Northwestern University gets what they deserve

[DarthCat]

B


Blame the players?! That’s crazy. This is clearly one of the top 5 talented teams in the Big Ten. It’s clearly all bad coaching and referees conspiring against us, bringing this group to 1-8.

The coaches have just been getting lucky all these years, and with the influx of even better talent these last few classes, the best ever in NU‘s history, the coaches have just got even lazier, just phoning it in.

Tripling down on being a dick. Nice.

If you say so man. I mean, you do know it all.

• Three ten win seasons in six years.
  
• 4-1 in last five bowl games
• Longest Big Ten winning streak in the conference before this season.

Clearly this season is due to the sudden and inexplicable ineptitude of the coaching staff. I mean, we get “good” players and that’s all that matters, right? There can be no other explanation for 1-8. And for this to happen with the most talented roster NU has ever had?! Just makes it all the more maddening.

Have they checked the water supply at the new Lakefront Facility? I mean, for so many coaches to all become so incompetent so quickly when blessed with such talent with which to work. Something must really be amiss.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

If you say so man. I mean, you do know it all.

• Three ten win seasons in six years.
  
• 4-1 in last five bowl games
• Longest Big Ten winning streak in the conference before this season.

Clearly this season is due to the sudden and inexplicable ineptitude of the coaching staff. I mean, we get “good” players and that’s all that matters, right? There can be no other explanation for 1-8. And for this to happen with the most talented roster NU has ever had?! Just makes it all the more maddening.

Have they checked the water supply at the new Lakefront Facility? I mean, for so many coaches to all become so incompetent so quickly when blessed with such talent with which to work. Something must really be amiss.

You’re all over the place.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

If you say so man. I mean, you do know it all.

• Three ten win seasons in six years.
  
• 4-1 in last five bowl games
• Longest Big Ten winning streak in the conference before this season.

Clearly this season is due to the sudden and inexplicable ineptitude of the coaching staff. I mean, we get “good” players and that’s all that matters, right? There can be no other explanation for 1-8. And for this to happen with the most talented roster NU has ever had?! Just makes it all the more maddening.

Have they checked the water supply at the new Lakefront Facility? I mean, for so many coaches to all become so incompetent so quickly when blessed with such talent with which to work. Something must really be amiss.

I knew you eventually come around.

 

[DarthCat]

I knew you eventually come around.

Oh, I’ve seen the light man. Borderline criminal for this degree of talent to go to waste. Good to know with all that talent on the roster, I mean, we’ll have our choice of any coaches in the country. They’ll be lining up to get a chance to work with these kids.

 

[Colonel Kong]

I'm an alumnus (not "an alumni") of the university. I'd rather we suck than admit everyone. It's just not that important. We graduated 100.00% of the players. No criminals. No other BS.

What's the point of being Duke basketball and admitting Adonis or Godzilla or whatever the kid's name is? Is he somehow representing the university?

Do you want a Baylor, MSU, Minn. type of group? No thanks

If they go the other way, they will lose at least one fan.

Damn right. I'd rather be Harvard than OSU as a school. Any day.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Oh, I’ve seen the light man. Borderline criminal for this degree of talent to go to waste. Good to know with all that talent on the roster, I mean, we’ll have our choice of any coaches in the country. They’ll be lining up to get a chance to work with these kids.

I sure hope the people in the stands at your sons HS games aren’t as critical of his play and his teammates as you are of NU players.

 

[Fitz51]

I sure hope the people in the stands at your sons HS games aren’t as critical of his play and his teammates as you are of NU players.

Unless it’s Texas, high school football ain’t a billion dollar industry.

Also, pay the kids.

 

[Eurocat]

I dont know why it has to be all or nothing. Take the kids who can go to places like Vandy and Geogia Tech and ND and Rice and Duke but don't take those who can barely read and go to some place much less challenging. They will only flunk out anyway and never see the field for us.

 

[DarthCat]

I sure hope the people in the stands at your sons HS games aren’t as critical of his play and his teammates as you are of NU players.

Where’s the criticism? I absolutely agree with you. The players have nothing to do with this season. None. 1-8 is all on the coaching staff. This team has the horses to win the Big Ten next year. Only Fitz being selfish and stubborn is standing in the way.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

I dont know why it has to be all or nothing. Take the kids who can go to places like Vandy and Geogia Tech and ND and Rice and Duke but don't take those who can barely read and go to some place much less challenging. They will only flunk out anyway and never see the field for us.

Again, none of those other schools have any kind of meaningful academic restriction. None.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Where’s the criticism? I absolutely agree with you. The players have nothing to do with this season. None. 1-8 is all on the coaching staff. This team has the horses to win the Big Ten next year. Only Fitz being selfish and stubborn is standing in the way.

Honestly... do you just like complaining?

 

[NUCat320]

I'm an alumnus (not "an alumni") of the university. I'd rather we suck than admit everyone. It's just not that important. We graduated 100.00% of the players. No criminals. No other BS.

What's the point of being Duke basketball and admitting Adonis or Godzilla or whatever the kid's name is? Is he somehow representing the university?

Do you want a Baylor, MSU, Minn. type of group? No thanks

If they go the other way, they will lose at least one fan.

I think the 100% graduation rate is an argument for loosening restrictions. The football program has proven that it can achieve consistent — far better than the overall student population — academic success even with a group far less academically accomplished prior to arrival at NU. Give the staff a chance to continue that stellar record with a larger pool.

(that being said, academic restrictions have nothing to do with most everything that’s gone wrong this season...)

 

[Deep Purr]

Yes, because the relaxation of academic standards at Duke, Vandy, Rice, and BC have done wonders for their respective football programs...

What!! Rice, Vandy and BC suck

 

[FitzFan]

I dont know why it has to be all or nothing. Take the kids who can go to places like Vandy and Geogia Tech and ND and Rice and Duke but don't take those who can barely read and go to some place much less challenging. They will only flunk out anyway and never see the field for us.

Just to clear this up for those who don't understand/don't want to do the research:

NU has some of the toughest academic restrictions for DI revenue sport athletes. Even so, the academic restrictions are easy to meet. The NU undergraduate class of 2017 had an average ACT score of 33. The nationwide average is 21. I guarantee that some of the athletes we admitted in the football recruiting class of 2017 had ACT scores at or near the national average. Huge concessions were already made to get those players into NU.

The NCAA uses a sliding scale to determine minimum GPA/Test scores for athletes. The bare minimum GPA is a 2.2/4.0 in core courses. That's roughly a "C+" average. That being said, one could hypothetically have a 2.0 GPA and still qualify if they achieve an 84 sum score on the ACT. What's an 84 sum score? That's a 21 composite score, or the national average. So if you meet the national average on the ACT, you can have a "C" average and still qualify to play sports. The scale works both ways, though. So if you go to an easy high school or a school that "finesses" the system to boost athlete GPA, then you can bomb the ACT and still qualify. For example, if I had a "B" average, or a 3.00/4.00 GPA, I could theoretically get a 52 sum score on the ACT and still qualify. What's a 52 sum score? That's a 13 composite score. This is how the Alabama's of the world get kids with composite scores of 13 to qualify. A composite score of 13 means I'm reading well below 8th grade level, that I struggle to do basic math, and that I write like I'm 10 years old.

Schools like Vandy, Geogia Tech, ND, Rice, and Duke accept minumum qualifiers. All those students need to do is take the 16 required core courses and meet the scores indicated on the NCAA's sliding scale (link). As I've shown, you can meet these NCAA minimums without being the least bit prepared for college.

So when you guys get pissy after a loss and say we should lower academic standards, you ARE advocating for us to admit athletes to the university who cannot read, write, or do maths at a college level, and you ARE advocating for us to sacrifice our academic integrity to be better at a stupid game. So stop. We've proven that we can win with our restrictions. Clearly this season spiraled out of control and we'll need to regroup to recover next season. But these knee-jerk reactions need to stop.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Just to clear this up for those who don't understand/don't want to do the research:

NU has some of the toughest academic restrictions for DI revenue sport athletes. Even so, the academic restrictions are easy to meet. The NU undergraduate class of 2017 had an average ACT score of 33. The nationwide average is 21. I guarantee that some of the athletes we admitted in the football recruiting class of 2017 had ACT scores at or near the national average. Huge concessions were already made to get those players into NU.

The NCAA uses a sliding scale to determine minimum GPA/Test scores for athletes. The bare minimum GPA is a 2.2/4.0 in core courses. That's a "C" average. That being said, one could hypothetically have a 2.0 GPA and still qualify if they achieve an 84 sum score on the ACT. What's an 84 sum score? That's a 21 composite score, or the national average. So if you meet the national average on the ACT, you can have a C- average and still qualify to play sports. The scale works both ways, though. So if you go to an easy high school or a school that "finesses" the system to boost athlete GPA, then you can bomb the ACT and still qualify. For example, if I had a B+ average, or a 3.00/4.00 GPA, I could theoretically get a 52 sum score on the ACT and still qualify. What's a 52 sum score? That's a 13 composite score. This is how the Alabama's of the world get kids with composite scores of 13 to qualify. A composite score of 13 means I'm reading well below 8th grade level, that I struggle to do basic math, and that I write like I'm 10 years old.

Schools like Vandy, Geogia Tech, ND, Rice, and Duke accept minumum qualifiers. All those students need to do is take the 16 required core courses and meet the scores indicated on the NCAA's sliding scale (link). As I've shown, you can meet these NCAA minimums without being the least bit prepared for college.

So when you guys get pissy after a loss and say we should lower academic standards, you ARE advocating for us to admit athletes to the university who cannot read, write, or do maths at a college level, and you ARE advocating for us to sacrifice our academic integrity to be better at a stupid game. So stop. We've proven that we can win with our restrictions. Clearly this season spiraled out of control and we'll need to regroup to recover next season. But these knee-jerk reactions need to stop.

ACT scores in the 20s aren’t really a problem so long as the GPA and class rank are solid.

PS — 3.0 is a flat B, 3.3 is a B+. 2.0 is a flat C, 1.7 is a C-.

 

[FitzFan]

ACT scores in the 20s aren’t really a problem so long as the GPA and class rank are solid.

PS — 3.0 is a flat B, 3.3 is a B+. 2.0 is a flat C, 1.7 is a C-.

Doh! Edited, thanks for pointing that out.

My point on ACT scores and GPA is that many high schools boost athlete GPA to increase the likelihood of college acceptance. A 3.00+ GPA is great if you work for it. Unfortunately a lot of kids are getting 3.00+ GPAs without going to class or knowing how to read.

What makes NU unique is that those athletes who do have ACT scores in the low 20s also usually have high GPAs and come from high schools that are recognized as being high-performing.

 

[IGNORE]

If a school that considers major athletic team success to be a foremost goal of the school is your thing, there are others to back. This one has never and is never going to be it. It’s one of the things one accepts as an NU fan.

my dad graduated IU and UoI and has rooted for ND based in his south side Irish upbringing. I rooted for them in HS.

Might be time to casually root for the Cats while rooting for a team that cares like ND.

 

[IGNORE]

Yes, because the relaxation of academic standards at Duke, Vandy, Rice, and BC have done wonders for their respective football programs...

compared to ours?

 

[gocatsgo2003]

my dad graduated IU and UoI and has rooted for ND based in his south side Irish upbringing. I rooted for them in HS.

Might be time to casually root for the Cats while rooting for a team that cares like ND.

Good riddance.

 

[Turk]

I don't think the talent gap is as great as many say. Can we compete with OSU? No but only a couple teams in the nation can.
The problem remains The Problem of Fitz. Loyalty isn't necessarily a virtue. And with the "Problem of Fitz' he puts loyalty over the hard work of seniors and the program. Not good!

Wickerdude was right.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

I don't think the talent gap is as great as many say. Can we compete with OSU? No but only a couple teams in the nation can.
The problem remains The Problem of Fitz. Loyalty isn't necessarily a virtue. And with the "Problem of Fitz' he puts loyalty over the hard work of seniors and the program. Not good!

Wickerdude was right.

Oh hey... figured out how to switch between screen names I see? Congrats.

 

[FitzFan]

compared to ours?

Uhhh, yes.

Vandy has never won 10 games, they've never been nationally relevant, and they've never sniffed an SEC championship. BC was last relevant in 2007 when they had Matt Ryan at QB. They hadn't won 10 games prior to his arrival since 1984. Rice has won 10 games in a season 3 times: once in 1949, again in 2007, and lastly in 2013. They've always played in bottom-tier conferences and have never been nationally relevant. Duke has had the most success recently, but they still only have one 10-win season (2013) and went 8-5 last year despite having a first-round draft pick at QB.

All of these programs have histories comparable to NU. The difference is NU didn't sell out it's academic integrity to reach that level of historical mediocrity. The other schools did.

If you're champing at the bit to leave and root for ND, I say good riddance.

 

[pawildcat]

"If you want to compete in major college sports, then you should aspire to excellence. This self-imposed penalty of ridiculous academic requirements kills both of our major men's athletic programs. We never have the athletes that our competition have."

So in other words you want an institution that aspires to athletic excellence and is perfectly willing to let academic excellence slide to attain that goal. Got it.

 

[IGNORE]

Good riddance.

Never said I would abandon the Board, Jane. You would miss me. I complete you.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Never said I would abandon the Board, Jane. You would miss me. I complete you.

Damn it

 

[willycat]

I'm an alumnus (not "an alumni") of the university. I'd rather we suck than admit everyone. It's just not that important. We graduated 100.00% of the players. No criminals. No other BS.

What's the point of being Duke basketball and admitting Adonis or Godzilla or whatever the kid's name is? Is he somehow representing the university?

Do you want a Baylor, MSU, Minn. type of group? No thanks

If they go the other way, they will lose at least one fan.

Where the hell are you coming up with the Baylor, MSU and Minnesota of the world. It's been suggested that NU follow the admission criteria of places like Duke, Vanderbilt, Rice, Tulane and ND. No not everyone but admit the same guys as your academic pears or get the hell out of the Big Ten.

 

[Gladeskat]

Nobody forces anyone into a particular major.

"They" only force you OUT of a major. Musical Performance is definitely out of the question.*

*They don't force you out, the time demands for Music Performance and football renders them mutually exclusive...unless you're Herbie Hancock.

 

[stpaulcat]

If you want to compete in major college sports, then you should aspire to excellence. This self-imposed penalty of ridiculous academic requirements kills both of our major men's athletic programs. We never have the athletes that our competition have. Even our good teams are not nearly as athletic as their opponents. We can't or won't recruit the kinds of players it takes to compete in major college sports.

Northwestern should stand for excellence in all areas. Why do I care if a kid didn't do great in high school chemistry if he's one of the best wide receivers in the country. Why should we prevent Coach Collins from recruiting a big, athletic power forward because he didn't have time or resources to take a bunch of SAT prep classes. If they've demonstrated excellence in one area while doing their best in the classroom, then we should celebrate those kids and invite them to pursue excellence at our fine university.

Either compete or get out. If you're not going to strive for excellence by going after the best possible players, then get out of the BIG.

I don't often disagree with you, but even in the Ivy League, one team has to be on the bottom of the conference. It is not the academic requirements per se that are the problem. NU has done darn well for a school of Ivy League size in the B1G over the past 25 years. If there are academic requirements (which in many cases aren't as high as one might imagine) for players, there must be coaching requirements for coaches. THAT is where we are falling off. Who can say which ones, you would have to be inside the program to know that, although it is pretty clear isn't it? Fitz really needs to up his requirements for coaches, like for instance you can't loose eleven games in a season and remain a coach at NU (I don't expect we will beat UMASS), even in anomalous seasons.. Even 7 games is too much, so we are already well past the limit. If Fitz cannot see that, perhaps he is past the limit. It is certainly time to bring the coaching staff up to the academic level of NU.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

Where the hell are you coming up with the Baylor, MSU and Minnesota of the world. It's been suggested that NU follow the admission criteria of places like Duke, Vanderbilt, Rice, Tulane and ND. No not everyone but admit the same guys as your academic pears or get the hell out of the Big Ten.

None of those schools have any academic restrictions whatsoever.

 

[gocatsgo2003]

They only force you OUT of a major. Musical Performance is definitely out of the question.

OK, weird bug guy.

 

[Gladeskat]

OK, weird bug guy.

That's me! I praise God every day for bugs and being weird!

I edited my post to add that Music Performance is not compatible with football timewise. It isn't. Someone bright and both musically and athletically gifted tried that already.

 

[phatcat]

Where the hell are you coming up with the Baylor, MSU and Minnesota of the world. It's been suggested that NU follow the admission criteria of places like Duke, Vanderbilt, Rice, Tulane and ND. No not everyone but admit the same guys as your academic pears or get the hell out of the Big Ten.

Let me be more succinct. I've grown tired of "rooting for laundry" as Seinfeld put it. I have near-zero interest in the mercenaries in pro sports. I consider the players to be true representatives of my alma mater, and I support them avidly. If they become just a bunch of random kids wearing purple (occasionally), I am no longer interested

 

[docrugby1]

I believe that NU's FB staff has done an amazing job in achieving a 100% graduation rate, at least far better than the Admissions Department. I believe that certain athletes carefully screened by the coaching staff can graduate from NU with useful degrees.

NU athletes have access to unlimited tutors, priority registration and teammates with academic discipline that can help almost any student through NU

I know NU's athletes have lower entrance scores than the general student body but if you take a careful look at NU's students maybe a little academic diversity would actually benefit NU

I would grant NU teams more leeway to admissions and then hold the coaches responsible to maintain academic and social standards

I was affiliated with Georgetown BB in the glory years when those teams were denigrated in the press as illiterate thugs. That characterization was as far from reality as possible. John Thompson ran a tight ship, The players wore coat and ties, addressed you as sir and graduated. The BB team used one of their coaching slots for Mary Fenlon, their academic coordinator. Coach Thompson took kids from lower socioeconomic/academic backgrounds and molded them into GU graduates that the school was proud to claim as their own.

NU has the resources to help student athletes and a responsibility to allow select student athletes benefit from an NU education despite possibly coming from less than ideal academic background

I'll leave the coaching questions to the message board gurus .

 

[hoosboot]

Oh absolutely. Clearly Hankwitz has been incorporating holding and pass interference techniques to the DBs, and Fitz’s kicker drills emphasizing hitting the uprights are mismanagement at their finest. How on earth did these hapless fools win three straight bowl games, four of the last five and have the fourth best conference record in the Big Ten over the last five seasons?! Clearly the players were ignoring them and coaching themselves in secret to overcome such ineptitude.

You totally forgot that our DB's have been totally Jerrified. How that guy still has a job after all these years is all on Fitz!

 

[eastbaycat99]

That's me! I praise God every day for bugs and being weird!

I edited my post to add that Music Performance is not compatible with football timewise. It isn't. Someone bright and both musically and athletically gifted tried that already.

Otto Graham?

 

[Fitz51]

No not everyone but admit the same guys as your academic pears or get the hell out of the Big Ten.

People in academia stereotypically get apples.