Question for Collins Supporters

[Sec.112]

... If you calculate earnings per win, he is wildly overpaid. But that is not exactly fair when hiring someone. It is, though, a number to ponder when evaluating a coach's tenure.

Earnings per win also doesn't add any complexity to the discussion about the obvious career risk someone takes in this gig, and not using it as a springboard for another position. There's a cost for all of these factors.

The truth is I don't know why anyone cares how much he's paid. NU has MORE, MORE and MORE than enough money to even overpay. And now his salary specifically is donated. So it's not a budgetary issue.

The salary discussion is just an excuse to accentuate an argument that has more than enough talking points.

It's also an example of the traditionally cheap approach to athletics that got NU to this position in the first place. The good Dr. did a lot to fight that off, but the mindset obviously still exists.

 

[peatymeanis]

Now we're bringing in the opinion of NU administrators? Now I know you're one of the NU cheapasses.

There's MORE than enough evidence to crush Collins without using his incredibly-average B10 salary.

Yeah, I’m a cheapass because I think a guy should deliver results on par with his pay. The median B10 coach has a team that is a top 25-35 team in the country, depending on year. If Collins is getting a median salary he should deliver median results.

And it’s not me making the administrator argument. It’s everyone else in here. I think the school is rich enough to buy him out yesterday.

 

[TheC]

Earnings per win also doesn't add any complexity to the discussion about the obvious career risk someone takes in this gig, and not using it as a springboard for another position. There's a cost for all of these factors.

The truth is I don't know why anyone cares how much he's paid. NU has MORE, MORE and MORE than enough money to even overpay. And now his salary specifically is donated. So it's not a budgetary issue.

The salary discussion is just an excuse to accentuate an argument that has more than enough talking points.

It's also an example of the traditionally cheap approach to athletics that got NU to this position in the first place. The good Dr. did a lot to fight that off, but the mindset obviously still exists.

As much as I'll likely complain when (if) if happens, it would be great if someone were able to come here and use this job as a springboard. It would suggest they had a lot of success.

 

[CappyNU]

3) How does EVERY team lighting it up from 3 not concern you?

Somebody out here has offered the theory that what has REALLY changed since the tournament is the loss of Baldwin coaching defense. That's the theory I'm starting to buy.

I've thought about that a bit, assuming Baldwin, Donlon and Borovich are the defensive assistants, we have the conference stats that look like this:

Year	Def. Rtg	3pa%	3pt%	2pt%
2014 - Baldwin	103.0 - 5th	32.0 - 2nd	32.2 - 4th	46.4 - 4th
2015 - Baldwin	111.7 - 14th	40.1 - 14th	38.8 - 13th	44.8 - 2nd
2016 - Baldwin	104.7 - 8th	39.5 - 14th	36.3 - 8th	46.7 - 5th
2017 - Baldwin	100.5 - 4th	33.2 - 6th	33.0 - 4th	45.4 - 4th
2018 - Donlon	105.3 - 8th	39.2 - 13th	33.1 - 2nd	51.4 - 10th
2019 - Donlon	101.1 - 6th	32.4 - 2nd	29.4 - 2nd	49.3 - 11th
2020 - Borovich	108.0 - 13th	43.7 - 14th	34.3 - 13th	47.9 - 10th
2021 - Borovich	110.2 - 14th	42.4 - 11th	36.0 - 13th	53.6 - 12th

So we've got Baldwin making big progress from 2015-17, then leaving to be a head coach. Then Donlon makes progress from 2018-19 while the offense falls off a cliff, but leaves to become a head coach, and then we have Borovich, who....is not doing great. Yes, teams are shooting more threes on average, but this is a real problem that has been a significant part of the losing streak.

 

[GatoLouco]

Earnings per win also doesn't add any complexity to the discussion about the obvious career risk someone takes in this gig, and not using it as a springboard for another position. There's a cost for all of these factors.

The truth is I don't know why anyone cares how much he's paid. NU has MORE, MORE and MORE than enough money to even overpay. And now his salary specifically is donated. So it's not a budgetary issue.

The salary discussion is just an excuse to accentuate an argument that has more than enough talking points.

It's also an example of the traditionally cheap approach to athletics that got NU to this position in the first place. The good Dr. did a lot to fight that off, but the mindset obviously still exists.

That's why I said it's not fair to think about earnings per win when giving someone a contract. Because you go into it with the expectation you are hiring someone who will be successful. But it is a point of evaluation of how well a coach has done. Nor relative to MSU. But relative to more comparable programs.

In any case, the issue here is that you seem to believe the discussion is about Collins being, or not, overpaid. At least to me it's not. It's about the suggestion that, because he is paid an average B1G salary, he should be cut some slack because of it. He's paid fairly. Just like million of people are. And if they suck, it is reasonable to fire them.

 

[GatoLouco]

I've thought about that a bit, assuming Baldwin, Donlon and Borovich are the defensive assistants, we have the conference stats that look like this:

Year	Def. Rtg	3pa%	3pt%	2pt%
2014 - Baldwin	103.0 - 5th	32.0 - 2nd	32.2 - 4th	46.4 - 4th
2015 - Baldwin	111.7 - 14th	40.1 - 14th	38.8 - 13th	44.8 - 2nd
2016 - Baldwin	104.7 - 8th	39.5 - 14th	36.3 - 8th	46.7 - 5th
2017 - Baldwin	100.5 - 4th	33.2 - 6th	33.0 - 4th	45.4 - 4th
2018 - Donlon	105.3 - 8th	39.2 - 13th	33.1 - 2nd	51.4 - 10th
2019 - Donlon	101.1 - 6th	32.4 - 2nd	29.4 - 2nd	49.3 - 11th
2020 - Borovich	108.0 - 13th	43.7 - 14th	34.3 - 13th	47.9 - 10th
2021 - Borovich	110.2 - 14th	42.4 - 11th	36.0 - 13th	53.6 - 12th

So we've got Baldwin making big progress from 2015-17, then leaving to be a head coach. Then Donlon makes progress from 2018-19 while the offense falls off a cliff, but leaves to become a head coach, and then we have Borovich, who....is not doing great. Yes, teams are shooting more threes on average, but this is a real problem that has been a significant part of the losing streak.

Are those 3pt% rankings for 18/19 right? 2nd with a 29.4%?

I can provide a theory for the 20 and 21 defensive debacle
1) 20 - abuse of zone
2) 21 - some initial abuse of zone and a lineup that did not match defensively with other team's interior play

As usual, love looking at your numbers

 

[Styre]

I don’t any program should make to rash of decisions this season in hiring or firing because yes this season is crazy for everyone. Keep in mind it’s not just the physical issues of covid that they’re dealing with but the mental situation of young men 18-22 year old. That’s a player by player case and can’t be easy to play at a high level kinda shut off from a lot of their support systems. Yes every program faces that but that’s kinda my point. Unless you were planning on moving on from a coach and this was a good excuse season or a hire didn’t have their first big year this year I wouldn’t make the move.

This, to me, is the best argument for keeping Collins around for another year - given how challenging this season is across the board, it's difficult to hold anyone too accountable for the way things go. After all, if the players get a mulligan on eligibility for this year, shouldn't the coaches effectively get the same?

That said, the problems shown on the court this year are exactly the same problems that have plagued the program since the tournament year. It's not like NU is playing unusually badly this season.

 

[CappyNU]

Are those 3pt% rankings for 18/19 right? 2nd with a 29.4%?

I can provide a theory for the 20 and 21 defensive debacle
1) 20 - abuse of zone
2) 21 - some initial abuse of zone and a lineup that did not match defensively with other team's interior play

As usual, love looking at your numbers

Yeah, the 29.4% is correct, but we were very boom or bust in conference that season. In 5 games, teams shot 40% or better against us, and in 12 games teams shot below 30%, including the illustrious 0-11 from Illinois in the game we won by two after their game-winning attempt clanged off the rim (same day as the Bears double-doink against my Eagles).

We lost 5 games while holding teams to 25% shooting from 3 or worse...hard to do.

 

[GatoLouco]

This, to me, is the best argument for keeping Collins around for another year - given how challenging this season is across the board, it's difficult to hold anyone too accountable for the way things go. After all, if the players get a mulligan on eligibility for this year, shouldn't the coaches effectively get the same?

That said, the problems shown on the court this year are exactly the same problems that have plagued the program since the tournament year. It's not like NU is playing unusually badly this season.

On top of that, we do not have an AD. Even if we do soon, unless he has close ties with a big name that would be willing to come to NU, he ain't firing Collins.

Even if he came in with the firm conviction Collins needs to go, it does not seem a good move to pull the trigger:
1) Quick searches for a new head coach are likely to lead to a bad hire
2) Going for a year with an interim coach is likely to lead to a hoard of transfers and recruits bailing. Turning the state of the program into a rebuild from zero.

 

[hoosboot]

This board has been clamoring for Ryan Young to not only get more run, but more touches, since he only averages about 5 FGA per game, shoots 60% FG, and often seems underutilized. Yesterday Collins recognized IU’s lack of interior defense and made a point to force feed Young the ball and have him be aggressive. Young took 11 shots within 3 feet of the basket. He made 5 — a below average night.

Same thing with Audige. We say he’s the only one who can create his own shot. We get upset when Buie hogs the ball in the clutch instead of giving it to him. So twice Collins refuses to call timeout and instead lets Audige go 1 v 1 without giving the defense time to get set. That’s aggressive and shows trust in your playmaker. Audige failed to covert at the end and missed a FT that also would have sealed the deal.

Miller Kopp went 2-8. He went 2-9 the previous game, and shooting 30% over his last 3 contests.

You can scheme all you want, but at some point the players need to show up.

Nah. But if you hire 13 guys to do a job and 12 of them fail to live up to expectations, that’s probably an organizational failure. And when the 13th guy finally manages to accomplish the organization’s stated goal but can only do it once out of 10 tries, that’s probably also an organizational failure. And when people steadfastly believe that the solution is to fire him and hire a 14th guy to do the same job with basically the same working situation, that’s *definitely* a problem.

But whatever. It’s just a game and we all should have more important things to worry about.

Those are pretty interesting posts to be making back-to-back. In the second, I couldn't tell if the "you" that you were talking about was Coach Collins or the NU Athletic Department.

It seems pretty inconsistent to insist that subordinates (players) have to be better and it's not the people in charge (the coaches) who are responsible in one post and then insist that it's not the subordinates (coaches) who have to be better and it's the people in charge (administration) who are responsible in another.

It's pretty ugly that Coach Collins has a worse overall winning percentage and looks to be headed to a worse B1G winning percentage by the end of this season than what came before him. That's not progress and, while I'm not one of the people calling for CCC to be fired, something definitely has to improve. I guess we just need players to play better and administrators to administrate better since the coaching isn't the problem.

 

[SDakaGordie]

What do folks think of Brian James’ pre-season statement that Buie would have a breakout season? Should we fire James for totally missing on this? This year is SO SO impacted by Buie’s horrific play. We are going to blame Collins for this? Come on. Buie knows he’s playing horribly, and it is impacting everyone else. That’s the problem. If he were playing even close to his own expectations, we would not be having any of these Collins discussions.

 

[GatoLouco]

☝️More excuses☝️

 

[SDakaGordie]

You don’t agree Buie is playing below our and his own expectations? That’s a fact; not an excuse.

 

[GatoLouco]

That’s not the point is it? He played well at PSU, we lost. Point is making another excuse on why we haven’t won games.

Stefanovic was out several games at Purdue, Kalscheur was supposed to be Minnesota’s 2nd best player and is having a bad season, Harper Jr has been in a slump for several games. All those teams managed to win games.

So, next excuse? Oh but those guys are not point guards? Oh but this, oh but that. If this, if that... when you want to make excuses there’s always the next one.

 

[SDakaGordie]

You make many fine arguments on this board, but saying I am making excuses for Collins is not one of them. I have no personal relationship with Collins and pretty much hated all things Duke basketball. You and others can’t just dismiss issues like academic restrictions and call them excuses. You don’t think Collins could bring in much better guys if he didn’t have our restrictions? And his system wouldn’t generate a lot more wins if we had those comparable athletes all the way down the lineup? Carmody was a coaching magician and almost no one can replicate that, but Collins has a system to attract these better athletes that has already in one season and will someday, if we show patience, outreach Carmody’s success level. We had Bamisile. We beat out Michigan for Nance. All three of our incoming recruits had all very high major offers (I don’t recall that for hardly any of our historical recruits). Let’s exhibit a bit more patience despite the disappointment. And lastly - some might remember how Fitz was constantly berated for in-game coaching during prior years; look where we are now.

 

[IdahoAlum]

Bottom line is Collins isn’t going anywhere until NU has an AD and that AD has time to make an honest assessment. So we’re probably talking this time next year. Then we’ll know all anyone needs to know: is this team competitive or not, and does the fan base care? Ticket sales will serve as the final referendum. Empty arena, assuming fans are allowed again, means time for a buyout.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

You make many fine arguments on this board, but saying I am making excuses for Collins is not one of them. I have no personal relationship with Collins and pretty much hated all things Duke basketball. You and others can’t just dismiss issues like academic restrictions and call them excuses. You don’t think Collins could bring in much better guys if he didn’t have our restrictions? And his system wouldn’t generate a lot more wins if we had those comparable athletes all the way down the lineup? Carmody was a coaching magician and almost no one can replicate that, but Collins has a system to attract these better athletes that has already in one season and will someday, if we show patience, outreach Carmody’s success level. We had Bamisile. We beat out Michigan for Nance. All three of our incoming recruits had all very high major offers (I don’t recall that for hardly any of our historical recruits). Let’s exhibit a bit more patience despite the disappointment. And lastly - some might remember how Fitz was constantly berated for in-game coaching during prior years; look where we are now.

I will chime in to take my fair share of abuse from the anti-CCC hyper posters too. I don’t get the need to claim any argument that doesn’t support immediate termination of CCC is an excuse! It there isn’t two sides there is no discussion and end the thread at Fire Collins. Two word thread.

CCC should shoulder a good portion of the blame. His offense is horrendous down the stretch of games. Total isolation and hope Chase hits a shot. On defense, certain groups look like they have never seen a three point attempt before. He has a team with a very frail mindset, he has to instill enough hope and confidence in them to prevail in a game(s). He hasn’t done this.

I don’t like to typically tear into 18-22 year olds, but if people can’t see this team lacks that Alpa Dog that every team needs to lead them in crunch time, you aren’t watching, they don’t have one. I want Nance or Kopp to get pissed enough at losing to not only show leadership in raising their game but also to reign in others and tell them they are killing the team. Hey AAA you suck today, get it going! Sorry, I just don’t see any on court leadership when it is needed. Last year, this core of players deferred to a LaCrosse player and this year they defer to a transfer from W&M. If we had Spencer on this team, NU would have 3 more wins and it’s not because he is a Uber talented B Ball player.

as far as talent, it is better by NU standards, but who from NU starts on a B1GTen contender? The ball handlers fall down more than any group I have ever seen. The ball is turned over and it’s an easy basket the other way. The one guy who can create a shot has never met a shot he doesn’t like. The majority of team hang around the three point line and wait to Jack up a three with 2 seconds left of the shot clock. The problem is they can’t shoot at all. Then in one-and-one critical FT’s at the end of the game we always miss the first one. How are Coach Cal or Coach K doing this year with all those 5 stars? Watch them and you see the same issues as NU with no leadership on the court. We things go South for NU they continue to STAY going South. Has any player ever stepped up and drilled an opposing player during one of the inevitable runs that cost us the game? A hard foul is OK when needed. Blasphemy to some NU fans, but this happens in street ball. Stay on the court if you win.

CCC needs to toughen this team up. Play the right way or don’t play. We can lose with anybody on the court. CCC is to blame for not addressing ( to our knowledge) many of the CORRECTABLE things I mention. However, this is a group fail, and as Tim Anderson so eloquently said yesterday, “Tony makes out the line up card, Tony don’t play any games”.

 

[NUChicago]

I will chime in to take my fair share of abuse from the anti-CCC hyper posters too. I don’t get the need to claim any argument that doesn’t support immediate termination of CCC is an excuse! It there isn’t two sides there is no discussion and end the thread at Fire Collins. Two word thread.

CCC should shoulder a good portion of the blame. His offense is horrendous down the stretch of games. Total isolation and hope Chase hits a shot. On defense, certain groups look like they have never seen a three point attempt before. He has a team with a very frail mindset, he has to instill enough hope and confidence in them to prevail in a game(s). He hasn’t done this.

I don’t like to typically tear into 18-22 year olds, but if people can’t see this team lacks that Alpa Dog that every team needs to lead them in crunch time, you aren’t watching, they don’t have one. I want Nance or Kopp to get pissed enough at losing to not only show leadership in raising their game but also to reign in others and tell them they are killing the team. Hey AAA you suck today, get it going! Sorry, I just don’t see any on court leadership when it is needed. Last year, this core of players deferred to a LaCrosse player and this year they defer to a transfer from W&M. If we had Spencer on this team, NU would have 3 more wins and it’s not because he is a Uber talented B Ball player.

as far as talent, it is better by NU standards, but who from NU starts on a B1GTen contender? The ball handlers fall down more than any group I have ever seen. The ball is turned over and it’s an easy basket the other way. The one guy who can create a shot has never met a shot he doesn’t like. The majority of team hang around the three point line and wait to Jack up a three with 2 seconds left of the shot clock. The problem is they can’t shoot at all. Then in one-and-one critical FT’s at the end of the game we always miss the first one. How are Coach Cal or Coach K doing this year with all those 5 stars? Watch them and you see the same issues as NU with no leadership on the court. We things go South for NU they continue to STAY going South. Has any player ever stepped up and drilled an opposing player during one of the inevitable runs that cost us the game? A hard foul is OK when needed. Blasphemy to some NU fans, but this happens in street ball. Stay on the court if you win.

CCC needs to toughen this team up. Play the right way or don’t play. We can lose with anybody on the court. CCC is to blame for not addressing ( to our knowledge) many of the CORRECTABLE things I mention. However, this is a group fail, and as Tim Anderson so eloquently said yesterday, “Tony makes out the line up card, Tony don’t play any games”.

THIS!!! The one item that stuck out to me was turnovers. We find some unbelievable ways to turn the ball over at critical times.

 

[Sec.112]

... and pretty much hated all things Duke basketball ...

To quote a bad Stones song, you're not the only one with mixed emotions.

So often, I think, "Settle down, Chrissy."

 

[eastbaycat99]

LOL, as I read your first question, my thought was, "There's not much on this team that doesn't concern me." So that gives you an overview of the remaining answers. But since you asked ...

1) Let's put it this way. I think you can rebound in this system. Does he have the guys to do it? Obviously not.

I offered the example of Matt Painter this week. One of the reasons I know he's successful is that he knows to have a big front line - the huge guy in the middle year after year, and some 6-8ish bulk next to him.

Collins is forever in search of the Euro guy - the stretch 4 who can shoot from outside and a lean-ish big man who can run the court. I think that's a BIG problem with his approach, and it reduces the concentration on rebounding and defense.

I think this point is absolutely spot on. The tournament team had Lumpkin, who while not being 6’ 8” and round was a rock at holding position on defense and rebounding. He was also recruited by Carmody. I have griped consistently over the last few years that I think the Cats could build better on a foundation that emphasizes interior defense and rebounding: the players capable of it are generally less highly prized recruiting targets, making them more likely to come to NU, they can be developed with weight training and good technical coaching, and they are a real necessity in the B1G, where teams like Wisconsin, Purdue and Iowa always build from the post out. I think Collins’ basic design vision does not fit particularly well at NU, and have said so for the last few years.

 

[peatymeanis]

I think this point is absolutely spot on. The tournament team had Lumpkin, who while not being 6’ 8” and round was a rock at holding position on defense and rebounding. He was also recruited by Carmody. I have griped consistently over the last few years that I think the Cats could build better on a foundation that emphasizes interior defense and rebounding: the players capable of it are generally less highly prized recruiting targets, making them more likely to come to NU, they can be developed with weight training and good technical coaching, and they are a real necessity in the B1G, where teams like Wisconsin, Purdue and Iowa always build from the post out. I think Collins’ basic design vision does not fit particularly well at NU, and have said so for the last few years.

I have never heard of any successful coach at any level that doesn’t view rebounding as important. If Collins basic design vision doesn’t include rebounding then he doesn’t fit well anywhere high level basketball is played.

 

[Catreporter]

I think this point is absolutely spot on. The tournament team had Lumpkin, who while not being 6’ 8” and round was a rock at holding position on defense and rebounding. He was also recruited by Carmody. I have griped consistently over the last few years that I think the Cats could build better on a foundation that emphasizes interior defense and rebounding: the players capable of it are generally less highly prized recruiting targets, making them more likely to come to NU, they can be developed with weight training and good technical coaching, and they are a real necessity in the B1G, where teams like Wisconsin, Purdue and Iowa always build from the post out. I think Collins’ basic design vision does not fit particularly well at NU, and have said so for the last few years.

Well, he's redshirting a 7-foot high school shot blocker so I think he gets the need for better defense. Buie's regression has really hurt the offense. Cant penetrate and his 3-point shooting, which was key early on, has fallen off the charts.

 

[mickbula]

Didn't we have like a 5 game win streak in BIG play during CCC's first yr as nu coach with all carmody recruits? What the hell has happened to our teams since then?? We really are sinking fast. CCC just needs to be cut loose andwe need to start fresh with someone new

 

[NJCat]

Didn't we have like a 5 game win streak in BIG play during CCC's first yr as nu coach with all carmody recruits? What the hell has happened to our teams since then?? We really are sinking fast. CCC just needs to be cut loose andwe need to start fresh with someone new

Nope. You are thinking of the 4 out of 5 with wins against Indiana and Purdue plus Wisconsin and Minny sandwiched around a loss to Iowa. of course after that stretch NU went on a 7 game losing streak. They did however win a BTT game.

 

[Catreporter]

That Big Ten was not nearly as good or deep as this one is. Heck, Rutgers was practically an automatic win back then. Now, they're borderline Top 25. Michigan State just lost by 30 at home against Iowa. Is it time to let Izzo go? No, he's got some great recruits coming in as do we. Collins has not lost the team. They are playing hard. He keeps changing the lineups but the pieces aren't all fitting yet.

 

[NJCat]

Well, he's redshirting a 7-foot high school shot blocker so I think he gets the need for better defense.

Nicholson? He's played already so he's not red shirting. He's just not ready for prime time.

 

[GatoLouco]

That Big Ten was not nearly as good or deep as this one is. Heck, Rutgers was practically an automatic win back then. Now, they're borderline Top 25. Michigan State just lost by 30 at home against Iowa. Is it time to let Izzo go? No, he's got some great recruits coming in as do we. Collins has not lost the team. They are playing hard. He keeps changing the lineups but the pieces aren't all fitting yet.

Comparing CC to Izzo is just silly

 

[RU1-Newtown_ Pa]

Best of luck the remainder of the season. One of the big keys today was Rutgers defense. Myles Johnson ate Ryan Young’s lunch, snack and dinner. Pete Nance is a good player but NU doesn’t have anyone who can go toe to toe with Myles.

 

[GatoLouco]

I will chime in to take my fair share of abuse from the anti-CCC hyper posters too. I don’t get the need to claim any argument that doesn’t support immediate termination of CCC is an excuse! It there isn’t two sides there is no discussion and end the thread at Fire Collins. Two word thread.

CCC should shoulder a good portion of the blame. His offense is horrendous down the stretch of games. Total isolation and hope Chase hits a shot. On defense, certain groups look like they have never seen a three point attempt before. He has a team with a very frail mindset, he has to instill enough hope and confidence in them to prevail in a game(s). He hasn’t done this.

I don’t like to typically tear into 18-22 year olds, but if people can’t see this team lacks that Alpa Dog that every team needs to lead them in crunch time, you aren’t watching, they don’t have one. I want Nance or Kopp to get pissed enough at losing to not only show leadership in raising their game but also to reign in others and tell them they are killing the team. Hey AAA you suck today, get it going! Sorry, I just don’t see any on court leadership when it is needed. Last year, this core of players deferred to a LaCrosse player and this year they defer to a transfer from W&M. If we had Spencer on this team, NU would have 3 more wins and it’s not because he is a Uber talented B Ball player.

as far as talent, it is better by NU standards, but who from NU starts on a B1GTen contender? The ball handlers fall down more than any group I have ever seen. The ball is turned over and it’s an easy basket the other way. The one guy who can create a shot has never met a shot he doesn’t like. The majority of team hang around the three point line and wait to Jack up a three with 2 seconds left of the shot clock. The problem is they can’t shoot at all. Then in one-and-one critical FT’s at the end of the game we always miss the first one. How are Coach Cal or Coach K doing this year with all those 5 stars? Watch them and you see the same issues as NU with no leadership on the court. We things go South for NU they continue to STAY going South. Has any player ever stepped up and drilled an opposing player during one of the inevitable runs that cost us the game? A hard foul is OK when needed. Blasphemy to some NU fans, but this happens in street ball. Stay on the court if you win.

CCC needs to toughen this team up. Play the right way or don’t play. We can lose with anybody on the court. CCC is to blame for not addressing ( to our knowledge) many of the CORRECTABLE things I mention. However, this is a group fail, and as Tim Anderson so eloquently said yesterday, “Tony makes out the line up card, Tony don’t play any games”.

I'll bite. But not to abuse you. I happen to agree with 90% of what you just said.

I don't want to discount the alpha dog situation. It's extremely important. Other than basketball, the sport I pay a fair amount of attention to is soccer. Liverpool was arguably the best team in the world (case for Bayern to be made) for the last 2 years. They are 13 points behind Man City in the Premier League and MC has one less game. One of the reasons? Absence, due to injury, of Van Dijck, the alpha dog.

I could add we do not have a clamp down guy. Gaines is a good defender, can keep up with even bigger guys cause he is strong. But he's not quick enough to go and not help, and just shut down a guy who caught fire. Our best hope for the future doing that might be, gasp, Audige.

In the end I'm sure you agree that the problem is not just one thing. It's not just the alpha dog, or guard situation, or injuries, or this or that. It never is, there is no silver bullet of one thing that can change and the problem is fixed. Which bears the question, if it's the whole system? Who, other than admissions is pulling the strings? The coach. He's the CEO of the place. He's failing.

 

[NJCat]

Best of luck the remainder of the season. One of the big keys today was Rutgers defense. Myles Johnson ate Ryan Young’s lunch, snack and dinner. Pete Nance is a good player but NU doesn’t have anyone who can go toe to toe with Myles.

After watching the BTN feature on Myles I became a big fan of him and his parents. He is what is great about college hoops. Smart kid, great family.

 

[julescat]

Well, he's redshirting a 7-foot high school shot blocker so I think he gets the need for better defense. Buie's regression has really hurt the offense. Cant penetrate and his 3-point shooting, which was key early on, has fallen off the charts.

Redshirting? That is meaningless this year.

 

[NJCat]

Liverpool was arguably the best team in the world (case for Bayern to be made) for the last 2 years. They are 13 points behind Man City in the Premier League and MC has one less game. One of the reasons? Absence, due to injury, of Van Dijck, the alpha dog.

Exactly. Take today's game LFC led 1-nil late but gave up a goal. Not a bad result. Then Alisson made a horrible play well out of the penalty area because he wasn't confident in the new center back. 2-1. And LFC folded, giving up yet another goal in about a 6 minute span. The alpha dog effect is real and NU doesn't have one.

 

[Dugan15]

Firing Chris Collins isn’t going to happen this year. So, that is not the issue at hand. As I was patient and supportive of Coach Carmody, so shall I be with Coach Collins.

What I struggle so much with, particularly given the pedigree of Coach Collins, is his devastating inability to recruit, retain or develop fundamentally sound guard play. McIntosh is a big win. But, then we add: Vassar, Ash, I. Brown, Greer and Buie. Too early to tell on Audige and Berry.

 

[NJCat]

Too early to tell on Audige and Berry.

Audige is showing improvement. Might just be the best player on this years team. Berry I'd give an "Incomplete".

 

[freewillie07]

I will chime in to take my fair share of abuse from the anti-CCC hyper posters too. I don’t get the need to claim any argument that doesn’t support immediate termination of CCC is an excuse! It there isn’t two sides there is no discussion and end the thread at Fire Collins. Two word thread.

CCC should shoulder a good portion of the blame. His offense is horrendous down the stretch of games. Total isolation and hope Chase hits a shot. On defense, certain groups look like they have never seen a three point attempt before. He has a team with a very frail mindset, he has to instill enough hope and confidence in them to prevail in a game(s). He hasn’t done this.

I don’t like to typically tear into 18-22 year olds, but if people can’t see this team lacks that Alpa Dog that every team needs to lead them in crunch time, you aren’t watching, they don’t have one. I want Nance or Kopp to get pissed enough at losing to not only show leadership in raising their game but also to reign in others and tell them they are killing the team. Hey AAA you suck today, get it going! Sorry, I just don’t see any on court leadership when it is needed. Last year, this core of players deferred to a LaCrosse player and this year they defer to a transfer from W&M. If we had Spencer on this team, NU would have 3 more wins and it’s not because he is a Uber talented B Ball player.

as far as talent, it is better by NU standards, but who from NU starts on a B1GTen contender? The ball handlers fall down more than any group I have ever seen. The ball is turned over and it’s an easy basket the other way. The one guy who can create a shot has never met a shot he doesn’t like. The majority of team hang around the three point line and wait to Jack up a three with 2 seconds left of the shot clock. The problem is they can’t shoot at all. Then in one-and-one critical FT’s at the end of the game we always miss the first one. How are Coach Cal or Coach K doing this year with all those 5 stars? Watch them and you see the same issues as NU with no leadership on the court. We things go South for NU they continue to STAY going South. Has any player ever stepped up and drilled an opposing player during one of the inevitable runs that cost us the game? A hard foul is OK when needed. Blasphemy to some NU fans, but this happens in street ball. Stay on the court if you win.

CCC needs to toughen this team up. Play the right way or don’t play. We can lose with anybody on the court. CCC is to blame for not addressing ( to our knowledge) many of the CORRECTABLE things I mention. However, this is a group fail, and as Tim Anderson so eloquently said yesterday, “Tony makes out the line up card, Tony don’t play any games”.

Great post. Couldn’t agree more on the lack of an “alpha dog.” Or, to your point, even a guy like Sanjay in the past who will commit a hard foul every once in a while.

Team needs to toughen up. Spencer brought that last year. Someone, anyone, just has to start getting pissed off.