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TJ Green?

Wildcatfootball12

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Sep 3, 2011
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I promise I'm not trying to be annoying, but I just think he is a cool story

https://www.foxsports.com/kansas-ci...xperts-missed-key-measurable-his-heart-020415

Does anyone that knows anything know if he is actually in the picture? Or is this just between Marty and Smith?

Is he a legit D1 player, or just another walk-on whose primary purpose is as a practice arm? 6'2" 190, if those are his real stats, seem big enough to me
 
Here are his senior highlights.(could not embed for some reason).

There is certainly some stuff to like there, particularly his mobility in the pocket. He shows pretty good accuracy, and the arm strength is sufficient for intermediate routes.

I think the concerns (and lack of P5) offers probably focus on his size and arm strength. A lot of his passes are from rollouts (and he throws pretty well moving to his left), which are probably designed to give him better visibility downfield. He's probably no more than 6'. Also, his arm is not going to stretch the field (not that our receivers do, either).

I'd agree with the article's assertion that if he was 6'3", he'd have a bunch of offers. He probably would.Still, this is a great QB to have as a walk-on. Maybe he will surprise us.
 
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Here are his senior highlights.(could not embed for some reason).

There is certainly some stuff to like there, particularly his mobility in the pocket. He shows pretty good accuracy, and the arm strength is sufficient for intermediate routes.

I think the concerns (and lack of P5) offers probably focus on his size and arm strength. A lot of his passes are from rollouts (and he throws pretty well moving to his left), which are probably designed to give him better visibility downfield. He's probably no more than 6'. Also, his arm is not going to stretch the field (not that our receivers do, either).

I'd agree with the article's assertion that if he was 6'3", he'd have a bunch of offers. He probably would.Still, this is a great QB to have as a walk-on. Maybe he will surprise us.
Walk-ons have always been good for NU but I don't think we have had one who was a starter or immediate back-up. Other positions have always been good to us (LB, OL, DB) but QB is a big zero, as a walk-on.
 
Can we please stop arguing the exception?
Because there is no exception. It is common. We have had numerous walkons from Barry Gardner to so many others. Not just here but at bigtime schools as well. Clay Matthews, JJ Watt, etc. The list goes on. Walk On's are simply not the exception anymore. Period. Cripes, I watched a walkon wr lead Auburn in receiving this week. I'm sure Fitz knows this as well and that is why Green is going to get reps. Deny it if you want, but Fitz has him on the team because he belongs. Whether he beats the others out, who knows? Do you? So stop with your nonsense GCG. You don't know who is going to be the QB either. Cripes! One day you are arguing against 5 star QB's the next day you are claiming lower stars and walk ons don't have a chance. Who knows? But walk ons are not the exception anymore.
 
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Because there is no exception. It is common. We have had numerous walkons from Barry Gardner to so many others. Not just here but at bigtime schools as well. Clay Matthews, JJ Watt, etc. The list goes on. Walk On's are simply not the exception anymore. Period. Cripes, I watched a walkon wr lead Auburn in receiving this week. I'm sure Fitz knows this as well and that is why Green is going to get reps. Deny it if you want, but Fitz has him on the team because he belongs. Whether he beats the others out, who knows? Do you? So stop with your nonsense GCG. You don't know who is going to be the QB either. Cripes! One day you are arguing against 5 star QB's the next day you are claiming lower stars and walk ons don't have a chance. Who knows? But walk ons are not the exception anymore.

Um...actually, yeah, walk-ons starting are most definitley the exception. That's why it's such a notable story when it actually happens. Duh.
 
Walk-ons have always been good for NU but I don't think we have had one who was a starter or immediate back-up. Other positions have always been good to us (LB, OL, DB) but QB is a big zero, as a walk-on.
Does Otto Graham count? I think he came on a b-ball scholarship.
 
I promise I'm not trying to be annoying, but I just think he is a cool story

https://www.foxsports.com/kansas-ci...xperts-missed-key-measurable-his-heart-020415

Does anyone that knows anything know if he is actually in the picture? Or is this just between Marty and Smith?

Is he a legit D1 player, or just another walk-on whose primary purpose is as a practice arm? 6'2" 190, if those are his real stats, seem big enough to me
He looks decent. I’d go with Marty right now. We will likely need both guys. Marty has a solid arm.
 
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Absolutely.
True. From wiki:

"Born in Waukegan, Illinois, Graham's first interest growing up was music.[2] Encouraged by his parents, both of whom were music teachers, he took up several instruments: the piano, violin, cornet and French horn.[3][4] Graham also excelled in athletics, and attended Northwestern University on a basketball scholarship in 1940.[5] There he played on the varsity basketball team as a freshman and continued to study music.[6][7]Graham did not take up football until his sophomore year, when Northwestern coach Pappy Waldorf saw him throwing in an intramuralgame and invited him to practice with the team.[5][6] Northwestern's coaches were impressed with his running and passing, and Waldorf convinced him to sign up.[5][6] Although football became Graham's primary sport, he also played baseball and continued on the basketball team. As a senior, he was named a first-team basketball All-American, part of a squad selected by news outlets comprising the best players at each position.[3]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Graham
 

Bullshit. He counts.

One of a rare species of NFL quarterbacks from back in the day who would still be a star playing today. Jim Brown ... Otto Graham ... timeless all time greats. Generations ahead of their time.

For context, HOFers Bart Starr and Bob Griese wouldn’t sniff an NFL roster today.

GOUNUII
 
Bullshit. He counts.

One of a rare species of NFL quarterbacks from back in the day who would still be a star playing today. Jim Brown ... Otto Graham ... timeless all time greats. Generations ahead of their time.

For context, HOFers Bart Starr and Bob Griese wouldn’t sniff an NFL roster today.

GOUNUII

Almost like it’s fun to stir the pot a little with single-word posts, eh?
 
I promise I'm not trying to be annoying, but I just think he is a cool story

https://www.foxsports.com/kansas-ci...xperts-missed-key-measurable-his-heart-020415

Does anyone that knows anything know if he is actually in the picture? Or is this just between Marty and Smith?

Is he a legit D1 player, or just another walk-on whose primary purpose is as a practice arm? 6'2" 190, if those are his real stats, seem big enough to me


Man, I don't know why there is any question about it. He was our next man up after Alviti. Smith was eligible, yet the coaches had him BEHIND Green in the depth chart.

He was closer to a generous 6'0" in HS maybe shorter than that junior year when QBs are recruited, but he's on the young side as a recruit, and did some growing. That could explain why he was underrecruited.

Not saying he's going to be out Marty (I think it's Marty vs. Green), but he's legit.
 
Almost like it’s fun to stir the pot a little with single-word posts, eh?

That's not fun. It's more annoying and pointless than anything the Wrassler or Felis has ever done.

If you have an opinion and are going to be smug and pompous about it, then at leas share it. Even if you're just plain wrong.
 
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Here are his senior highlights.(could not embed for some reason).

There is certainly some stuff to like there, particularly his mobility in the pocket. He shows pretty good accuracy, and the arm strength is sufficient for intermediate routes.

I think the concerns (and lack of P5) offers probably focus on his size and arm strength. A lot of his passes are from rollouts (and he throws pretty well moving to his left), which are probably designed to give him better visibility downfield. He's probably no more than 6'. Also, his arm is not going to stretch the field (not that our receivers do, either).

I'd agree with the article's assertion that if he was 6'3", he'd have a bunch of offers. He probably would.Still, this is a great QB to have as a walk-on. Maybe he will surprise us.

How tall was Dan Persa? Doug Flutie? The more I read/watch about this kid, the more I like him. I'm not enamoured by size as much as I like the intangibles. Persa Strong > Watkins Tall.

I think it's a two horse race between Marty (whom I also like) and Green. Wouldn't sleep on Green at all.
 
Um...actually, yeah, walk-ons starting are most definitley the exception. That's why it's such a notable story when it actually happens. Duh.

It's not as exceptional as you make it. I can't think of a single NU roster that didn't have a walk-on starting. JB Butler being the latest. The walk-on program was a huge factor in Nebraska's talent pipeline, especially on the OL, during the Osbourne era. Even Alabama had a DB this year that was a walk-on.

They are about as exceptional as 2 or no star scholarship recruits starring and going onto the league, but you don't see people here restraining themselves from gushing all over their stories.

Sherrick McManus!
 
True. From wiki:

"Born in Waukegan, Illinois, Graham's first interest growing up was music.[2] Encouraged by his parents, both of whom were music teachers, he took up several instruments: the piano, violin, cornet and French horn.[3][4] Graham also excelled in athletics, and attended Northwestern University on a basketball scholarship in 1940.[5] There he played on the varsity basketball team as a freshman and continued to study music.[6][7]Graham did not take up football until his sophomore year, when Northwestern coach Pappy Waldorf saw him throwing in an intramuralgame and invited him to practice with the team.[5][6] Northwestern's coaches were impressed with his running and passing, and Waldorf convinced him to sign up.[5][6] Although football became Graham's primary sport, he also played baseball and continued on the basketball team. As a senior, he was named a first-team basketball All-American, part of a squad selected by news outlets comprising the best players at each position.[3]"

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Otto_Graham

Graham's father, Otto Sr., was band director at Waukegan HS. He was one of the judges at our district band contest when I was playing in the Glenview Jr. High band in 1960.
 
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It's not as exceptional as you make it. I can't think of a single NU roster that didn't have a walk-on starting. JB Butler being the latest. The walk-on program was a huge factor in Nebraska's talent pipeline, especially on the OL, during the Osbourne era. Even Alabama had a DB this year that was a walk-on.

They are about as exceptional as 2 or no star scholarship recruits starring and going onto the league, but you don't see people here restraining themselves from gushing all over their stories.

Sherrick McManus!

This isn't part of your silly battle with Glades over star ratings. It's just a simple part of reality. When something happens less than 4% of the time, it's pretty much the exception.
 
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Didn’t mean to start such a personal debate with the Graham question. What an amazing, accomplished person.

Anyway, none of this debate matters. Clayton is going to have his surgery and be back in 5 or 6 months. I’m the only sibling in our family who hasn’t torn an ACL. The most recent tear (my older bro) took 5 months after surgery to heal and he was back to full speed on the b-ball court. Of course not everyone is the same and football is much more physical, but I am keeping the faith for Clayton.

Please keep working on plan B for Fitz and co, but keep it civil, won’t you?
 
Because there is no exception. It is common. We have had numerous walkons from Barry Gardner to so many others. Not just here but at bigtime schools as well. Clay Matthews, JJ Watt, etc. The list goes on. Walk On's are simply not the exception anymore. Period. Cripes, I watched a walkon wr lead Auburn in receiving this week. I'm sure Fitz knows this as well and that is why Green is going to get reps. Deny it if you want, but Fitz has him on the team because he belongs. Whether he beats the others out, who knows? Do you? So stop with your nonsense GCG. You don't know who is going to be the QB either. Cripes! One day you are arguing against 5 star QB's the next day you are claiming lower stars and walk ons don't have a chance. Who knows? But walk ons are not the exception anymore.
Walk-ons, yes but walk on QB's who wind up starting and starring are much less so. Sure, Mayfield walked on, and Otto was grabbed from the IM play, but how many ther walk-on QB's do we know about? While gardner, and Austin Carr, and a number of other of our standouits were walk-ons, there are no walk-on QB's at NU that fill the bill. These ARE the exception, but they do exist. Perhaps TJ is one of them, perhaps not. Only time will tell. And this is all predicated playing in 2018, still not a guarantee. Remember it is 8 months to the first game and there are people with ACL repairs who are playing in that time frame. All this discussion is just that...not fact.
 
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How tall was Dan Persa? Doug Flutie? The more I read/watch about this kid, the more I like him. I'm not enamoured by size as much as I like the intangibles. Persa Strong > Watkins Tall.

I think it's a two horse race between Marty (whom I also like) and Green. Wouldn't sleep on Green at all.
Agree that height does not disqualify anyone.Scouts love the measurables, right? Worth noting that his dad is 6'3". Mom looks to be about 5'5" ish.
 
Walk-ons, yes but walk on QB's who wind up starting and starring are much less so. Sure, Mayfield walked on, and Otto was grabbed from the IM play, but how many ther walk-on QB's do we know about? While gardner, and Austin Carr, and a number of other of our standouits were walk-ons, there are no walk-on QB's at NU that fill the bill. These ARE the exception, but they do exist. Perhaps TJ is one of them, perhaps not. Only time will tell. And this is all predicated playing in 2018, still not a guarantee. Remember it is 8 months to the first game and there are people with ACL repairs who are playing in that time frame. All this discussion is just that...not fact.

They are unusual to be sure, but Baker Mayfield isn't a sole exception (ignoring for a moment Otto, who does really count). A few others:

Former Washington Redskin QB Colt Brennan was a walk-on QB from Hawaii who set record upon record in the NCAA. The most impressive one is his mark for consecutive games with 200 or more passing yards. He set that mark at 34, and he played only 38 games for the Warriors. He had a career completion percentage over 70, and he was an All-American once and an All-MWC selection twice. Brennan capped his college days off as a sixth-round pick in the 2008 NFL draft.

Another Hawaii QB, Bryant Moniz was a walk-on and a 3 year starter. In the fourth game of the 2011 season, Moniz tied an NCAA record by throwing seven touchdown passes in the first half in a 56–14 victory over UC Davis. Moniz finished his career with 10,169 passing yards and 75 passing touchdowns in just three seasons, both of which are third in school history, after Brennan and Timmy Chang.

Jonathan Smith who is the new head coach at Oregon State was a walk-on QB there who came in during the middle of his freshman year (with no scholarship) to lead the Beavers. Ended up a 4 year starter and as a junior, he led the Beavers to their greatest season in school history in 2001. The Beavers finished 11–1–a school record for wins, won a share of their first conference title in 36 years, and finished fourth in the country. Smith was the MVP of the Fiesta Bowl.

And then you have to also consider the plethora of great FCS/Division II QBs that went on to star in the League. Like Jimmy Garropolo (Eastern Illinois), Steve McNair (Alcorn State), Rich Gannon (Delaware) and Kurt Warner (Northern Iowa), Tony Romo (Eastern Illinois), Ryan Fitzpatrick (Harvard), Josh McCown (Sam Houston State). When Joe Flacco (Delaware) stepped onto Ryan Field, he was the best QB on either sideline much to our dismay. None of these guys had Division I offers (well, I'm guessing none, since they ended up in FCS) either, and could have opted to walk on instead at a FBS school like Green (who spurned a scholarship offer at FCS N. Dakota State). And all of them would have won the starting job at NU regardless of what year they played here since perhaps Otto Graham. Every year there are multiple FCS QBs taken in the draft. In fact, if 2015 is representative (I'm not cherry picking, it's just the one article on the topic I found), in any given year, there are multiple starters and a half a dozen or so FCS QBs on NFL rosters:

https://herosports.com/collegefootball/yes-mr-qb-you-can-make-the-nfl-from-the-fcs/

All of a sudden, the pool of great QBs who were overlooked by the big schools and not given scholarship offers, but could have starred anywhere, is much bigger than just Baker Mayfield.

I think you have to look past the statistics when you look at individual cases, just as you do when you look at no star and 2 star recruits. If a kid is special and is just being overlooked for some reason, the stars and even the scholie doesn't matter. In this case, if Green was as tall as he is now in HS, he would have gotten plenty of scholarships, at least according to his coach, who also coached Nathan Scheelhaase, who was a unanimous 4 star recruit, 4 year starter for the Iollini, and holds the Iollini record for offensive yards. Rockhurst's coach said that Scheelhaase was not nearly as skilled as Green, just bigger. Interestingly, Green is now the same 6'2" that Scheelhaase was as a HS senior.

You look at TJ Green's body of work as a HS Senior, his awards, his skill set, his heart, not to mention the bloodlines, you look at also the reasons he was overlooked - in term of his size and how he's grown a couple of inches since, and then you also consider that he is the QB that is highest on our depth chart who is healthy and returning (though of course we don't know where Marty would have been had he had not redshirted) and the prospect of him competing for the job and even winning it is not at all far fetched.

I for one am higher on his projected ceiling than I am of Jason Whittaker, just solely based on HS level production. Whittaker may have a higher absolute ceiling, but he's clearly a project. QB is a position where intangibles are as important or even more so than physical attributes, as the Siemian vs. Lynch saga attests.

FWIW, I think the position is up for grabs, and if you forced me to guess who wins I'd pick Marty (love his film - though it's easy to love everyone's highlight films - and his production in HS was impressive), but I think TJ is his main competition and will give him a run. I think Smith is behind, and Whittaker has no chance as a project and true frosh.
 
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Walk-ons, yes but walk on QB's who wind up starting and starring are much less so. Sure, Mayfield walked on, and Otto was grabbed from the IM play, but how many ther walk-on QB's do we know about? While gardner, and Austin Carr, and a number of other of our standouits were walk-ons, there are no walk-on QB's at NU that fill the bill. These ARE the exception, but they do exist. Perhaps TJ is one of them, perhaps not. Only time will tell. And this is all predicated playing in 2018, still not a guarantee. Remember it is 8 months to the first game and there are people with ACL repairs who are playing in that time frame. All this discussion is just that...not fact.

Randy Dean was a walk on and was good enough for a cup of coffee in the NFL.
 
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Great post, ECat, and seeing that Green was ahead of Smith on the depth chart at the bowl game, it doesn't make his emergence such a longshot after all, especially since his body seems to have filled out in his two years at NU. This is why football recruiting is a little more of an inexact science than basketball.
 
Randy Dean was a walk on and was good enough for a cup of coffee in the NFL.

I'm not sure but was Len Williams a walk-on? At the very least, my understanding is that he was a fullback who moved to QB when an offensive coach saw him throwing the football during warm-ups, and then was pressed into a starting role and ended up starting 4 years.
 
They are unusual to be sure, but Baker Mayfield isn't a sole exception (ignoring for a moment Otto, who does really count). A few others:

Former Washington Redskin QB Colt Brennan was a walk-on QB from Hawaii who set record upon record in the NCAA. The most impressive one is his mark for consecutive games with 200 or more passing yards. He set that mark at 34, and he played only 38 games for the Warriors. He had a career completion percentage over 70, and he was an All-American once and an All-MWC selection twice. Brennan capped his college days off as a sixth-round pick in the 2008 NFL draft.

Another Hawaii QB, Bryant Moniz was a walk-on and a 3 year starter. In the fourth game of the 2011 season, Moniz tied an NCAA record by throwing seven touchdown passes in the first half in a 56–14 victory over UC Davis. Moniz finished his career with 10,169 passing yards and 75 passing touchdowns in just three seasons, both of which are third in school history, after Brennan and Timmy Chang.

Jonathan Smith who is the new head coach at Oregon State was a walk-on QB there who came in during the middle of his freshman year (with no scholarship) to lead the Beavers. Ended up a 4 year starter and as a junior, he led the Beavers to their greatest season in school history in 2001. The Beavers finished 11–1–a school record for wins, won a share of their first conference title in 36 years, and finished fourth in the country. Smith was the MVP of the Fiesta Bowl.

And then you have to also consider the plethora of great FCS/Division II QBs that went on to star in the League. Like Jimmy Garropolo (Eastern Illinois), Steve McNair (Alcorn State), Rich Gannon (Delaware) and Kurt Warner (Northern Iowa), Tony Romo (Eastern Illinois), Ryan Fitzpatrick (Harvard), Josh McCown (Sam Houston State). When Joe Flacco (Delaware) stepped onto Ryan Field, he was the best QB on either sideline much to our dismay. None of these guys had Division I offers (well, I'm guessing none, since they ended up in FCS) either, and could have opted to walk on instead at a FBS school like Green (who spurned a scholarship offer at FCS N. Dakota State). And all of them would have won the starting job at NU regardless of what year they played here since perhaps Otto Graham. Every year there are multiple FCS QBs taken in the draft. In fact, in a given year, there are multiple starters and a dozen or so FCS QBs on NFL rosters:

https://herosports.com/collegefootball/yes-mr-qb-you-can-make-the-nfl-from-the-fcs/

All of a sudden, the pool of great QBs who were overlooked by the big schools and not given scholarship offers, but could have starred anywhere, is much bigger than just Baker Mayfield.

I think you have to look past the statistics when you look at individual cases, just as you do when you look at no star and 2 star recruits. If a kid is special and is just being overlooked for some reason, the stars and even the scholie doesn't matter. In this case, if Green was as tall as he is now in HS, he would have gotten plenty of scholarships, at least according to his coach, who also coached Nathan Scheelhaase, who was a unanimous 4 star recruit, 4 year starter for the Iollini, and holds the Iollini record for offensive yards. Rockhurst's coach said that Scheelhaase was not nearly as skilled as Green, just bigger. Interestingly, Green is now the same 6'2" that Scheelhaase was as a HS senior.

You look at TJ Green's body of work as a HS Senior, his awards, his skill set, his heart, not to mention the bloodlines, you look at also the reasons he was overlooked - in term of his size and how he's grown a couple of inches since, and then you also consider that he is the QB that is highest on our depth chart who is healthy and returning (though of course we don't know where Marty would have been had he had not redshirted) and the prospect of him competing for the job and even winning it is not at all far fetched.

I for one am higher on his projected ceiling than I am of Jason Whittaker, just solely based on HS level production. Whittaker may have a higher absolute ceiling, but he's clearly a project. QB is a position where intangibles are as important or even more so than physical attributes, as the Siemian vs. Lynch saga attests.

FWIW, I think the position is up for grabs, and if you forced me to guess who wins I'd pick Marty (love his film - though it's easy to love everyone's highlight films - and his production in HS was impressive), but I think TJ is his main competition and will give him a run. I think Smith is behind, and Whittaker has no chance as a project and true frosh.
So Smith is behind due to not being listed as the third string on the 2017 depth chart? I’d like to hear from people who have been to practice and see both throw and execute the offense before I buy into he is behind.
 
It's fun to debate the QB situation, helps during the post-season doldrums. I'm rooting for all the backups to do well. Looking forward to see who emerges, while hoping for a speedy recovery for Thorson.

Would love to see Green step up because he's the underdog and it would be a great story if he took command of the position.

Marty seems to have the highest ceiling. If he wins the job he could be a multi-year starter after Thorson graduates.

Smith is also the forgotten man even though he seemed to have an impressive off season last year.

Whittaker is the callow freshman longshot.
 
So Smith is behind due to not being listed as the third string on the 2017 depth chart? I’d like to hear from people who have been to practice and see both throw and execute the offense before I buy into he is behind.

1st string: Thorson
2nd string: Alviti
3rd string: Green

What is it that you don't understand?
 
And then you have to also consider the plethora of great FCS/Division II QBs that went on to star in the League. Like Jimmy Garropolo (Eastern Illinois), Steve McNair (Alcorn State), Rich Gannon (Delaware) and Kurt Warner (Northern Iowa), Tony Romo (Eastern Illinois), Ryan Fitzpatrick (Harvard), Josh McCown (Sam Houston State). When Joe Flacco (Delaware) stepped onto Ryan Field, he was the best QB on either sideline much to our dismay. None of these guys had Division I offers (well, I'm guessing none, since they ended up in FCS) either, and could have opted to walk on instead at a FBS school like Green (who spurned a scholarship offer at FCS N. Dakota State).
Great post, E-Cat. You missed one of the more obvious examples in Carson Wentz (North Dakota St.). Regarding Flacco, we never played Delaware IIRC.
 
Great post, E-Cat. You missed one of the more obvious examples in Carson Wentz (North Dakota St.). Regarding Flacco, we never played Delaware IIRC.

My bad. I still have nightmares about our loss to UNH and projecting Joe Flacco and Delaware as our opponent makes it feel better somehow. In any case, the FCS QB was the best QB on either sideline that day.

Good catch on Wentz. TJ Green had a scholarship to play at his alma mater.
 
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Graham's father, Otto Sr., was band director at Waukegan HS. He was one of the judges at our district band contest when I was playing in the Glenview Jr. High band in 1960.
Think he also played with NUMB.
 
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