I sure don't see any NU NIL effort being able to do anything close to that
Well, at least like NU they've got a big endowment
- Thread starter pawildcat
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There’s definitely the resources there to do it, if (I) the relevant donors want do participate in NIL and (II) NU changes its institutional philosophy, mostly on the football side. Fitz was pretty open that he didn’t want to use NIL as a recruiting tactic, instead preferring his ”minimum wage” construct that may be good for locker room harmony but is a non-factor in recruiting. A new HC is likely to have a different view and, assuming some of the bigger-ticket donors are on board, we could actually ramp up a pretty effective NIL regime pretty quickly.
The weird thing is that we are apparently OK using NIL as a player retainage tool rather than a player recruitment tool. Have heard that we threw a decent-sized number at Pete Nance before he took a similar offer from UNC, then another decent-sized number at both Boo Buie and Chase Audige this past offseason. If we can move some of those resources to recruiting, then we can really start making some waves. It isn’t/wasn’t multiple millions of dollars, but certainly enough to move the needle.
Sorry but not so sure I see it, First I don't believe it is classified as a charitable donation and lot of our big donors tend to go more for physical things that stay and they can write off rather than paychecks that are gone and are not tax deductible as they are not writing the checks to NU. One thing to come up with money for a couple hundred K for a couple key guys on a basketball team and something quite different to come up with 10s of millions it would take for a viable FB NIL program. And if it cannot be written off, much harder to justify
If you live in the Bay Area you'll realize why Stanford has such problems.
Literally NO ONE GIVES A SHIT about Stanford football.
TrueNU is a registered 501(c)(3) to which donations are tax deductible. That deductibility and treatment is up for some debate, but is currently true.
You also don’t need “tens of millions of dollars” to make for a viable FB NIL program. You aren’t gonna be paying every single signee a couple million bucks. More like offering up signing bonuses to the legitimately impact recruits for whom it is a factor in their decision, which is probably more in the range of a couple million bucks a year at most.
Regardless, there are plenty of folks out there with sufficiently large pocket books who could pony up some cash without perfect tax efficiency… I just don’t think NU/TrueNU really asked because Fitz didn’t want to push us in that direction.
Into the hundreds of thousands of dollars, one-time and up-front.
My point wasn't that NU should recruit as well as Stanford (on paper), altho the program should get 2-4 4* most years, but that despite the higher rated recruiting classes, Stanford is in pretty much the same spot as the Cats due to missing on too many recruits, lack of player development and stale coaching/schemes, if not inept coaching (not playing to your strengths and away from your weaknesses).
If you hadn't noticed, Wake is 3-0 despite Hartman now playing for the Domers.
And sure, Wake isn't as restricted by academic standards, but like I have stated, there are enough qualified players to fill the rosters of NU, Stanford and Dook many times over, not to mention NU being more appealing than Wake to recruits in a no of ways.
Speaking of Dook, on paper, their recruiting classes have been pretty similar to those for the Cats - and yet, we have been seeing dramatically different results on the gridiron.
The difference being that they have hit on and/or develop their recruits better and put them in a better position to win.
That's all on coaching.
- On a side note, in the latest USNWR rankings, NU is tied for 9th with JHU and Brown.
Dook is tied for 7th and Stanford tied for 3rd (UChi also drops below NU).
A no. of changes to the ranking criteria such as no longer taking class size and alumni giving into account.
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The issue in recruiting is that even the academically-qualified players usually view themselves as football players first and will choose better football before better academics. Guys like Taylor Decker, etc. So while there are plenty of guys who are qualified on paper, it’s not like those guys are JUST choosing between NU, Stanford, Duke, etc. but also more “football factories.”
Was also pretty clear that Wake is doing well in large part because Clawson is good, Hartman just accelerated that program.
It is not just the more academic institutions that are going for that select group of the 10-15% we can actually get through admissions. It is that everyone else is going after them as well. They can go anywhere. If they see themselves playing at the next level, they see their chances of getting there higher at bigger programs. Result is that probably only 10-15% of that group actually ends up at us or our peers. (And the only one of them that has standards truly in line with NU's is probably Standford) So that brings us down to only 2%of the total actually buy that the value of the education at us or our peers is truly worth more than going to a bigger time program.
Nice that something is deductible but have to think that that deductiblity is under question. So OK, what is that number? There are 85 scholarships. If each one got even $10K per year that would be about $1M. Do starters get more? Target positions? (DE, DT, DB, WR, RB and of course QB) $100-200K each? Can't think it is just one time or you are very likely to lose them to competitors. You are very quickly in the $3-5 million annual range if not more. And that is just to get by. But to truly be competitive have to think the price tags are a lot higher
Hard to see nothing going to the other players and also to just see it as a signing bonus, If they are any good, what is to keep them from defecting and taking another offer after the first year? Have to think it has to be ongoing rather than one time. Maybe bigger up front but something ongoing or it would be what have you done for me lately.
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Are you talking about the way Fitz wanted to use NIL or the way in which most other schools use NIL?
Fitz wanted a “minimum salary” concept where all players on the roster regardless of position or scholarship status got the same amount within the same graduating year with the amount escalating by year. While I don’t have exact numbers, think something like $10k/year for the first year, $15k for the second, $20k for the third, etc. All-in something like $50-75k per player for their four years, presumably a bit more if they stick around for a fifth or sixth year. Roll that all together across 105 guys and you’re looking at ~$5.25-7.9MM that is spent on the entire roster over 4 years or ~$1.3-2.0MM/year.
I would much rather disproportionately allocate those resources to upfront payments at positions that are 1) most impactful to our team success and 2) most likely to be considering NIL as part of their recruiting process. Call it ~$300-500k on a top-level QB, ~$100-200k on a couple top-level WR, then ~$50-200k on guys who are looking for that level of incentive. I do NOT think that an entire recruiting class at NU will require upfront NIL payments as there will still be a subset of guys where 1) the education matters enough and/or 2) they don’t need the money. Then guys are obviously free to sign whatever NIL deals they want during their career, the higher-profile guys earning more and the lower-profile guys earning less as the market dictates. Can also use the balance of whatever funds you have left after your “signing bonuses” to redirect back to guys.
Either way, quite frankly… $3-5MM/year isn’t really all that much when you’re talking about resources available to some of our alumni. Shoot, SMU recently raised $100MM in seven days to support their move to the ACC: https://www.cbssports.com/college-f...from-key-donors-to-support-upcoming-acc-move/
TL;DR: If NU actually wants to be competitive in today’s recruiting/college football environment, then we are going to need our boosters to support the kind of NIL program being run by 99% of other institutions.
Those were the offers to Boo Buie, Chase Audige, and Pete Nance for their final year of eligibility (at least as far as I understand it).
Those were one time fees because each only had one year remaining. But we are talking the FB program and bringing in new recruits. Hard to keep them with just a one time payment signing bonus Have to think it would require ongoing payments if you are going to keep them, Otherwise what is to keep some other program coming in and offering then another "signing bonus" to go somewhere else. And they aren't going to do that because they are busts but because they are actually descent. That is why I see it as needing ongoing payments a lot higher than what you suggest
I don’t think we would be looking at multiple hundreds of thousands of dollars each and every year. There aren’t many college football players out there getting that. We are looking at a significant upfront one-time payment then a much more modest guaranteed amount (if any) over time. It’s a much better recruiting incentive than the “minimum salary” concept.
If a kid wants to cash in his payday a second time, then fine… go replace him with another player out of either the portal or in HS recruiting. The NCAA changed their rules so there is only one “free” transfer and a second would cost a year of eligibility; I don’t see too many guys giving up a year even if it comes with a nice payday.
Welcome to modern college football/personnel management. Jump on board or we are gonna be left in the dust.
Basically a legacy admission thanks to his father's stardom
I'm not necessarily talking about 4*, much less 5* recruits (who largely end up at the factories).
There are plenty of talented 3* recruits with academics to fill the roster many times over, but the problem recently had been too many misses with the 3* recruits Fitz and staff had gone with.
Case in point, the struggles the BB program underwent after breaking the Tourney streak despite having more 4* recruits than probably anytime in its history.
Last season's Tourney team was built with the right 3* recruits.
Yes, it's more difficult to actually evaluate the talent and not just follow the hype/star rankings, but the program had been doing a poor job of that lately.
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