B1G Players in the Portal 2022
- Thread starter CappyNU
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That's fine. Illinois benefitted greatly from Kofi. He deserves the opportunity to go pro.
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Should have stayed. Would make more with NIl than he will playing in China.
Definitely, but he wanted to go pro. He gave up ~$1.5 million to leave. I wish him the best.
Not sure what I've been wrong about, other than thinking Beran and Young could be productive as our frontcourt.
When you say somebody like Coral is always so wrong, you've been on the wrong side of a lot of issues. Coral gets a lot of NU athletic things right, has reliable connections/insight and generously provides content from numerous sources that enhances the enjoyment of this board.
Can't imagine a more "all in" fan of all things NU.
GOUNUII
You can defend Coral if you want to. Thats your choice. I'm sure he posts useful stuff when he has actual information. I'm just talking about his trolling of my posts. There are plenty of homers out there. Some are blind to reality. But you can't really be in favor of keeping Collins and pro-NU at this point. Too much evidence to the contrary.
I tend to present facts and then offer my take on those facts.
Updated rankingThis is the ESPN (behind paywall) top #100 transfers as of 04/15.
RY is #67, will probably drop another 10 spots or so as more heavyweights enter the portal.
Ranking men's college basketball's top transfers: Where has everyone landed?
As the new season approaches, the top men's college basketball transfers have committed to their new programs. Who has finally landed where?www.espn.com
Ranking men's college basketball's top transfers: Where has everyone landed?
As the new season approaches, the top men's college basketball transfers have committed to their new programs. Who has finally landed where?
RY now 2 spots ahead of Joe Bam.......Updated ranking
Ranking men's college basketball's top transfers: Where has everyone landed?
As the new season approaches, the top men's college basketball transfers have committed to their new programs. Who has finally landed where?
Give me a break. Hardly anyone on the board is a Collins supporter. You just take it to another level entirely (and repeatedly). I don't think you have ever thought a single decision Collins made was correct, although I do ignore you for long stretches so maybe I missed one. You actually said you didn't think Collins deserved credit for the tournament year and that we were unprepared in the first half against NCAA finalist Gonzaga! We had one fringe NBA player on the roster and they had 4 or 5 NBA players on the roster.
And in presenting the "facts", you manage to frequently slip in your takes that are just flat out wrong. When confronted, you retreat to trying to be reasonable again without ever acknowledging that you were wrong.
You love big men. You want Collins to play as many big men as he can. We get it. The past 2 NCAA champions didn't even have a player on the roster on ESPN identified as a center. North Carolina had one guy that was 6'10 and he played about 20 minutes a game. The rest of the team were wings and guards. Baylor's leading rebounder their championship year was a guard. Nance got lots of open 3's because the other team's big man was guarding him. Nance was not great at coming off screens or at posting up smaller players so I am not sure how he would have done playing the 4 all year. He definitely benefitted offensively from playing center.
We were in almost all of the games this past year in the last 10 minutes, which suggests that are schemes were ok. What the team clearly lacked were guys that could get to the basket and finish or get fouled. Young was the only guy with that ability but, as you acknowledged, he's not a go-to guy. When we tried to go to him in the last 10 minutes against Wisconsin, he struggled to finish and make his free throws. Teams that won close games in the tournament had players that could take over at the end of games. There weren't a bunch of clever plays being called. It was here's the ball, get to the basket. We need at least a couple of those guys. I thought Audige could be one but clearly I was wrong. I am hopeful Roper can fill that role
For people who aren't paying for ESPN+, Ryan Young is now rated 76th.
There are plenty of good players in the portal and the ratings are really subjective.
A reasonable person would ask "If he's so good, why didn't he play more?"
That is probably lowering his rating somewhat.
There are plenty of good players in the portal and the ratings are really subjective.
A reasonable person would ask "If he's so good, why didn't he play more?"
That is probably lowering his rating somewhat.
At the start of this recent season, the board was about 50% Collins supporters.
I was not one of them, based partly on my analysis of his usage of the roster the previous season.
Most of what I was pointing out was proven true, or at the very least supported by what happened this season. Many people turned negative on Collins during the season, because this was supposed to be the year we regained respectability. I don't think it was a talent deficit.
You can't declare that Nance "benefitted offensively by playing center" because he didn't play the 4 often enough to make a comparison. I know he got smoked defensively by any Big Ten center with talent and size. In the end, the team failed with Collins playing Nance at the 5. Thats all that matters. He refused to seriously try alternatives. And there were several good alternatives.
If you want to go back to the tournament team and say my opinion was "wrong" thats fine - you can do whatever you want - but we were pretty obviously unprepared for that game. Maybe we were nervous. We played terribly in the first half. That is a fact. I don't recall exactly what I said about how much credit Collins deserved, but it is undeniable that team chemistry played a big role in our success that season.
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Basketball is a game of momentum swings. Was Mark Few unprepared for NU in the 2nd half? Gonzaga was much more talented than NU. That might have had something to do with it. That team lost to North Carolina in the finals by 6 points. Do you understand how silly your argument is? Even there, you can't give Collins any credit. It destroys any credibility you think you might have.
And most of what you were pointing out was not "proven true". You hypothesize that the team would have won a lot more games if we had played Young 7 more minutes and Nicholson 10 minutes a game. How was that proven true? It's still just a hypothesis.
There is a talent deficit. Other than Young, there was not a single player on the team capable of consistently finishing at the rim or drawing a foul (and Young was not nearly as effective against teams with good big men). Nance is a fine complimentary player but he was not a go-to guy and was not effective around the basket. I thought Audige could be that guy and he shot 33% from the field and 25% from 3. Buie is a mediocre finisher and didn't shoot well from 3 last year. Simmons and Roper were raw. Beran and Berry are terrible finishers and Williams was ok. We missed a bunch of layups last year, had almost no transition game and, most importantly, had nobody to go to at the end of games. That was our downfall. Collins is responsible for recruiting and development. The end result is on him. And at least on this board, most people were negative on Collins at the start of the season. Read the posts after we lost to Providence.
The talent deficit, as you claim, is dependent on what teams you are comparing us to.
Final 4 teams? Yeah, there's a significant talent deficit.
Big Ten championship contender? Yeah we aren't as talented as Purdue or Illinois.
Big Ten "average"? I'd say our talent was average for the Big Ten.
Power 5 conferences? I'd say we are about average in talent.
Division 1? We have much better talent than the average D1 school.
I am 100% okay with NU having average talent in the Big Ten.
Again, to go back to the NCAA game against Gonzaga, since you seem to be focused on that... Mark Few had his team very well-prepared to play us. They came out and attacked us, as if they knew our weaknesses. We, on the other hand, seemed to come out scared, nervous, something like that. We played a terrible first half and trailed 38-20 at the break. It was embarrassing. Presumably, as often happens in college, Gonzaga players thought the game was over and came out dead flat for the 2nd half. NU regrouped at halftime, got fired up and came out playing hard in the 2nd half. Was that Collins or the players themselves? I think it was mainly the players because that team had great chemistry. Maybe it was Collins. Subsequent years and the momentum-killing technical foul suggest that it was not primarily Collins who rallied that team that day.
So Collins gets the blame for the first half and Mark Few gets the credit. In the 2nd half, the Gonzaga players get the blame and our players get the credit. Got it. Makes perfect sense. We made no adjustments at half time.
As for the talent deficit, who were our go to players? I can run through the rosters of every good team in the conference and point to players that were capable of taking over the end of games. Penn State, Michigan, Wisconsin and Maryland hit big shots (several of which were really difficult) in the last 5 minutes of those games. We did not. That's why they won. Nobody on our roster was able to step up with any consistency. Again, Collins recruited and developed these players, so it's his responsibility. But there was definitely a finisher deficit.
Ignore button continues to be blissful. That being said, and knowing my steadfast positions are in the minority on this board, I really admire how @clarificationcat has taken this on (until he inevitably hits ignore too).
Collins isn't exactly known for making brilliant in-game adjustments. I don't recall if we changed anything at halftime in the Gonzaga game. I do know we came out playing with pride in the 2nd half.
Whether we have finishers or not is debatable. That can reflect the players natural personalities or it could reflect the way the coach treats them when they succeed or fail.
I don't think of Audige, Nance, Buie and Young as lacking confidence. On the other hand, guys like Greer or Beran don't want the ball in crunch time.
Audige, who was prone to taking and missing big shots, played in crunch time nearly every game. So did Beran, who tended to disappear. Young, who performed well under pressure against MSU, was routinely benched for the last 5 minutes of close games.
Nance, our best player, did not thrive late in most games, but that could have been a different story if he had Young alongside him.
I am quite pleased that you are not responding to my comments anymore.
Thank you.
You may recall that my line was crossed when you called Collins an idiot and other insults. That’s an inexcusable mistake. If you want to apologize for that, I’ll be happy to unignore you. But if you don’t want to do that, or just don’t want to have someone else challenge you with analysis, then feel free to stay as is.
Of course you don't recall if we changed anything at halftime. First of all, I am not sure if you would necessarily notice subtle changes (not saying I would either) and second of all it doesn't fit your unending narrative that Collins never, ever does anything right. You honestly don't think it's kind of funny that you assign credit and blame to the coaches for the first half (when we played poorly) and to the players for the second half (when we played well)?
I didn't say our players lacked confidence. I said that they couldn't finish games on a consistent basis. Buie has confidence. He just didn't hit nearly enough shots and is not big or strong enough to finish consistently at the hoop. When he did hit shots down the stretch, we won games. Audige was a terrible shooter last year and Nance doesn't have the ability to consistently create his own shot or draw fouls. We ran plays to get Nance the ball at the end of games and he was just o.k. at best in most of those games. He actually hit a couple of shots in the last couple of minutes of the first Penn State loss but they hit a bunch of crazy 3's down the stretch to win that game.
Audige was our best defender by far so kind of tough to take him out at the end of games.
And we did go to Young a fair amount at the end of games. As I mentioned, we went to him repeatedly in the Wisconsin loss and he had a tough stretch where he couldn't hit free throws. I believe you said after that game that Young should not be "the guy". Not his role. He played down the stretch in the first Michigan State game and in the Michigan game (where missed free throws from Nance cost us that game). He struggled against Purdue and Illinois (he shot 8 for 25 in those 4 games) so I don't think he would changed the outcome if he played more. He should have played more against Penn State in the 2nd loss and against Maryland in the loss (although our offense was fine against Maryland). I am not sure why Nance would have had more confidence if Young was on the floor. They were on the floor together at the end of several losses. I was fine with Young playing 5 minutes more a game, especially if Beran was struggling. But I don't think it would have changed our season in any meaningful way. 4 or 5 games were there for the taking in the last couple of minutes and we didn't hit enough shots and the other teams did. Like I said, ultimately it falls on Collins to recruit and develop a couple of go-to players.
This is my last post. I need to take a break. You have worn me down. You win (again).
If only about 50 guys get drafted and those include one and done and foreignors, then the top 100 among transfers should be in play. Maybe not top ten or even 25, but the rest should value a host of things that NU brings to the table. Except a decent coach and department committed to excellence.
oh well, never mind, NU isn’t in play for the top 500…
What a quiet, empty and confusing place the bball board must be for this guy.
Um…how does he see this post. Must have learned how to fake ignore from coral.
Oh come on. I call myself an idiot too. Not all the time, of course, but when I do something really dumb, I am aware of it and acknowledge my own ignorance, flaws, weaknesses, whatever.
Why should I not be allowed to criticize a highly paid basketball coach when he screws up? For example, I'm sure you have called either Trump or Biden a moron at some point. Is Chris Collins somehow off limits? I'm not saying he is a bad person - just that he isn't a good basketball coach at this level. And I point out my basis for saying that.
Its not like I'm walking up to Chris Collins and berating him - its a message board, and a free one at that.
I don't criticize the student athletes nearly as harshly - I find that to be really weak - and some folks on this board do it regularly, including some of your apparent buddies.
Okay. I'm sorry you feel that way.
For me, it isn't about winning or losing a discussion.
Dude, you don’t get it. You criticize ALL the time. Twisting everything that goes wrong into a CCC diatribe. You are relentless. There is a reason posters go after you when others say the same thing. It’s like being a democrat and watching Fox News or a Republican and watching CNN. It is completely one sided.
As far as criticism of “student” athletes. this is 2022. Call a spade a spade, just be fair about it. This is not HS. These guys are paid. Not everything that goes sideways is a Coaches fault! I would respect it more if you actually said it to CCC’s face. Somehow I don’t think you would do that. So CCC last 10 months in the job will be a field day for you and misery for us.
He is the flip side to coral - why don’t you scold coral too then?
Field day? This is the disconnect. Apathetic ‘fans’ don’t waste their time complaining. Diehard fans are emotionally invested and become emotionally charged. Koolaid krew aren’t really sports fans. They are school fans, program fans but not true sports fans. Sports fans want their team to win, make an effort, demonstrate some similar commitment that the fan has put forth for well more than 4-5 years or some tenure of a coach. And when they don’t see it and the team is unsuccessful, they vent. Because they care.
I’m an NU sports fan, not a program fan.
Feel free to keep calling your subject names on message boards and rationalizing that it is just fine and merits that we should respect your positions. And it makes no sense that you and ignore2 rely on money earned as the barometer of how you choose to make observations and comments. It’s an inherent bias in determining where the problem lies.
Where we are as NU basketball is way bigger than any coach. We’ve never had a perfect coach and never will. (And we’ve only had one take us to the Dance). The coach is just not the main problem, even though so many choose to make him out to be. Other changes are much more important if we want different outcomes. PPD has expressed those well.
Well, you got a ways to go but I believe in you.
If you don't think I'm unhappy with what is going on with NU basketball, you are really not reading what I write.
I don't criticize all the time. Not even close. I write positive stuff about our players and the university regularly.
Its the coach I criticize more than not, because he is doing a bad job with his players. If he were doing a good job, I would praise him.
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