Collins quote from after the game

[EvanstonCat]

"You older guys, man, thank you. Me and my staff will do anything for you guys. What you've done for us these three years, to get this where it is.. you guys were amazing to coach. Amazing to coahc. You guys hold your heads high. Hold your heads high. [To Demps] You're about to become a dad. That's awesome. That's awesome.

"We gotta know deep down inside. We gotta know. It's gotta be a burning fire in us coming in next year. There's gotta be a fire in our group going forward that we've never seen before. Because I promise you I'm going to have it."

Lifted from Inside NU. But, had to repost here. This is why he is the right coach for NU.

 

[FloridAlum]

I hope you actually listened to the recording. It is much better then just reading the quote.

 

[backdoorpass]

Lifted from Inside NU. But, had to repost here. This is why he is the right coach for NU.

Agreed. Platitudes are exactly what we need to get us to the next level.

 

[NJCat]

Agreed. Platitudes are exactly what we need to get us to the next level.

Heck, we're not even at the previous level yet......

 

[backdoorpass]

Heck, we're not even at the previous level yet......

Collins had 6 top 100 RPI wins in his first season. 3 in his second season. 2 in his third season.

Collins clearly inherited garbage players and a program going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction now that he's getting his own recruits into the system.

 

[MysticCat]

Heck, we're not even at the previous level yet......

Finally.

A coach who thanks the seniors (although not sure why he didn't thank NU for paying him handsomely for yet another non post season year), and a coach who tells his players to be ready for next season.

It's about damn time.

My adrenaline is flowing.

 

[thewildcat2011]

Collins had 6 top 100 RPI wins in his first season. 3 in his second season. 2 in his third season.

Collins clearly inherited garbage players and a program going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction now that he's getting his own recruits into the system.

And yet:

KenPom
2013-2014: 131
2014-2015: 118
2015-2016: 75

RPI
2013-2014: 123
2014-2015: 124
2015-2016: 111

It's almost like we're at once improving AND getting worse...it's incredible! Or maybe cherry picking stats is easy? I dunno.

 

[thewildcat2011]

Finally.

A coach who thanks the seniors (although not sure why he didn't thank NU for paying him handsomely for yet another non post season year), and a coach who tells his players to be ready for next season.

It's about damn time.

My adrenaline is flowing.

How long has that hate boner been around? Is it time to see a doctor?

 

[NJCat]

And yet:

KenPom
2013-2014: 131
2014-2015: 118
2015-2016: 75

RPI
2013-2014: 123
2014-2015: 124
2015-2016: 111

It's almost like we're at once improving AND getting worse...it's incredible! Or maybe cherry picking stats is easy? I dunno.

This is Exhibit A of why my favorite Head Ball Coach says "stats are for losers". To my eye, this is the best of the three Collins teams. Forget the Top 100 wins, nonsense about inheriting garbage players (Crawford, Cobb, Demps, Olah garbage? Nah). Decent NU team, not quite top half of the Big 10, but trending up. Clearly improving, not getting worse.

 

[backdoorpass]

It's almost like we're at once improving AND getting worse...it's incredible! Or maybe cherry picking stats is easy? I dunno.

You're right. It is easy.

Collins' first three seasons:

RPI
2013-2014: 123
2014-2015: 124
2015-2016: 111

Carmody's last three seasons:

RPI
2010-11: 80
2011-12: 55
2012-13: 163

I would agree with those who say that the program can't handle the kind of instability and inconsistency of BC's last season when we had all those injuries/suspensions/illnesses. After 4 of 5 years making the post-season before Carmody was fired, it's nice to now have some stability with Collins.

 

[thewildcat2011]

This is Exhibit A of why my favorite Head Ball Coach says "stats are for losers". To my eye, this is the best of the three Collins teams. Forget the Top 100 wins, nonsense about inheriting garbage players (Crawford, Cobb, Demps, Olah garbage? Nah). Decent NU team, not quite top half of the Big 10, but trending up. Clearly improving, not getting worse.

Yup. Unfortunate for those who really, really want to be right over just rooting for their team.

 

[clarificationcat]

Finally.

A coach who thanks the seniors (although not sure why he didn't thank NU for paying him handsomely for yet another non post season year), and a coach who tells his players to be ready for next season.

It's about damn time.

My adrenaline is flowing.

Yes. You strike me a guy who understands first hand what it takes to achieve greatness in sports. I bet you have a bunch of war stories from when the chess team won regionals.

I personally appreciate some passion from our coach. I think if it's not overdone it can be useful in motivating our players to achieve their goals. I also think it is probably useful in recruiting. I am guessing that some recruits find that appealing.

Thanks for checking in. Your input is always appreciated. It's like having a fan of another team on call.

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

I would agree with those who say that the program can't handle the kind of instability and inconsistency of BC's last season when we had all those injuries/suspensions/illnesses. After 4 of 5 years making the post-season before Carmody was fired, it's nice to now have some stability with Collins.

No bitterness at all. lol
And people wonder why these same conversations keep coming up... wow...

Glad you're acknowledging the injuries Collins dealt with this season. Oh wait...

 

[Walker Fan]

Too funny with the haters:
1. NU went to PSU and beat the Lions who have been our nemesis. That road win was a big step;
2. Winning 5 more games was a big step;
3. Winning 8 Big 10 games is a big step. Last time I checked under the prior regimes we made the NIT with 6 or 7 Big 10 regular season wins;
4. Winning 20 games was a big step without our most athletic player who could have matched up better with 1. Peter Jok, 2. Denzel Valentine, 3. UNC's Justin Jackson, 4. OSU's Marc Loving, Tate and Bates-Diop, 5. UM's Robinson, Rakman or Irvin, 6. Edwards of PU, 7. PSU Brandon Taylor, 8. Maryland's Sulaimon and Layman. These are all wing or athletic guards (6'5"-6'9") who abused NU and were key players in 10 NU losses. I love Tre but on defense at 6'2" these are tough match ups. And unfortunately SLindsey does not move his feet well enough to match up with these players;
5. Doug Gottlieb summarized the prior regime well after HC's win v. Lehigh: the Princeton system is meant to compensate for athletically deficient teams, and stretch teams out on defense and surprise teams and then hope that you can hold on when the athletic playmakers make plays to win the games at he end of the game. Collins is bringing in better players every season so that we win with better and more athletic players and that is the key to sustained success. Will it happen over night? No, but the program is improving every season. With our poor non-conference schedule, our RPI was never going to get high enough unless we won 12 Big 10 games.

 

[willycat]

Collins had 6 top 100 RPI wins in his first season. 3 in his second season. 2 in his third season.

Collins clearly inherited garbage players and a program going in the wrong direction. Things are going in the right direction now that he's getting his own recruits into the system.

Please, please, please GIVE IT UP.

 

[mikewebb68]

Finally.

A coach who thanks the seniors (although not sure why he didn't thank NU for paying him handsomely for yet another non post season year), and a coach who tells his players to be ready for next season.

It's about damn time.

My adrenaline is flowing.

We know you're adrenaline is flowing; your team is playing in the First Four! Good luck.

Don't you have a Holy Cross message board on which to impart your wisdom? Or do they not have one?

 

[NUCat320]

I wish Bill Carmody were Chris Collins' top assistant. I like Northwestern, and Chris Collins, and Bill Carmody. Heck, let CCC be 'face' and most visible recruiting presence, let CBC be the offensive guru, and bring back Kevin O'Neill to swear and coach defense, in that order.

It's a modem College of Coaches (pun intended). It oughta make everybody here happy.

 

[DaCat]

Collins will take "The Purple" to "The Dance" !!!

 

[Styre]

This is Exhibit A of why my favorite Head Ball Coach says "stats are for losers". To my eye, this is the best of the three Collins teams.

Why does that indicate that stats are for losers? All the stats agree with you.

 

[NJCat]

Why does that indicate that stats are for losers? All the stats agree with you.

The stat "wins against top 100 RPI teams" doesn't. Anyway, RPI itself is a joke. I prefer the KenPom index.

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

The stat "wins against top 100 RPI teams" doesn't. Anyway, RPI itself is a joke. I prefer the KenPom index.

KenPom proved we made major strides this year. With Law back next season, things look very positive.

 

[NJCat]

KenPom proved we made major strides this year. With Law back next season, things look very positive.

Agree NU made major strides. Not as confident as you that next season will be as good as last. Demps and Olah will be huge holes to fill with young players. I think 2017-18 is THE season.

 

[EvanstonCat]

I wish Bill Carmody were Chris Collins' top assistant. I like Northwestern, and Chris Collins, and Bill Carmody. Heck, let CCC be 'face' and most visible recruiting presence, let CBC be the offensive guru, and bring back Kevin O'Neill to swear and coach defense, in that order.

It's a modem College of Coaches (pun intended). It oughta make everybody here happy.

If all Carmody had to do was coach the O, he might actually be a fit for NU. But, only if he added offensive rebounding to his list of things to do.

KON was a bum and there is no room for him at NU in any capacity.

 

[clarificationcat]

If all Carmody had to do was coach the O, he might actually be a fit for NU. But, only if he added offensive rebounding to his list of things to do.

KON was a bum and there is no room for him at NU in any capacity.

Ironically, it looks like Holy Cross won the conference tournament with defense. They held Army and Lehigh to 38 and 56 points, while scoring 60 and 59 points. They lost 7 of their last 8 games heading into the tournament. Pretty amazing turn-around.

I thought Carmody was a good offensive coach when he had good players. We had some awful offenses during this tenure as well. During the Shurna years, our offensive efficiency ratings (which I will confess I do not fully understand) were 103, 54, 22 and 39). With Juice, Shurna and Crawford, I thought it was a fun offense to watch. In all of the other years he coached, our offensive efficiency ratings ranged from 173 to 271. We finished in the 200's (out of about 320 teams) in 7 of his seasons.

Under Collins, our ratings were 331 (wow!), 162 and 67 this year. Hopefully, we can improve our defense next year and keep the offense fairly efficient.

 

[hdhntr1]

Heck, we're not even at the previous level yet......

Try again. 8 BIG wins in the regular season is the most we had. 20 wins overall. So back to the level. BIG got screwed this year in the seeding process and the NU NIT snub is just a continuation of that. Did we beat some of the better teams we have in the past? No but we also did not lose to lower ranked teams we have in the past. Just saying we have basically returned to the levels that BC had us to.

 

[NJCat]

Try again. 8 BIG wins in the regular season is the most we had. 20 wins overall. So back to the level. BIG got screwed this year in the seeding process and the NU NIT snub is just a continuation of that. Did we beat some of the better teams we have in the past? No but we also did not lose to lower ranked teams we have in the past. Just saying we have basically returned to the levels that BC had us to.

Four consecutive NIT's in 5 years versus zero.........

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

Four consecutive NIT's in 5 years versus zero.........

Conference win total and full win total are the same for better than Carmody's best. We can't control what happens beyond our own games. With the recruits coming in, I honestly venture to say this program is in the best shape it's EVER been.

 

[hdhntr1]

Four consecutive NIT's in 5 years versus zero.........

And exactly when was the last time an 8 BIG win 20 overall win BIG team had not been invited to NIT? CCC has brought them back to a similar level to where they were with BC. That the selection committees did not chose them does not alter that

 

[NJCat]

Conference win total and full win total are the same for better than Carmody's best. We can't control what happens beyond our own games. With the recruits coming in, I honestly venture to say this program is in the best shape it's EVER been.

Making the NIT once could be a fluke. Making it twice could be a coincidence. Making it 4 consecutive years is a plateau of Point B success. NU is not back to that plateau yet, let alone Point C, the NCAA. But the vector is in the right direction. I see Point C happening in 2018.

 

[MysticCat]

Try again. 8 BIG wins in the regular season is the most we had. 20 wins overall. So back to the level. BIG got screwed this year in the seeding process and the NU NIT snub is just a continuation of that. Did we beat some of the better teams we have in the past? No but we also did not lose to lower ranked teams we have in the past. Just saying we have basically returned to the levels that BC had us to.

Why are you referring to it as a snub?

They said we weren't even in the last 4 out.

 

[NJCat]

And exactly when was the last time an 8 BIG win 20 overall win BIG team had not been invited to NIT? CCC has brought them back to a similar level to where they were with BC. That the selection committees did not chose them does not alter that

Please.........8 conference wins are OK but none over Top 25 teams. And 12 OOC conference wins? The best win was over an NIT team, Va Tech. The rest of the wins were over pathetic teams. Let's not get crazy over the 2016 record. This was a good team. But the 2010-11 team was better: Juice Thompson, Shurna, Cobb, Crawford, Marcothreelio would beat this year 6 times out of 10. And that team finished 8th in the Big 10 even though they only had 7 wins.

 

[hdhntr1]

Making the NIT once could be a fluke. Making it twice could be a coincidence. Making it 4 consecutive years is a plateau of Point B success. NU is not back to that plateau yet, let alone Point C, the NCAA. But the vector is in the right direction. I see Point C happening in 2018.

NU had 8 conference wins in season. That is the highest level ever attained by BC coached teams. The 20 wins also represents the highest level ever reached by BC coached teams. Note I did not say that this team surpassed the level of BC coached teams, just that this year they were back to a similar level. That they were not given an opportunity to go on does not alter that.

 

[VirginiaWildcat]

And exactly when was the last time an 8 BIG win 20 overall win BIG team had not been invited to NIT? CCC has brought them back to a similar level to where they were with BC.

And without Law all season...A LOT of positives going forward...

 

[hdhntr1]

Please.........8 conference wins are OK but none over Top 25 teams. And 12 OOC conference wins? The best win was over an NIT team, Va Tech. The rest of the wins were over pathetic teams. Let's not get crazy over the 2016 record. This was a good team. But the 2010-11 team was better: Juice Thompson, Shurna, Cobb, Crawford, Marcothreelio would beat this year 6 times out of 10. And that team finished 8th in the Big 10 even though they only had 7 wins.

They also did not have any of the bad losses that those BC teams typically had. I did not say we have surpassed the level of the BC teams of that period, just that we had gotten back to a similar level. Would a win over, say PU, MD or one of the other top BIG teams but with a loss against MN feel better for you? How about 2 good wins but two bad losses? Would that be a better team in your eyes? That was a typical BC team of the era. To me they are similar but the current team is more consistent.

By the way, there were also fewer teams in the BIG in 2010-11 (I think 11 in BB as NEB joined in 2011) so this years 9th place finish is again similar, if not better.

 

[NJCat]

By the way, there were also fewer teams in the BIG in 2010-11 (I think 11 in BB as NEB joined in 2011) so this years 9th place finish is again similar, if not better.

Sorry, but a 9th place finish means 8 teams were ahead of NU, while an 8th place finish means there were only 7 ahead of NU. Doesn't matter how many teams were below the Cats.

 

[backdoorpass]

But the 2010-11 team was better: Juice Thompson, Shurna, Cobb, Crawford, Marcothreelio would beat this year 6 times out of 10. And that team finished 8th in the Big 10 even though they only had 7 wins.

FWIW, the 2010-11 team got an 8th B1G win in the BTT. Also, all 11 teams in the B1G in 2010-11 finished the season in kenpom's top 100. This season, there were 4 B1G teams outside kenpom's top 100. Not coincidentally, 5 of our 8 wins came against those 4 teams--and 2 more were against Nebraska who finished the season at kenpom 95.

 

[hdhntr1]

Sorry, but a 9th place finish means 8 teams were ahead of NU, while an 8th place finish means there were only 7 ahead of NU. Doesn't matter how many teams were below the Cats.

??? They were ahead of only 3 teams back then. This year, ahead of 5. It sure does matter. Besides I said similar performance.. Try finishing in 11th place in an 11 team conference or 11th in a 14 or 15 team conference Same place, same number of teams ahead of them but in the one case, last place and in the other, ahead of three. Or take a look at 8th place this year. Michigan was a 10-8 BIG team vs we were a 7-11 team with the same record. But according to you, they are the same because they were behind the same number of teams.

 

[hdhntr1]

FWIW, the 2010-11 team got an 8th B1G win in the BTT. Also, all 11 teams in the B1G in 2010-11 finished the season in kenpom's top 100. This season, there were 4 B1G teams outside kenpom's top 100. Not coincidentally, 5 of our 8 wins came against those 4 teams--and 2 more were against Nebraska who finished the season at kenpom 95.

In an 11 team conference, you have a 1st round game and play against a disappointing 6-12 lower seed MN team that had just lost 9 of 10 down the stretch.. A welcome 8th win but an easier matchup than this year. And again, I did not say this team was better. just that it was at a similar level.

 

[NJCat]

??? They were ahead of only 3 teams back then. This year, ahead of 5. It sure does matter. Besides I said similar performance.. Try finishing in 11th place in an 11 team conference or 11th in a 14 or 15 team conference Same place, same number of teams ahead of them but in the one case, last place and in the other, ahead of three. Or take a look at 8th place this year. Michigan was a 10-8 BIG team vs we were a 7-11 team with the same record. But according to you, they are the same because they were behind the same number of teams.

What matters isn't the number of teams behind them, it is the number ahead. If at best the Big 10 only gets 7 teams into the NCAA, NU has to finish higher. It make no difference if they finish ahead of 3 or 5 teams if they don't move into the top 7 they don't dance. And isn't that really the goal? Not just to finish ahead of more crappy teams?

 

[hdhntr1]

What matters isn't the number of teams behind them, it is the number ahead. If at best the Big 10 only gets 7 teams into the NCAA, NU has to finish higher. It make no difference if they finish ahead of 3 or 5 teams if they don't move into the top 7 they don't dance. And isn't that really the goal? Not just to finish ahead of more crappy teams?

With 14 teams in the BIG, 7 bids will likely be the norm sometimes going to 8 or maybe even nine (could have gotten 8 this year). With 12 teams, 6 was likely the norm (2012 and 2013) with an occasional 7 max. With 11 teams the norm was likely 5 or 6 (heck in 2002/4. there were only 3 bids) with outstanding years getting as many as 7. Number of teams in the conference changes the number that can qualify (at least a 0.500 record in conference and overall) and therefore the norm and the max. Look at the Big East when they had all those teams. With 16 teams didn't they get 8-9 bids?