Completely comfortable because they saw it as harmless locker room behavior. Like I said, perception is in the eye of the beholder. This is not as black and white an issue as some want to make it out to be particularly when one considers the significant changes in what society considers acceptable norms over the course of Fitz’s tenure. Obviously some players were not OK with it and that is a problem.
Will Mike Hankwitz get deposed
- Thread starter WildcatAbe43
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The Man from Manhattan Back Again
(Those with any affinity for Queen should DEFINITELY give it a spin.)
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A few is 3. Stuff like this allegedly went on back to Walker. These so called “car washes” were said to be multiple offensive linemen for at least a decade. The Shrek gang stuff at Kenosha may have been limited but also was multiple seasons. How do you know more players / staff didn’t feel victimized or disapprove of this behavior or would have liked it to stop but didn’t have the guts or feared reprisals? Gang mentality is not a pretty or easy situation to deal with. Unfortunately this administration and Fitz have abjectly failed either thru inaction or willful blindness to stop the team culture that lead to this. The player councils failed and thereby Fitz failed. Now everyone is reaping the whirlwind, and as a fan and as 20+ year supporter I’m truly disgusted and disappointed in the whole thing. In 2023 hazing is a zero tolerance issue in most compassionate people’s books. The thing is successful football teams don’t need to have to win games.
A few players per year vs. a 105 man roster every year. The vast majority of players were not involved, How do I know more players didn't disapprove? Easy, because at least some would have spoken up about it and certainly so many players would not tout the praises of Fitz and the program for so many years after being gone if they felt something so morally reprehensible had gone on and been condoned during their time at NU. Human beings just don't behave that way.
The question that should be asked is why do you and others believe more players were victimized or dissaproved? It boggles my mind that so many folks on this board who call themselves NU fans can so easily be swayed into believing that the program and the coach we supported for such a long time and which churned out college graduates and upstanding citizens at a rate unparalleled in big time college athletics all of a sudden has this deep dark secret and morally corrupt culture. It's hard to reconcile the contradictions between the factual track record of the program and the the praise from the vast majority of current/former players and the accounts from a very small minority of players who years later are making these claims. Perception is in the eye of the beholder.
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Do you think it’s possible that you’ve put Fitz and his program on a pedestal? Perhaps you’re the one unable to acknowledge the reality
See Bernie Madoff. Looks can be deceiving.
Pat Fitzgerald knew about the hazing because a head coach who has been employed at the same place for nearly twenty years is control of everything football related.
Fitz is gone and the rest of the staff will be gone soon enough. The support amongst the fanbase needs to be towards Dr Schill and Dr Gragg. These are the men tasked with turning our beloved football program around. These are fantastic and brilliant administrators that the Board of Trustees have supreme confidence in.
We need to stop supporting Fitz and crew and start supporting the two men who need it the most. The two men who are giving up everything in terms of their reputations for this university.
At this moment I find it unwise to state that anyone related to the program is a "liar" based on their public comments. Probably like all of us, I have opinions on based on what that person may "gain" from making a public statement in conjunction with their actions or in-actions as we know them at this moment. That said, I will not assign disbelief to any comments made so far. People can you surprise you.
I do find it troubling that Yates and Short have recently added the ice-bath element to the "running" Dunking someone's head under water while performing a sexually insulting act should've caused an earlier reporting of these actions. This activity adds a risk of physical harm in conjunction with the mental damage and I shutter to think people watching wouldn't have stopped it. How could some of the players even think glowingly of this program? I can't fathom that we had that many "twisted" people associated with the team. Additionally, I struggle to believe the hazing was as widespread as the media stories convey, to many of us, without some earlier documented complainants. People have reasons for not reporting, but how did we have that many people that never report anything?
Right now the differences between public statements are diametrically opposed. My sense is the truth will lie somewhere in the middle.
LOL, first of all why the heck are you here? Illinois fans should post on the Illinois board.
I’ve followed the program for more than 40 years and those who know me will tell you I am as skeptical as they come. You need to earn praise from me and FItz has more than earned that praise during his multi year career at NU as a player, assistant and head coach. I’ve seen him and his players up close and my experience reconciles with the track record which shows that no P5 program in the country churns out more and better quality student athletes who graduate and go on to be outstanding accomplished citizens. I particularly know how he and His staff interact/conduct themselves on the recruiting trail and almost without fail HS coaches & recruiting industry veterans will tell you their is no staff more transparent and above board than NU’s. Tom Lemming, who has seen every coaching staff over the last 50 years operate up close, has been quoted on record saying that if he had a son who was a high caliber D1 football recruit, NU and FItz would be one of only a couple of schools that he would consider sending his son to.
Dr Schill, haven’t you better things to do than post here, like polishing up that resume.
Adding to posts that will not get relevant response: let’s say you are, just a handful. What’s the number of players hurt, damaged, etc that you find acceptable? What’s the percentage?
Seems to be as PFs football results diminished, whenever he would make dumb decisions like no two deep, no spring game, when he would snap at reporters - the big defenders would point to the perfect, clean program as the defense. Not just the greatest ambassador for the FB team or athletics, but the whole school as his defense.
And scandal from PSU, OSU, Jim Harbaugh - and these same people would pile on and stare loudly how lucky we are to never have to worry about that problem. Many would say, during down years, that success was far less important that running a clean program.
So what’s your number of acceptable damaged players? Who, ultimately, should be in charge of these young and immature players? Since a perfectly clean program no longer is your justification, can we go back to normal standards like team performance - if so, PF deserved to be fired last year, definitely by end of this season.
If you standard now is simply PFs historical value, JoePa says hi and most of you had very unkind things to say about legacy of a man…
There is another legal term - clean hands. Don’t get embattled if you have blemishes. PF chose his attitude, his coaching staff, everything and dared anyone to challenge him driving the program into irrelevance and back into dark ages. Sadly, he did so with dirty hands, fair he now be judged. And shown the door.
Let’s see - in a meeting w schill, they agreed to a two week suspension. If PF wanted that chance, perhaps he says no. That’s not enough, that’s not fair.
I’m going to take a full season unpaid and in that time, I’m going to institute changes to clean up this program. During that time, I’m going to personally reach out to every former player and try to right any wrongs that happened. This is a bigger deal than two week and a summer Friday pr release. I’m ashamed, embarrassed and humbled but determined to fix this problem and repair the damage to our reputation along the way.
Nope, two week unpaid vacation during the summer probably seemed like over the top to PF.
Please elaborate…. (I love legal analysis from folks without a legal education)
The administration and people like corbi created PF. Perhaps that’s why he is so irrationally defensive. They granted him god status and with it comes blanket immunity.
I said a long time ago that allowing PF to be the most powerful guy on campus would lead to ruining his legacy, even as a player. This is on PF, but equally on his enablers.
No reason to support them. They haven’t asked for it, and they haven’t earned it. Rebuilding will begin when they leave and not any sooner.
“Fantastic and Brilliant Administrators”. I just got even dumbing reading all of your posts. Tell me you are a troll without telling me you are a troll.
Thank goodness you aren’t on the pay board.
So that's your astute legal analysis? That a University President can "pull the plug" on retirement benefits earned by a long-time employee if he doesn't like the way that former employee relates his experiences while employed? Man I would love to go up against you in court some time...
This is all good discourse. I was a major Fitz fan and still conflicted. My wife referred to him as my “boyfriend” for the googley eyes and chat I had with him at an alumni event. This all pains me greatly and I see this with a lot of sympathy and like a divorce. That’s said, I think there was a downward spiral with this hazing and with the last few classes must have gotten out of control. Where there’s smoke, there’s fire and Fitz had to have ignored the signs. One traumatized kid in the program is one too many. Our NU standards are and should be higher.
Confirmed, you have put them on the pedestal. Good luck, I suspect the coming years will be challenging for you. Don’t let the bitterness consume you.
I wonder if that guy is a grandchild of Schill. Not quite smart enough to go to NU but more computer savvy and frequents the message board world regularly. In this instance, defend his aloof grandfather. I wonder if he is the 7th grandchild.
Grandfather? Schill is still in his prime. Dude hooked up with a lot of hot professors in Oregon.
Great. Let’s get the kids at The Daily to investigate. I am sure they would love to take down a boomer University President who used his position of power to sexually assault young female professors.
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