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OT: Tiger Woods Accident Taleaways

Alaskawildkat

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Dec 29, 2005
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Just completed watching the Emergency Responders' Press Conference regarding the Tiger Woods multiple rollover accident from earlier this morning. Both as an accident injury attorney who has worked with many experts analyzing vehicle accidents, and having been in a collision that totaled my own vehicle, certain reportings were of particular interest to me.

Foremost were some of the comments of Officer Gonzalez, the first person on the scene. He couldn't stress enough how significant it was to Tiger's survival that he was wearing his seat belt. His comments about how cars today are much "much safer than previously" with regard to how the passenger compartment remained intact despite the front of the vehicle being completely demolished also struck a personal note. ( I handled a case some years ago in which our identification of insufficient protection to the passenger compartment eventually led to the addition of side bars in the door panels by that manufacturer.)

Another aspect of the accident commented upon was how the specific location where the accident occurred was a trouble spot that has seen multiple collisions in the past. Of note was both the steep downgrade and curves that often led to vehicles exceeding the posted 45 mph speed for the somewhat rural roadway. The LAPD officer familiar with monitoring vehicles on that stretch of roadway commented he would encounter vehicles traveling 80 mph at the subject location. I appreciated his comment that "this can be a lesson to all of us" to drive slower in such circumstances. I could picture exactly what he was referring to having driven that road on multiple occasions myself.

Presumably more information will be released as to the specific injuries, which have been identified as serious and include present surgery involving his legs, it was reassuring to learn that Tiger was coherent at the scene and had survived what in the opinion of those from the police and fire departments could have been a fatal accident.

IMG_3210.jpg


Apparently "Extra, Extra" was there as well. (Correspondent Jennifer Lahmers?)

IMG_3211.jpg
 
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That the front was destroyed but the passenger compartment was intact says a lot about the structural safety. A common injury to the unbelted front seat passenger or driver is a dislocated hip, the knee striking the dash and driving the hip posteriorly out of the joint. Unlike the shoulder, this mechanism cuts the blood supply to the femoral head (can you say Bo Jackson) that may lead to the bone dying (avascular necrosis). Hopefully he'll recover and maintain the ability to walk. But compound fractures mean the bone was sticking out or ws exposed. Long way back for Tiger.
 
I’m a huge Tiger fan and actually competed against him in the same field in the Western Amateur at Point-O-Woods CC many, many years ago. Seen him play live many times over the years including at Augusta. Everyone who knows the game, including the other greats, know that TW is best to ever hit a golf ball.

Tiger looked noticeably bad on the CBS telecast on Sunday from Rivera. He looked sleepy and out of it, and talked about his recent back surgery. No doubt the guy is in pain after his 5th spinal surgery. It’s well documented that he had a problem with pain killers after the last big surgery. Wouldn’t surprise me if he was on heavy prescription medicine at the time of the accident. He probably shouldn’t have traveled cross country for the tournament, but his foundation is the co-sponsor and he was involved in the trophy ceremony.

Now he has severe compound fractures in his legs that required emergency surgery just 2 months after spinal surgery. I pray this isn’t the end for the GOAT.
 
The takeaway for me is to consider getting my wife a Hyundai Genesis SUV when it's time to replace her Honda CRV.

ironically Hyundai stock initially responded to the Genesis being Tiger’s accident vehicle by a significant decline in value close to 5%.

Haven’t followed it after that.
 

That is unfortunate if there were in fact two compound fractures. The initial reporting I read was only one compound fracture although apparently two broken legs and injury to one ankle.
 
I’m a huge Tiger fan and actually competed against him in the same field in the Western Amateur at Point-O-Woods CC many, many years ago. Seen him play live many times over the years including at Augusta. Everyone who knows the game, including the other greats, know that TW is best to ever hit a golf ball.

Tiger looked noticeably bad on the CBS telecast on Sunday from Rivera. He looked sleepy and out of it, and talked about his recent back surgery. No doubt the guy is in pain after his 5th spinal surgery. It’s well documented that he had a problem with pain killers after the last big surgery. Wouldn’t surprise me if he was on heavy prescription medicine at the time of the accident. He probably shouldn’t have traveled cross country for the tournament, but his foundation is the co-sponsor and he was involved in the trophy ceremony.

Now he has severe compound fractures in his legs that required emergency surgery just 2 months after spinal surgery. I pray this isn’t the end for the GOAT.
Why has he had so many health problems?
 
Why has he had so many health problems?

Keeping it Northwestern related, here is a responsive medical opinion, at least with regard to his multiple knee and back problems.

[Knee injuries} "are often one of the first injuries we see in golfers,” Dr. Alpesh Patel, chief of orthopedic spine surgery at the Northwestern Memorial Hospital, in Chicago said. “Once their mechanics are off, then we’ll see back injuries secondarily. So, it’s not uncommon that in Tiger’s story we saw a chain link between one and the other.”

Patel notes that this sequelae of injuries doesn’t just happen in competitive golfers but also occurs in recreational golfers — except later in life.


“We may first see these arthritic issues starting in late 30s and early 40s — as opposed to the late 20s and 30s as in Tiger’s case — and then back injuries in mid to late 40s,” Patel said.

Dr. Todd J. Albert, orthopedic spine surgeon and surgeon-in-chief at the Hospital for Special Surgery, in New York, also notes the role that genetics plays in degenerative conditions that plague the knee and back.

“More than likely, Tiger’s knee and back conditions were related. His genetics might be such that he had some early degeneration of his cartilage in his knee that caused him to change his swing mechanics and exacerbated the degenerative cartilage in his back. In other words, his knee degeneration and his disk degeneration may be related,” Albert said.


https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/tiger-woods-historic-return-8-knee-back-surgeries-n995036
 
Keeping it Northwestern related, here is a responsive medical opinion, at least with regard to his multiple knee and back problems.

[Knee injuries} "are often one of the first injuries we see in golfers,” Dr. Alpesh Patel, chief of orthopedic spine surgery at the Northwestern Memorial Hospital, in Chicago said. “Once their mechanics are off, then we’ll see back injuries secondarily. So, it’s not uncommon that in Tiger’s story we saw a chain link between one and the other.”

Patel notes that this sequelae of injuries doesn’t just happen in competitive golfers but also occurs in recreational golfers — except later in life.


“We may first see these arthritic issues starting in late 30s and early 40s — as opposed to the late 20s and 30s as in Tiger’s case — and then back injuries in mid to late 40s,” Patel said.

Dr. Todd J. Albert, orthopedic spine surgeon and surgeon-in-chief at the Hospital for Special Surgery, in New York, also notes the role that genetics plays in degenerative conditions that plague the knee and back.

“More than likely, Tiger’s knee and back conditions were related. His genetics might be such that he had some early degeneration of his cartilage in his knee that caused him to change his swing mechanics and exacerbated the degenerative cartilage in his back. In other words, his knee degeneration and his disk degeneration may be related,” Albert said.


https://www.nbcnews.com/health/health-news/tiger-woods-historic-return-8-knee-back-surgeries-n995036
The recent HBO documentary on him also pointed to his dabbling in Navy SEAL training (for fun!) when he was younger as a cause of some of his physical problems in later years. It was a really stupid thing to do for a guy who was otherwise so highly focused on passing Jack's win record wins in majors.
 
A swing as hard as his generates a lot of torsion in your lower back and legs. That's where a golfer's power comes from, so it would seem doubtful if he'll ever fully be back if the injuries are as bad as reported. The shattered ankle is a worry. I'd think he could very well come out of that with a limp.
 
That is unfortunate if there were in fact two compound fractures. The initial reporting I read was only one compound fracture although apparently two broken legs and injury to one ankle.
While the injuries themselves are not "life threatening", the complications of them may be. Open fractures mean contamination and possible infection. Three bones in the body do not heal well, and the distal tibia is one of them. Also, the possibility of fat emboli exists. That he can walk would be a major accomplishment but i don't see him galivanting around the course professionally in the near or distant future, let alone winning. Of course, that was Alex Miller's fate at the time of injry and look how he did!!
 
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Right. Alex Smith nearly lost his leg. There was a documentary made (forget which show) on his recovery. It was unbelievable how bad his leg was infected with major portions cut out. Incredible determination to come back.
 
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A swing as hard as his generates a lot of torsion in your lower back and legs. That's where a golfer's power comes from, so it would seem doubtful if he'll ever fully be back if the injuries are as bad as reported. The shattered ankle is a worry. I'd think he could very well come out of that with a limp.
It was painful even to watch Tiger take some of those massive swings out of U.S. Open rough. The jarring impact on his body over time must have been very bad.
 
Samdum's brother Alex Miller? Or, could you be referring to WFT qb Alex Smith??
 
The takeaway for me is to consider getting my wife a Hyundai Genesis SUV when it's time to replace her Honda CRV.

While the crash protection with the Genesis SUV was excellent, there is still a question of whether its handling ability at higher speeds, particularly going around curves, contributed to the accident. It appears to be a very top heavy vehicle. I don't the answer. Just asking the question.
 
I’m a huge Tiger fan and actually competed against him in the same field in the Western Amateur at Point-O-Woods CC many, many years ago. Seen him play live many times over the years including at Augusta. Everyone who knows the game, including the other greats, know that TW is best to ever hit a golf ball.

Tiger looked noticeably bad on the CBS telecast on Sunday from Rivera. He looked sleepy and out of it, and talked about his recent back surgery. No doubt the guy is in pain after his 5th spinal surgery. It’s well documented that he had a problem with pain killers after the last big surgery. Wouldn’t surprise me if he was on heavy prescription medicine at the time of the accident. He probably shouldn’t have traveled cross country for the tournament, but his foundation is the co-sponsor and he was involved in the trophy ceremony.

Now he has severe compound fractures in his legs that required emergency surgery just 2 months after spinal surgery. I pray this isn’t the end for the GOAT.

There will always be a legitimate debate among many informed golfers as to whether Jack or Tiger were the better players. Lots of different ways to look at the question. Some favor Tiger. Others favor Jack. Tiger was transformative, much like Arnie. Nobody ever hit a 1 iron like Jack. Tiger's peaks have had no parallel. But Jack's longevity is also in a world of its own. And most of what he accomplished was done with dramatically inferior clubs and balls. Place the 2 at the peak of their careers on the same course (Augusta) with the same equipment and Tiger would be the slight betting favorite. But would you bet against Jack? I wouldn't. Then fast forward 20 years past their prime. Jack is still capable of winning the Masters. Tiger is out of the game altogether.

GOUNUII

GOUNUII
 
The takeaway for me is to consider getting my wife a Hyundai Genesis SUV when it's time to replace her Honda CRV.

Is that what he was driving? I’ve heard Hyundai is really putting out solid cars. Have no idea of this is true.
 
There will always be a legitimate debate among many informed golfers as to whether Jack or Tiger were the better players. Lots of different ways to look at the question. Some favor Tiger. Others favor Jack. Tiger was transformative, much like Arnie. Nobody ever hit a 1 iron like Jack. Tiger's peaks have had no parallel. But Jack's longevity is also in a world of its own. And most of what he accomplished was done with dramatically inferior clubs and balls. Place the 2 at the peak of their careers on the same course (Augusta) with the same equipment and Tiger would be the slight betting favorite. But would you bet against Jack? I wouldn't. Then fast forward 20 years past their prime. Jack is still capable of winning the Masters. Tiger is out of the game altogether.

GOUNUII

GOUNUII

I guess it depends when you count their "primes." Tiger won the Masters at age 43. The equipment point is somewhat true, but Tiger's persimmon career was pretty darn impressive (basically the best ever at each individual stage), and the vast majority of his professional accomplishments were before the Trackman everyone swing as hard as you can era.
 
I am very familiar with Hawthorne Blvd in Rancho Palos Verdes where this accident occurred. Having friends in the area, I have driven it many times. This is on a long, relatively steep downhill portion of the divided road headed down into the LA Basin. If you drive reasonably close to the 45 mph (I think) speed limit, there is no problem whatsoever. Tiger, however, went through the median, across the oncoming traffic lanes and rolled down a steep embankment. The reports all say he was going too fast and there were no skid marks. The reports also claim that he wasn't impaired. The only way I can reconcile those statements is to say that he was asleep at the wheel at 7 AM. Sadly something doesn't sound right here IMHO.
 
Is that what he was driving? I’ve heard Hyundai is really putting out solid cars. Have no idea of this is true.
Tiger was driving the new Genesis SUV that just was released in the US. Genesis is the premium brand for Hyundai, like Lexus for Toyota, etc. I've been eying this vehicle for a while now, it is a beautiful SUV and I'll probably be buying one soon. Tiger was actually returning from the Genesis Invitational golf tournament, and he was driving a courtesy vehicle from Genesis. He must've been either in a hurry or enjoying the vehicle, because there was an incident in the parking lot as he pulled out, where he was going too fast. I don't think the vehicle had anything to do with the accident.
 
While the crash protection with the Genesis SUV was excellent, there is still a question of whether its handling ability at higher speeds, particularly going around curves, contributed to the accident. It appears to be a very top heavy vehicle. I don't the answer. Just asking the question.

The other thing with regard to the vehicle that will be looked at is whether added protections or design changes could have reduced the likely mechanical intrusions that led to the ankle and leg injuries.
 
This happened just down the street from my friend’s house. Steep hills in that part of town and often fog on that side of the hill. There was a decal on the side of the SUV so I assume he was borrowing it. Unfamiliar car, unfamiliar steep windy road, unfortunate accident.
 
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This happened just down the street from my friend’s house. Steep hills in that part of town and often fog on that side of the hill. There was a decal on the side of the SUV so I assume he was borrowing it. Unfamiliar car, unfamiliar steep windy road, unfortunate accident.
It was a courtesy vehicle from Genesis, who sponsored the golf tournament.
 
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I am very familiar with Hawthorne Blvd in Rancho Palos Verdes where this accident occurred. Having friends in the area, I have driven it many times. This is on a long, relatively steep downhill portion of the divided road headed down into the LA Basin. If you drive reasonably close to the 45 mph (I think) speed limit, there is no problem whatsoever. Tiger, however, went through the median, across the oncoming traffic lanes and rolled down a steep embankment. The reports all say he was going too fast and there were no skid marks. The reports also claim that he wasn't impaired. The only way I can reconcile those statements is to say that he was asleep at the wheel at 7 AM. Sadly something doesn't sound right here IMHO.
Also it's being reported that he was on a some meds because of his bad back and recent surgery.
 
Also it's being reported that he was on a some meds because of his bad back and recent surgery.
If he had a script for it and he was taking it as directed, I don't think charges would result
 
Just completed watching the Emergency Responders' Press Conference regarding the Tiger Woods multiple rollover accident from earlier this morning. Both as an accident injury attorney who has worked with many experts analyzing vehicle accidents, and having been in a collision that totaled my own vehicle, certain reportings were of particular interest to me.

Foremost were some of the comments of Officer Gonzalez, the first person on the scene. He couldn't stress enough how significant it was to Tiger's survival that he was wearing his seat belt. His comments about how cars today are much "much safer than previously" with regard to how the passenger compartment remained intact despite the front of the vehicle being completely demolished also struck a personal note. ( I handled a case some years ago in which our identification of insufficient protection to the passenger compartment eventually led to the addition of side bars in the door panels by that manufacturer.)

Another aspect of the accident commented upon was how the specific location where the accident occurred was a trouble spot that has seen multiple collisions in the past. Of note was both the steep downgrade and curves that often led to vehicles exceeding the posted 45 mph speed for the somewhat rural roadway. The LAPD officer familiar with monitoring vehicles on that stretch of roadway commented he would encounter vehicles traveling 80 mph at the subject location. I appreciated his comment that "this can be a lesson to all of us" to drive slower in such circumstances. I could picture exactly what he was referring to having driven that road on multiple occasions myself.

Presumably more information will be released as to the specific injuries, which have been identified as serious and include present surgery involving his legs, it was reassuring to learn that Tiger was coherent at the scene and had survived what in the opinion of those from the police and fire departments could have been a fatal accident.

IMG_3210.jpg


Apparently "Extra, Extra" was there as well. (Correspondent Jennifer Lahmers?)

IMG_3211.jpg
Great post. Thank you, Alaska.
 
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That is unfortunate if there were in fact two compound fractures. The initial reporting I read was only one compound fracture although apparently two broken legs and injury to one ankle.

My understanding is that it early reports where he suffered two fractured legs. At a later press conference, an officer reported Tiger had multiple compound fractures to one leg (right leg) involving the tibia and fibula while the other leg was OK.
 
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I have a friend , who owns about 15 car dealerships-he drives Hyundais


Interesting. One of the automobile reconstruction experts I worked with years ago would only drive a Volvo. At the time they were the gold standard of a safe vehicle. Another expert had a roll cage installed in his personal car.

It is bad enough when I drive around town with family members that they keep hearing from me about which accident happened at which intersection and which locations are the most dangerous based on multiple collisions.
 
I have a friend , who owns about 15 car dealerships-he drives Hyundais
Sales of that model will go thru the roof. Genesis doesn't need Tiger to sponsor a golf tourney now.
Hyundai and its sister brand Kia are knocking it out of the park. The Palisade and Telluride SUVs are best-in-class, and their reliability and safety ratings are tops. Genesis already is very competitive with Mercedes, BMW, Lexus, etc. in the premium market. They just have to overcome the now-outdated poor perception of the brand from back in the day when they used to make crappy cars.
 
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