State of Recruiting

[scru]

Seriously?? This is sarcasm, right? There is more talent on this roster than NU has ever had, top to bottom. NU is not Dule or Kentucky. Lower your expectations for instant gratification and trust in the process. The new facilities aren't even tourable yet! He's selling a vision and doing so successfully. Wait until he has an actual product to sell!

 

[CommodoresAndCats]

Collins built a tournament team once, he can do it again.

 

[Medill90]

If the last five years is what "sucks at recruiting" is like, I'll take sucks at recruiting.

 

[IGNORE2]

Three thoughts:
IF Lathon hadn't flamed out you wouldn't have been able to write this. Hard to see how that was CC's fault.

You left out grad transfer Ryan Taylor, who led his league in scoring and appears to be a solid addition. Pretty sure NU wasn't his only option, so give some props for Collins' ability to recruit him.

And finally, Collins recruited Anthony Gaines who is on one list of players to pop this season.

True, "if wishes were horses...blah blah blah" If X, Y, Z had signed with NU, I would not have been able to write this. None of us seem to know the Lathon story, including any leading indicators. Non-issue

I have seen Taylor described currently as a wing. Coming out of HS, he was a guard. He had few assists per game last year. He's 6'6". I dunno - not going to split hairs. He is not a PG or LG - fair enough?

"If wishes..." Wasn't Lindsey supposed to be the anchor after breaking out? Wasn't Mac supposed to make another jump each year after camping with Curry? Wasn't RI supposed to be a difference maker? Wasn't Falzon supposed to break out last year? Wasn't Brown supposed to make Ash irrelevant? I hope Gaines makes a big jump, but I don't put money in the bank of these kind of assertions. At any rate, I'm talking recruiting - and right now, things aren't looking rosy.

 

[NJCat]

True, "if wishes were horses...blah blah blah" If X, Y, Z had signed with NU, I would not have been able to write this. None of us seem to know the Lathon story, including any leading indicators. Non-issue

I have seen Taylor described currently as a wing. Coming out of HS, he was a guard. He had few assists per game last year. He's 6'6". I dunno - not going to split hairs. He is not a PG or LG - fair enough?

"If wishes..." Wasn't Lindsey supposed to be the anchor after breaking out? Wasn't Mac supposed to make another jump each year after camping with Curry? Wasn't RI supposed to be a difference maker? Wasn't Falzon supposed to break out last year? Wasn't Brown supposed to make Ash irrelevant? I hope Gaines makes a big jump, but I don't put money in the bank of these kind of assertions. At any rate, I'm talking recruiting - and right now, things aren't looking rosy.

We can come back to this in January after the season is well under way.

 

[IGNORE2]

If the last five years is what "sucks at recruiting" is like, I'll take sucks at recruiting.

Ok, let's examine:

Current - none
This fall - Kopp, Nance & Young - two real promising and one project
Last fall - Gaines - Promising prospect (has not yet arrived)
Prior fall - Benson, Brown & RI - one guy that some people like, others do not (still has two years though), other two guys gone and non factors
Before them - Falzon, Pardon & Ash - one stud, one disappointment so far, one guy that has one huge fan and...
let's go one more - Vassar, Lindsey, Mac, Skelly, Law - one guy gone, non-factor, one stud, one guy had a great year and other inconsequential ones, one quality bench player and one guy who hasn't exactly carried the team, had some great games, disappeared at times and has a last chance to show he was worth all the stars

The koolaiders can attack me instead of discussing the message. I am not a CCC hater, I'm just calling what I see. I think we caught lightning in a bottle two years ago. Lindsey does not project that kind of play based on the other years at NU. Mac had one of his stronger years from start to finish. Lumpkin was important, Tap played a role. Pardon was a beast. All the main pieces remained: Mac, Lindsey, Law, Pardon - plus a soph Falzon, soph Benson, etc - for them to repeat last year. I call it a lucky year as I look back now.

I look at the team as constructed: patchwork of transfers, one glaring empty schollie, only "true" PG is an incoming, re-classified frosh, a huge get frosh that our true insider says is not ready for the B!G, no backup guards except a guy that has one huge fan. Law has not shown he can be the man for a season. Summer is ending and no 13th player and nobody in the following class despite a renovated arena.

Then I look at the offers on 247 - and the big names are disappearing and the replacements aren't too different in nature to those we were accustomed to seeing in the old days. Maybe the skying isn't falling, but I think it is a fair topic for conversation. Unless you want to sit and watch the crickets chirp on this forum... ok, maybe you do. Maybe this reality scares you too and another cup of koolaid while hiding under the covers might help...

 

[IGNORE2]

We can come back to this in January after the season is well under way.

Absolutely. But what else to do you have to discuss here. You, for one, are seemingly always on this board. Might be fun to see something to read and discuss every once and awhile. Or you can turn on sports talk radio and let them talk at you instead.

 

[Medill90]

"The koolaiders can attack me instead of discussing the message."

I see what you did there.

Respect.

 

[DaCat]

"The koolaiders can attack me instead of discussing the message."

I see what you did there.

Respect.

I'd rather drink koolaid than arsenic.

 

[freewillie07]

Ok, let's examine:

Current - none
This fall - Kopp, Nance & Young - two real promising and one project
Last fall - Gaines - Promising prospect (has not yet arrived)
Prior fall - Benson, Brown & RI - one guy that some people like, others do not (still has two years though), other two guys gone and non factors
Before them - Falzon, Pardon & Ash - one stud, one disappointment so far, one guy that has one huge fan and...
let's go one more - Vassar, Lindsey, Mac, Skelly, Law - one guy gone, non-factor, one stud, one guy had a great year and other inconsequential ones, one quality bench player and one guy who hasn't exactly carried the team, had some great games, disappeared at times and has a last chance to show he was worth all the stars

The koolaiders can attack me instead of discussing the message. I am not a CCC hater, I'm just calling what I see. I think we caught lightning in a bottle two years ago. Lindsey does not project that kind of play based on the other years at NU. Mac had one of his stronger years from start to finish. Lumpkin was important, Tap played a role. Pardon was a beast. All the main pieces remained: Mac, Lindsey, Law, Pardon - plus a soph Falzon, soph Benson, etc - for them to repeat last year. I call it a lucky year as I look back now.

I look at the team as constructed: patchwork of transfers, one glaring empty schollie, only "true" PG is an incoming, re-classified frosh, a huge get frosh that our true insider says is not ready for the B!G, no backup guards except a guy that has one huge fan. Law has not shown he can be the man for a season. Summer is ending and no 13th player and nobody in the following class despite a renovated arena.

Then I look at the offers on 247 - and the big names are disappearing and the replacements aren't too different in nature to those we were accustomed to seeing in the old days. Maybe the skying isn't falling, but I think it is a fair topic for conversation. Unless you want to sit and watch the crickets chirp on this forum... ok, maybe you do. Maybe this reality scares you too and another cup of koolaid while hiding under the covers might help...

I appreciate your posts on this topic. I think it's fair to take a critical look at Collins's recruiting over the past several years and draw the conclusion that it's a step up from the past regime, but not at a level *yet* that will solidify NU's place in the top tier of the Big Ten.

Lead guard has been a major issue and Collins was fortunate to land BMac in his first class. He was able to gather enough pieces around him that when the bounces started going the Cats' way, they broke the Tourney streak.

That, in turn, ushered in the promise of a much-needed revamped WRA, which will help future recruiting efforts. That can't be understated.

Here's how things need to go on the recruiting trail, in my mind:

1) NU largely hits with this latest batch of offers, rather than going further down its list or hoping for "late risers." That means a class of four along the lines of LG Maceo Austin, Wings David Roddy and Yavuz Gultekin, Big Zachary Freemantle.

2) Grab another grad transfer to round out the 2019 group, maybe a Big depending on Ryan Young's development, since the team will be very young next season.

3) 2020's class will have to be big again, in this scenario, since Benson, Turner, Falzon and the possible grad transfer will be departing. Need to hit on recruits like in 2018. That will depend on how NU bounces back this year from last season's disappointment. I'm confident in the current group to get things done.

The program has reached the NCAA Tournament despite a lot of things not working out. Vassar, Lathon, IB and Ash not turning into quality backup LGs either, injury-plagued Rap, very narrowly missing on a ton of great recruits in Gaines's class. I realize a lot of programs would maybe have the same gripes, but NU's list is especially long and highly concentrated at the LG position. I'm optimistic that will soon change.

 

[IGNORE2]

I appreciate your posts on this topic. I think it's fair to take a critical look at Collins's recruiting over the past several years and draw the conclusion that it's a step up from the past regime, but not at a level *yet* that will solidify NU's place in the top tier of the Big Ten.

Lead guard has been a major issue and Collins was fortunate to land BMac in his first class. He was able to gather enough pieces around him that when the bounces started going the Cats' way, they broke the Tourney streak.

That, in turn, ushered in the promise of a much-needed revamped WRA, which will help future recruiting efforts. That can't be understated.

Here's how things need to go on the recruiting trail, in my mind:

1) NU largely hits with this latest batch of offers, rather than going further down its list or hoping for "late risers." That means a class of four along the lines of LG Maceo Austin, Wings David Roddy and Yavuz Gultekin, Big Zachary Freemantle.

2) Grab another grad transfer to round out the 2019 group, maybe a Big depending on Ryan Young's development, since the team will be very young next season.

3) 2020's class will have to be big again, in this scenario, since Benson, Turner, Falzon and the possible grad transfer will be departing. Need to hit on recruits like in 2018. That will depend on how NU bounces back this year from last season's disappointment. I'm confident in the current group to get things done.

The program has reached the NCAA Tournament despite a lot of things not working out. Vassar, Lathon, IB and Ash not turning into quality backup LGs either, injury-plagued Rap, very narrowly missing on a ton of great recruits in Gaines's class. I realize a lot of programs would maybe have the same gripes, but NU's list is especially long and highly concentrated at the LG position. I'm optimistic that will soon change.

This is the type of response that will raise the quality of the board.

And I hope your right. I have similar thoughts. My two biggest worries are LG and the frosh. A major injury or another flop in Nance or Kopp will really hurt whatever momentum remains.

I think an NIT is our high water mark this year.

 

[Catreporter]

NU's place in the top tier of the Big Ten.

Good grief. We're talking about a program that was historically bad before Chris got here. Expectations seem a little outsized to me. Northwestern still has a more limited recruiting pool than many other BIG schools. We just got the gorilla off our back, and the new arena and practice facilities aren't quite done yet. Top tier of the BIG is aiming a little high right now.

 

[freewillie07]

Good grief. We're talking about a program that was historically bad before Chris got here. Expectations seem a little outsized to me. Northwestern still has a more limited recruiting pool than many other BIG schools. We just got the gorilla off our back, and the new arena and practice facilities aren't quite done yet. Top tier of the BIG is aiming a little high right now.

Yes, that was my point. People get excited about the recruits Collins brings in (Nance/Kopp) but it's worth a reminder that those guys just make NU competitive in the jam-packed middle of the Big Ten.

The recruiting, as it is today, is very obviously not strong enough for NU to become the "Duke of the Big Ten." A realistic goal for Collins would be getting it to a level that finishing outside the top half of the conference is a disappointment.

 

[hdhntr1]

I appreciate your posts on this topic. I think it's fair to take a critical look at Collins's recruiting over the past several years and draw the conclusion that it's a step up from the past regime, but not at a level *yet* that will solidify NU's place in the top tier of the Big Ten.

Lead guard has been a major issue and Collins was fortunate to land BMac in his first class. He was able to gather enough pieces around him that when the bounces started going the Cats' way, they broke the Tourney streak.

That, in turn, ushered in the promise of a much-needed revamped WRA, which will help future recruiting efforts. That can't be understated.

Here's how things need to go on the recruiting trail, in my mind:

1) NU largely hits with this latest batch of offers, rather than going further down its list or hoping for "late risers." That means a class of four along the lines of LG Maceo Austin, Wings David Roddy and Yavuz Gultekin, Big Zachary Freemantle.

2) Grab another grad transfer to round out the 2019 group, maybe a Big depending on Ryan Young's development, since the team will be very young next season.

3) 2020's class will have to be big again, in this scenario, since Benson, Turner, Falzon and the possible grad transfer will be departing. Need to hit on recruits like in 2018. That will depend on how NU bounces back this year from last season's disappointment. I'm confident in the current group to get things done.

The program has reached the NCAA Tournament despite a lot of things not working out. Vassar, Lathon, IB and Ash not turning into quality backup LGs either, injury-plagued Rap, very narrowly missing on a ton of great recruits in Gaines's class. I realize a lot of programs would maybe have the same gripes, but NU's list is especially long and highly concentrated at the LG position. I'm optimistic that will soon change.

Whether it is called LG or PG, the issues are not new. In the years before Collins we generally did not have more than one PG on the roster