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Jake, Genyk and Hooten out - no Anderson (at least yet)

ricko654321 said:
I was curious so checked out scoring defense stats.

www.ncaa.com

NCAA College Football FBS current team Stats | NCAA.com

Discover the current NCAA FBS Football leaders in every stats category, as well as historic leaders.
www.ncaa.com www.ncaa.com

The top 4 are B1G (Michigan OSU PSU Iowa), and 6 of the top 18 (Neb 15 and Wiscy 18)… Rutgers at 30, NU 42, Maryland 46.

Don’t quite have 8 of the top 15 scoring D’s, but lots of good defenses in this conference - and yes mediocre QB play.
Click to expand...
One feeds the other. In general...yes I think we saw some good defenses in the conference this season...those stats are also padded by the offensive bathwater we've all been swimming in.

One bright spot: Big Ten is 3-0 in bowl games so far...so there's some vindication. I wouldn't wanna peel back the curtain too far on the teams we've faced and how many Utah and Miami players sat it out for one reason or another, but we don't get quite that granular in analyzing details on tv...
 
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PurpleWhiteBoy said:
So nobody knows if

a) Gragg fired Bajakian
b) Gragg told Braun that Braun had to fire Bajakian
or
c) if Braun said to Gragg "Look I'd like to fire Bajakian."

Thats fine.
Personally I think it matters who runs the football program.
Click to expand...
We agree. Whoever runs the program should be responsible for all the things that happen in that program. And they should be dismissed when those things are subpar or embarassing to the university and its alum.
 
IGNORE2 said:
We agree. Whoever runs the program should be responsible for all the things that happen in that program. And they should be dismissed when those things are subpar or embarassing to the university and its alum.
Click to expand...

Ummm, all I wrote was "I think it matters who runs the football program."
 
Sheffielder said:
One feeds the other. In general...yes I think we saw some good defenses in the conference this season...those stats are also padded by the offensive bathwater we've all been swimming in.

One bright spot: Big Ten is 3-0 in bowl games so far...so there's some vindication. I wouldn't wanna peel back the curtain too far on the teams we've faced and how many Utah and Miami players sat it out for one reason or another, but we don't get quite that granular in analyzing details on tv...
Click to expand...
The bowl records of the West teams the past couple of years has supported the notion that the defenses of the Big Ten West are for real and not just the result of a collective of bad offenses. Most of the West teams have managed to hold bowl opponents to well-below average offensive output over the past 5-7 years whether you look at us, Iowa, Minnesota, or Wisconsin.

But the Big Ten West offenses are the flip side of that coin and there's no hiding the issues there. All of us need to take a big step up in terms of the offensive output, especially with some high scoring teams about to enter the conference.
 
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NUCat320 said:
The evidence is that Braun did not hire Bajakian and Bajakian has been bad at his job and now Bajakian has been fired.

If Bajakian sleeps better at night by convincing himself it was over a t-shirt, well, then I doubt he’ll be recruiting any highly-regarded quarterbacks any time soon.
Click to expand...
He hasn't done it in a while
 
zeek55 said:
Yeah to me (and I think to Fitz and Braun as well) it comes down to QB development.

Past 4 years we've had 2 great years because Fitz convinced a pair of highly polished QBs to give us a senior transfer year (Ramsey and Bryant). But those guys just need a playbook that fits their skills and they're good to go; they already have experience, leadership, intangibles, etc.

It's hard to keep an OC without any QBs developing in the program across a 4 year window.

That ultimately was Bajakian's undoing.
Click to expand...
To be fair, much of that is not Jake's fault as the guys that he would be developing and would have been likely to start during those years would likely be guys brought in by the previous OC (oh that's right, they did not). This was only his fourth year, so only his first recruit was even really an upperclassman. Cupboard was very bare when he got here (when you consider HJ was not able to produce on the field) and they were desperately trying to bring in transfers to fill the gaps left.
 
kaTNap said:
The real indictment against coach Bajakian, IMO, is not the play on the field this past year, which -- especially when Ben Bryant was healthy -- was at least acceptable, and superb in places (e.g., the final TD drive against Utah). The real indictment is that Bajakian is the quarterbacks coach, and we have done nada in recent years as far as recruiting and developing quality QBs out of high school. If it weren't for transfers who were trained and developed by coaches at other schools, we'd be in sad shape.
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Sorry but the guys that should have been starters should have been guys secured by the previous group and that cupboard was really bare. Did he miss on being able to secure commitment out of a few guys? Sure but that had been happening before he got here, And have to feel he was instrumental in bringing in Bryant.
 
Sheffielder said:
One feeds the other. In general...yes I think we saw some good defenses in the conference this season...those stats are also padded by the offensive bathwater we've all been swimming in.

One bright spot: Big Ten is 3-0 in bowl games so far...so there's some vindication. I wouldn't wanna peel back the curtain too far on the teams we've faced and how many Utah and Miami players sat it out for one reason or another, but we don't get quite that granular in analyzing details on tv...
Click to expand...
Ole Miss and Kiffin’s offense beat down PSU’s vaunted D. Oh well.
 
hdhntr1 said:
To be fair, much of that is not Jake's fault as the guys that he would be developing and would have been likely to start during those years would likely be guys brought in by the previous OC (oh that's right, they did not). This was only his fourth year, so only his first recruit was even really an upperclassman. Cupboard was very bare when he got here (when you consider HJ was not able to produce on the field) and they were desperately trying to bring in transfers to fill the gaps left.
Click to expand...
Sure but at the end of the day this is a results business and 4 years is a long time to prove that you can make something work at QB beyond the 2 polished QBs who transferred in...

This isn't 100% on Bajakian; there's a lot that we can point to as issues that we've had at that position, but he's ultimately responsible for that position's development situation.

A fresh look from a fresh OC is needed.
 
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zeek55 said:
Sure but at the end of the day this is a results business and 4 years is a long time to prove that you can make something work at QB beyond the 2 polished QBs who transferred in...

This isn't 100% on Bajakian; there's a lot that we can point to as issues that we've had at that position, but he's ultimately responsible for that position's development situation.

A fresh look from a fresh OC is needed.
Click to expand...
It was pretty damning, I thought, to see Hilinski get the call over Lausch in Vegas. That tells me that NU doesn’t view Lausch as a legitimate quarterback prospect, even though he’s seen the field in the majority of games.

Hopefully they have a better view of Gray.
 
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NUCat320 said:
It was pretty damning, I thought, to see Hilinski get the call over Lausch in Vegas. That tells me that NU doesn’t view Lausch as a legitimate quarterback prospect, even though he’s seen the field in the majority of games.

Hopefully they have a better view of Gray.
Click to expand...
Lausch seems like he is working his ass off, but let's not forget, he wasn't a highly recruited guy. He may end up being a Pat Spencer type, that would be great, but I don't see him starting here at QB.

Hilinski has 5000 career passing yards. Honestly, I had forgotten about him, but with Sully out, he was the logical choice. Yet, he sure didn't look ready.
 
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phatcat said:
Lausch seems like he is working his ass off, but let's not forget, he wasn't a highly recruited guy. He may end up being a Pat Spencer type, that would be great, but I don't see him starting here at QB.

Hilinski has 5000 career passing yards. Honestly, I had forgotten about him, but with Sully out, he was the logical choice. Yet, he sure didn't look ready.
Click to expand...
Hilinski just looked overamped, but not really fair to judge much from his 5 plays. Pretty hard to just drop into a high pressure situation against a really good defense in the middle of the game for just a single series without any warmup.

Heck, look at Bryant's first ten plays

  • FIRST DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at NU 25​

    (14:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to A.J. Henning for 1 yd to the NU 26

  • 2nd & 9 at NU 26​

    (14:15 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Zemaiah Vaughn and Levani Damuni for a loss of 8 yards to the NU 18

  • 3rd & 17 at NU 18​

    (13:50 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Johnathan Hall for a loss of 4 yards to the NU 14

  • SECOND DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 45​

(11:30 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 42

  • 2nd & 7 at UTAH 42​

    (11:10 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 39

  • 3rd & 4 at UTAH 39​

    (10:20 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 8 yds to the UTAH 31 for a 1ST down

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (10:02 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete

  • 2nd & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (9:45 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to Joseph Himon II for a loss of 2 yards to the UTAH 33

  • 3rd & 12 at UTAH 33​

    (9:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete
The team gained 1 yard on Bryant's first two possessions under center. Bryant was 2-4 for -1 yards passing with two sacks for -12 yards. The only thing saving it from being two 3-and-outs after the first 3-and-out was Cam Porter running for 14 yards on three consecutive plays to start the 2nd possession. 10 of it was on a defensive holding call, but the team at least gained 13 yards in Hilinski's five plays.

Not complaining in any way about Bryant. He was amazing. Just noting that his first plays didn't set the world on fire either, so not so sure we should indict Hillinski (who didn't look comfortable) for his five plays.

And pretty impossible to know what Lausch can be as he was only utilized in a single very specific way that quickly proved ineffective once it was obvious we wouldn't trust him to do anything other than that one thing. He doesn't necessarily physically look the part of D1 P5 QB, but honestly neither did Dan Persa. Just hoping one of these guys can develop and/or click with the new OC's offense.

Sorry. That was a REALLY long post.
 
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zeek55 said:
Sure but at the end of the day this is a results business and 4 years is a long time to prove that you can make something work at QB beyond the 2 polished QBs who transferred in...

This isn't 100% on Bajakian; there's a lot that we can point to as issues that we've had at that position, but he's ultimately responsible for that position's development situation.

A fresh look from a fresh OC is needed.
Click to expand...
Overall we can understand why he was dismissed and no one is suggesting it was not time to move on., I am just saying that it is unfair to judge him by this metric as the guys that should have been able to be developed were not here., He brought in 3 guys and all three were more projects. Even so his first guy (Sullivan) did play and started and even won a couple games. Guys that should have been here really were not as there was nothing in the cupboard when he arrived
 
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hoosboot said:
Hilinski just looked overamped, but not really fair to judge much from his 5 plays. Pretty hard to just drop into a high pressure situation against a really good defense in the middle of the game for just a single series without any warmup.

Heck, look at Bryant's first ten plays

  • FIRST DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at NU 25​

    (14:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to A.J. Henning for 1 yd to the NU 26

  • 2nd & 9 at NU 26​

    (14:15 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Zemaiah Vaughn and Levani Damuni for a loss of 8 yards to the NU 18

  • 3rd & 17 at NU 18​

    (13:50 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Johnathan Hall for a loss of 4 yards to the NU 14

  • SECOND DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 45​

(11:30 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 42

  • 2nd & 7 at UTAH 42​

    (11:10 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 39

  • 3rd & 4 at UTAH 39​

    (10:20 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 8 yds to the UTAH 31 for a 1ST down

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (10:02 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete

  • 2nd & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (9:45 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to Joseph Himon II for a loss of 2 yards to the UTAH 33

  • 3rd & 12 at UTAH 33​

    (9:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete
The team gained 1 yard on Bryant's first two possessions under center. Bryant was 2-4 for -1 yards passing with two sacks for -12 yards. The only thing saving it from being two 3-and-outs after the first 3-and-out was Cam Porter running for 14 yards on three consecutive plays to start the 2nd possession. 10 of it was on a defensive holding call, but the team at least gained 13 yards in Hilinski's five plays.

Not complaining in any way about Bryant. He was amazing. Just noting that his first plays didn't set the world on fire either, so not so sure we should indict Hillinski (who didn't look comfortable) for his five plays.

And pretty impossible to know what Lausch can be as he was only utilized in a single very specific way that quickly proved ineffective once it was obvious we wouldn't trust him to do anything other than that one thing. He doesn't necessarily physically look the part of D1 P5 QB, but honestly neither did Dan Persa. Just hoping one of these guys can develop and/or click with the new OC's offense.

Sorry. That was a REALLY long post.
Click to expand...
Great post.

I’m not giving up on Hilinski. With a new OC and QB Coach, all bets are off. I saw Hilinski look pretty good against Nebraska. There’s something there and maybe a new OC and QB coach can uncover it again.

I still hope we bring in a transfer or two but I look forward to seeing how the rest of the room responds and maybe flourishes under new direction and schemes that may be a better fit to ability. And hopefully with better OL coaching and development.
 
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EvanstonCat said:
Great post.

I’m not giving up on Hilinski. With a new OC and QB Coach, all bets are off. I saw Hilinski look pretty good against Nebraska. There’s something there and maybe a new OC and QB coach can uncover it again.

I still hope we bring in a transfer or two but I look forward to seeing how the rest of the room responds and maybe flourishes under new direction and schemes that may be a better fit to ability. And hopefully with better OL coaching and development.
Click to expand...
I just assumed that Hilinski was done, but he’s got a sixth-year left. Wow.

I’d assume that he gets a shot under a new coordinator. Wow.

Wow. Wow.
 
NUCat320 said:
I just assumed that Hilinski was done, but he’s got a sixth-year left. Wow.

I’d assume that he gets a shot under a new coordinator. Wow.

Wow. Wow.
Click to expand...
I was actually surprised to see Hilinski play over Lausch when BB went out at the bowl game, and speculated it was Braun giving him one last hurrah at NU. I still wonder if Hilinski will return for his sixth year.
 
EvanstonCat said:
Great post.

I’m not giving up on Hilinski. With a new OC and QB Coach, all bets are off. I saw Hilinski look pretty good against Nebraska. There’s something there and maybe a new OC and QB coach can uncover it again.

I still hope we bring in a transfer or two but I look forward to seeing how the rest of the room responds and maybe flourishes under new direction and schemes that may be a better fit to ability. And hopefully with better OL coaching and development.
Click to expand...

Puff…puff…pass.
 
hoosboot said:
Hilinski just looked overamped, but not really fair to judge much from his 5 plays. Pretty hard to just drop into a high pressure situation against a really good defense in the middle of the game for just a single series without any warmup.

Heck, look at Bryant's first ten plays

  • FIRST DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at NU 25​

    (14:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to A.J. Henning for 1 yd to the NU 26

  • 2nd & 9 at NU 26​

    (14:15 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Zemaiah Vaughn and Levani Damuni for a loss of 8 yards to the NU 18

  • 3rd & 17 at NU 18​

    (13:50 - 1st) Ben Bryant sacked by Johnathan Hall for a loss of 4 yards to the NU 14

  • SECOND DRIVE​

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 45​

(11:30 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 42

  • 2nd & 7 at UTAH 42​

    (11:10 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 3 yds to the UTAH 39

  • 3rd & 4 at UTAH 39​

    (10:20 - 1st) Cam Porter run for 8 yds to the UTAH 31 for a 1ST down

  • 1st & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (10:02 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete

  • 2nd & 10 at UTAH 31​

    (9:45 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass complete to Joseph Himon II for a loss of 2 yards to the UTAH 33

  • 3rd & 12 at UTAH 33​

    (9:30 - 1st) Ben Bryant pass incomplete
The team gained 1 yard on Bryant's first two possessions under center. Bryant was 2-4 for -1 yards passing with two sacks for -12 yards. The only thing saving it from being two 3-and-outs after the first 3-and-out was Cam Porter running for 14 yards on three consecutive plays to start the 2nd possession. 10 of it was on a defensive holding call, but the team at least gained 13 yards in Hilinski's five plays.

Not complaining in any way about Bryant. He was amazing. Just noting that his first plays didn't set the world on fire either, so not so sure we should indict Hillinski (who didn't look comfortable) for his five plays.

And pretty impossible to know what Lausch can be as he was only utilized in a single very specific way that quickly proved ineffective once it was obvious we wouldn't trust him to do anything other than that one thing. He doesn't necessarily physically look the part of D1 P5 QB, but honestly neither did Dan Persa. Just hoping one of these guys can develop and/or click with the new OC's offense.

Sorry. That was a REALLY long post.
Click to expand...

Great point in regards to Lausch. Hoping he will thrive in a new offense.
 
phatcat said:
Lausch seems like he is working his ass off, but let's not forget, he wasn't a highly recruited guy. He may end up being a Pat Spencer type, that would be great, but I don't see him starting here at QB.
Click to expand...
This is, of course, true. But you’ve got one QB a class, and he was the guy. Given all the snaps he’s gotten, and the knowledge that Sullivan was unavailable, I would have expected Lausch to be ready for the backup reps.

Knowing that Hilinski *could* remain with the program changes things a little bit. I guess you could potentially enter next season with Sullivan-Hilinski contending for the starting job, and Lausch playing a similar role as a sophomore with two years left.
 
NUCat320 said:
This is, of course, true. But you’ve got one QB a class, and he was the guy. Given all the snaps he’s gotten, and the knowledge that Sullivan was unavailable, I would have expected Lausch to be ready for the backup reps.

Knowing that Hilinski *could* remain with the program changes things a little bit. I guess you could potentially enter next season with Sullivan-Hilinski contending for the starting job, and Lausch playing a similar role as a sophomore with two years left.
Click to expand...

I still sincerely hope that our 2024 starting QB is not yet on the roster.
 
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gocatsgo2003 said:
I still sincerely hope that our 2024 starting QB is not yet on the roster.
Click to expand...
Sullivan MIGHT be ok, but I'd feel way better if he beats out an incoming transfer than if they just stood pat. He has some good tools, but isn't likely to make a huge leap in year 4. Some do, though, like Kafka. And I hold out home that at better OC and OL coach 🤞might raise performance generally.
 
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phatcat said:
Sullivan MIGHT be ok, but I'd feel way better if he beats out an incoming transfer than if they just stood pat. He has some good tools, but isn't likely to make a huge leap in year 4. Some do, though, like Kafka. And I hold out home that at better OC and OL coach 🤞might raise performance generally.
Click to expand...

I kind of get the feeling that we might wait for a QB until the post-spring window unless there’s an absolute “no brainer take” that falls into our lap.
 
hdhntr1 said:
I guess. But still...Genyk might be retiring but I have to imagine that Jake wants another shot.
Click to expand...
You brought up a fair point; I would assume it's basically because Anderson has an easier path to a similar job given we have a bit of a better track record with OL development than Bajakian has with finding a similar OC job or a job that isn't a big downgrade in pay.

And yeah Genyk's probably retiring.

So letting Anderson take a bit of time to find another job is probably the only one where it makes sense to do that.
 
zeek55 said:
You brought up a fair point; I would assume it's basically because Anderson has an easier path to a similar job given we have a bit of a better track record with OL development than Bajakian has with finding a similar OC job or a job that isn't a big downgrade in pay.

And yeah Genyk's probably retiring.

So letting Anderson take a bit of time to find another job is probably the only one where it makes sense to do that.
Click to expand...

Genyk is not retiring. Harbaugh should hire him to coach his special teams.
 
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phatcat said:
Sullivan MIGHT be ok, but I'd feel way better if he beats out an incoming transfer than if they just stood pat. He has some good tools, but isn't likely to make a huge leap in year 4. Some do, though, like Kafka. And I hold out home that at better OC and OL coach 🤞might raise performance generally.
Click to expand...
He still doesn't have that much game experience so still could be the "got it" moment. That said, so far he has not shown that he can stay on the field (health) so gotta feel we need someone else
 
zeek55 said:
You brought up a fair point; I would assume it's basically because Anderson has an easier path to a similar job given we have a bit of a better track record with OL development than Bajakian has with finding a similar OC job or a job that isn't a big downgrade in pay.

And yeah Genyk's probably retiring.

So letting Anderson take a bit of time to find another job is probably the only one where it makes sense to do that.
Click to expand...
Sorry but makes no sense in that it doesn't seem to help NU at all. His top guys are all transferring out anyway. And if he has an easier path wouldn't that make it better to put him on the street or retain him regardless?
 
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hdhntr1 said:
He still doesn't have that much game experience so still could be the "got it" moment. That said, so far he has not shown that he can stay on the field (health) so gotta feel we need someone else
Click to expand...
He has more experience than someone would think at first. Below link is for his career numbers. That said, he still might have a "got it" moment like Kafka did. Both played about the same amount at this point in their careers.

www.sports-reference.com

Brendan Sullivan College Stats, School, Draft, Gamelog, Splits | College Football at Sports-Reference.com

Check out Brendan Sullivan's College Stats, School, Draft, Gamelog, Splits and More College Stats at Sports-Reference.com
www.sports-reference.com www.sports-reference.com
 
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