenue sports in particular. If we are not competitive (in football), it’s like stealing money. With respect to football, I have ZERO confidence that Schill and Gragg can get us to where we need to be. Therefore, BOT needs to take a more active role in seeing that our football program is positioned for success (prudent changes to admissions & the portal). Oh, and find replacements for Schill and Gragg.
Meanwhile, Duke went from being a regional school to an international top school at our level, in no small.part because of the notoriety of the hoops program.
The B1G needs a patsy that gives other teams an easy win and allows them to rest starters for part of the game. That’s our contribution moving forward and it has value.
Reacting, not overreacting. NU football is now, what, into their fourth year of serious losing? Who knows what will happen the rest of the way this year, they could win a couple. My point is we are not near Duke, where we ought to be, at least. It is a disgrace of sorts.
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Gragg is dead man walking. He won’t be making the next hire. Also, wtf are there like 70 BOT members? How is that even remotely efficient?
Fair, Duke's current level is where we were for quite a while until 2021, and it is where we should expect to be.
Just speaks to how tough it is when you miss on both coordinator hires and the system that we had in place until 2020 is no longer there.
An elite University's BOT is basically a grift for the University to reward donors.
Yeah, I was thinking the same thing. Why in the world do we need 70 trustees?
Who in the world are these people and do many of them really care about Northwestern? Or this just something to add to their resumes and lists of accomplishments to show others how important they are.
Notice also that most of them are tied somehow to various financial organizations. Largley fund management.
These are "money people" and my guess is that very few of them really care about NU sports programs.
Well, if that's true it's a lousy system. What you are indicating is that the university is basically for sale and I find that be rather repulsive.
I don't think it used to be that way, so this is something fairly recent. And it leaves me with a very poor feeling about the school.
Just like the problem with football expansion everything now is about money, money, and more money. It's really sad that we have devolved into this.
The current BOT has been plenty active in the hirings of Schill and Gragg, as well as the firing of Fitz. Why would you put any more trust in them? Clear out the BOT first, or expect new NU AD Tim Beckman
The more I think about what's happening with the BOT the more repulsed I am by it. I guess that until now I didn't realize what was happening. Most of these people are being added apparently for their money.
Not because they know much about how to run a univesity;
not because they necessarily really care about NU;
not necessarily because they have an abililty to really make a difference in the school;
and not necessarily because they are any smarter than a lot of other people who could be appoined.
But just because they give us some money.
That's a lousy reason. It essentially says your soul is for sale.
Not because they know much about how to run a univesity;
not because they necessarily really care about NU;
not necessarily because they have an abililty to really make a difference in the school;
and not necessarily because they are any smarter than a lot of other people who could be appoined.
But just because they give us some money.
That's a lousy reason. It essentially says your soul is for sale.
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I am not saying that "selling" BOT seats is acceptable, but not sure why that automatically leads to the idea that they cannot be trusted with a hire.
Think of it this way - aren't "money types" usually very "hard charging", demanding and "cut the bull, show me the results" types? Show me your sales results says Mr. VP at Merk. Show me how many cases you won and lost if you want to work for my law firm says mister Law Partner. Show me your previous movie grosses says Mr Movie Studio CEO, etc.
Wouldn't we want people like that in charge more than "sunshine and lollipop" people or very academic out of touch people?
Again, not saying I like it but the first thought I have is NOT "oh no, they will botch this". Perhaps quite the opposite. "We will not hire anyone who has not coached or been a coordinator on a national championship team and spare me you stories of giving someone a first time chance and whatnot. We just did that with Braun and look what happened to him!" Wanna get hired? Show me the money and there better be a lot of it.
I'm keeping an open mind.
Think of it this way - aren't "money types" usually very "hard charging", demanding and "cut the bull, show me the results" types? Show me your sales results says Mr. VP at Merk. Show me how many cases you won and lost if you want to work for my law firm says mister Law Partner. Show me your previous movie grosses says Mr Movie Studio CEO, etc.
Wouldn't we want people like that in charge more than "sunshine and lollipop" people or very academic out of touch people?
Again, not saying I like it but the first thought I have is NOT "oh no, they will botch this". Perhaps quite the opposite. "We will not hire anyone who has not coached or been a coordinator on a national championship team and spare me you stories of giving someone a first time chance and whatnot. We just did that with Braun and look what happened to him!" Wanna get hired? Show me the money and there better be a lot of it.
I'm keeping an open mind.
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Really good point Peaty but “clearing out” the BOT in addition to replacing Schill and Gragg is a big ask. My gut feel is that the easy lift here is to replace Gragg. Schill has already earned his dismissal and is one high profile mistake away from getting his walking papers. Reforming the BOT is going to be very difficult given that many trustees are large donors as pointed out by Rhabdo and Hail To Purple above.
Two thoughts with respect to the BOT:
(1) Chairman Peter Barris deserves more scrutiny for presiding over this mess along with Schill and Gragg. Barris has been Chairman of the Board since Sept ‘22, having previously served as Vice Chair. He also headed up the Presidential Search Committee, which recommended Rebecca Blank and (I assume) Michael Schill. In my opinion, Barris has should be held to account, along with Schill and Gragg. If the BOT has a tradition of being “hands off “, maybe they need to get more involved in key decisions.
(2) I don’t know how our BOT is structured or how it operates. But I do know that it is in a position of lending its voice in support of NU athletics. If one does not exist, why not form a Committee on Athletics at the Board level? The Committee could be comprised of trustees that support athletics such as Pat Ryan, Steve Wilson, Bob Hayward, Paul Schneider and others. Many of us have spoken out about our next new HC and the reset of our football program. This Committee could do a deep dive on key issues such as admissions, the portal and NIL and help NU figure out how it can be competitive in the new landscape while maintaining our high standards. Without a voice at the BOT level, we are putting our athletic future in the hands of incompetents (Gragg) or eggheads (Schill). In the end, administrators will be charged with making decisions but the Committee on Athletics can help influence those decisions.
It’s common sense thinking like this that the BOT has failed to provide thus far. They will dump Gragg and think this is enough. That is only the obvious step 1 and if all 70 can’t see this they shouldn’t be in the Board.
I can’t like this post enough. Bravo!
Yeah and it’s likely that he is Gragg’s biggest internal champion
Back on topic, I think because of the hazing scandal a 100% reboot will be necessary. It will hurt because I think we’ll lose more guys to the portal than we did this year.
Aside from a coaching standpoint the new HC may insist from his attorney that no existing player-facing coach or staff can remain from a liability standpoint.
Aside from a coaching standpoint the new HC may insist from his attorney that no existing player-facing coach or staff can remain from a liability standpoint.
Who's going to hold them to account? This is a Catch Twenty-Two" situation, or maybe more so, a circle jerk
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How to structure or operate a Board is way above my pay grade. But when you have weak leadership (Schill & Gragg) someone has to get involved or NU athletics will head south quickly. This is why I suggested that we form a Committee on Athletics, where trustees who support athletics can have a voice. In terms of holding our leaders to account, money talks. We may see that play out at year end when many donors make their giving decisions for 2023.
I would not be so quick to push Braun out. Let us see what he does.
As for Duke 'figuring it out', there is more than one formula for success. I agree, we need a better AD and better system, than we have, currently, but let us not think that the Duke way is the only way. The Fitz era saw the Cats go 110-101, with a 5-5 bowl record. In that time, Duke was 85-124, with a 4-3 bowl record. A deeper dive shows that in 2006 and 2007, Duke went 1-23, under Ted Roof. He was replaced by David Cutcliffe, who built the current program, but clearly took his lumps, too, with an overall record of 77-97. Up until three years ago, Fitz had Mike Hankwitz. That made all of the difference. The Cats were 87-63 in the Hank regime. Until Hank retired, I doubt any of us would have said we need to do things the Duke way.
I agree with us changing things up, but I am not sure the Duke way needs to be our way. Fitz was an amazing ambassador for our school (until he wasn't) who could recruit and motivate like no other. However, he was not an X and O guy or the primary developer of talent. We have no idea what Braun can, or, cannot do.
We need better coaching, player development, able recruiting, and a supportive administration and fan base. All of these are possible (in what way it will get done, I cannot answer). When Barnett said he would take the Purple to Pasadena, it was something that seemed impossible, quixotic, laughable. After that season, nothing seemed impossible anymore.
Let us hope that we can use this crisis as an opportunity to get better. Go Cats!
The Big Ten has a rule that all 4-year scholarships are honored. That's why Vassar continued to occupy a scholarship spot on our basketball team when he wasn't playing. Collins tried to force him out but he couldn't.
I THINK the PAC-12 has the same rule, but Colorado was probably able to encourage many players to leave because they knew they wouldn't play.
NU has lots of athletes who committed here for the education, and like Vassar, I don't think threatening to not play them is necessarily going to encourage as many players to leave as Colorado.
I think if anyone tells the player they aren’t going to play the player will depart. Only exception I see is the guy close to the diploma.
I think the problem will be our better younger guys with some experience may look for greener pastures ( are there any that aren’t right now). The ones we want to keep and Gragg will do nothing to convince them the value proposition that they came here for still exists. I feel awful for the players. Everyone else can go jump in a lake.
I just think NU has more Vassars than your average team. Even Richardson got his degree first before burning it all down.
Honoring the scholarship for 4 years doesn’t mean they continue to count against the limit. If they medically retire or transfer or whatnot, they are not “occupying a scholarship spot.”
Cutcliffe went to a conference championship game 5 years before Fitz got to one, and when the program hit a wall and then started to erode, Dook had no problem changing direction - which has reaped rewards.
What's most troublesome is that even during the last Cutcliffe seasons, the Cats were on the losing side and often, it wasn't close.
What's most troublesome is that even during the last Cutcliffe seasons, the Cats were on the losing side and often, it wasn't close.
I'm sure Collins would have loved the spot that Vassar was occupying. Vassar would not transfer and you can't just pretend that somebody is medically retiring.
