OT: Briles Sacked
- Thread starter NJCat
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Briles turnaround at Baylor is right up there with those of Barnett and Snyder, but this is an amazing embarrassment for the Baptist school.
Will likely depend on how the reports from the investigation. "Rampant sexual abuses and cover up" would be a pretty difficult label to shake.
If Charlie Strong is like 4-8, do you really think Texas would care about Briles's past? I sincerely hope that they would, but nah, I don't think so.
Yes.
Plus Briles is a bit of an "interesting" personality. Fitting into Texas' "good ol' boy" network is a big part of the job description in Austin and I'm not sure he's the guy.
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except for the fact that Barnett didn't recruit a bunch of criminals nor tolerate such behavior (until he left NU)
This just reminds me that Penn State football should have gotten the death penalty.
except for the fact that Barnett didn't recruit a bunch of criminals nor tolerate such behavior (until he left NU)
Obviously I'm talking about the magnitude of the turnaround he and Snyder pulled off at NU and KSU. Barnett never did anything wrong except stick his foot in his mouth once.
Link to Yahoo article
Given the state of the fans and teams of the NCAA, Briles will be coaching again within two years and a Power Five head coach again within four.
Given the state of the fans and teams of the NCAA, Briles will be coaching again within two years and a Power Five head coach again within four.
Agreed. But given the precedent set in the PSU travesty, they won't.
Both cases involve deliberate actions by program leaders to conceal felonious acts that are very damaging to young lives and shield the university and its employees from legal accountability. Yet the NCAA just waves its hand.
One could argue that players receiving money or cars, like SMU, were victimless crimes.
Just appalling failure. Worse than Roger Goodell.
Should the NCAA get the death penalty? End big-time large-money college sports and let the free market create minor leagues to fill in the gap?
Glades:
On the magnitude of the turnaround scale, I would give Barnett 110 points on a 100 point scale, Snyder would get 85 points and Briles would get 65. Both of the latter coaches had advantages Barnett couldn't tap into. Snyder did a lot with Jucos and Briles had the gusher of all oil wells in recruiting the Lone Star state. Both of those coaches did a great job, especially Snyder. But IMHO, nothing compares to what Barnett did. His accomplishment is just in a whole different universe. Going from the worst team in the BIG by a very wide margin to 15-1 in conference in his 3rd and 4th seasons. Snyder didn't accomplish that until his 9th and 10th seasons at KSU. Beating loaded teams at Michigan and Notre Dame and PSU. Doing it without gimmicks. Just physical, hard nosed football in a physical, hard nosed league. Filling Ryan field to capacity with 90-95% of the fans wearing purple.
GOUNUII
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Just conjecture on my part, but it's sad to think that as Briles packs up his office, he won't be thinking about his wrongdoing, or reflecting on his lack of integrity, or the need to win honorably, or that there are more important things than football...he'll just curse those who "betrayed" him and who "didn't mind when we were winning."
But seriously, what's the lesson here? Does denial pay off? Did Baylor do all it could do once it realized the president, AD, and coach could not be trusted to mind the store? And if so, what should the punishment be for the program?
I can truly and honestly say that I'd rather have 50 losing seasons in a row than a Big Ten or National title won on the backs of criminals, rapists, and/or coaches who help them cover up their crimes. For whatever agony we face as Northwestern fans, it's nice to know we're as far out of the danger zone on this kind of behavior as a P5 program can reasonably be.
But seriously, what's the lesson here? Does denial pay off? Did Baylor do all it could do once it realized the president, AD, and coach could not be trusted to mind the store? And if so, what should the punishment be for the program?
I can truly and honestly say that I'd rather have 50 losing seasons in a row than a Big Ten or National title won on the backs of criminals, rapists, and/or coaches who help them cover up their crimes. For whatever agony we face as Northwestern fans, it's nice to know we're as far out of the danger zone on this kind of behavior as a P5 program can reasonably be.
I think yes. It has gotten to the point that I am sick of it. Not much fun any more. Too much $$ and the great majority goes to the fat and happy old white guys.
I agree with the 50 losing seasons, I wouldn't be so cavalier about Northwestern being out of the danger zone. Sexual assault on college campuses is rampant nationwide and any program is just one drunken, despicable choice away from ignominy. Can we avoid recruiting players with questionable backgrounds? Yes. Can we clearly set expectations and explicitly spell out what types of behaviors are acceptable and which aren't? Yes. But don't kid yourself...NU sports is hardly immune.
How long did this action take? Remember Baylor Basketball about 10 or so years ago had a player shoot and kill another over drugs or something. The then BB coach and an assistant then tried to help the killer hide the evidence and pressure other players to lie about the facts. They were finally investigated and fired but don't remember if they were criminally charged. Baylor is a cesspool of corruption involving their sports teams, so I'm not surrised about this. Maybe I'll later add about a chance meeting I and some other board folks had two so-called big time Baylor boosters when Baylor last played at W-R. It's a doozy.
I think the difference is that while it is entirely possible that a Northwestern player may, in the future, commit a sexual assault, the university wouldn't conspire with the athletic department and EPD to cover it up and/or intimidate the victim.
Careful with the facts. Dave Bliss did not help cover up the murder or hide evidence or indeed do anything related to the murder. He lied to cover up NCAA violations that were incidentally uncovered during the murder investigation. Despicable guy to be sure, and deservedly fired, and probably should have been prosecuted for obstructing investigators, but he was in no way involved with the killing.
Briles daughter writes -
http://sportsday.dallasnews.com/col...ter-blasts-disgusting-baylor-witch-hunt-media
Very emotional day and of course, what else do you expect a daughter to write? On the other hand, why is the head of Campus Police or the Police Chief of Waco not fired? I think this goes back to an issue that is becoming more and more of a problem and that is universities investigating their own crimes on their own campuses. Unless it is truly college mischief like a knock-on-the-door-and-run kinda thing, Anyone who has kids on any campus should want crimes that allegedly take place (yes, allegedly, not every claim is founded) to be investigated by outside professionals not insider "Keystone Cops" or even worse - academics with biased agenda's.
It does seem that Baylor was recruiting some really bad characters, but who knew what and when and who did what, I can't follow all the twists and turns. I dunno if Briles was a guilty bastard or an unlucky hands off manager who was deemed to "have to take the fall". I just don't know.
What now?
They should hire Mike Singletary. Baylor Alumn. Baylor Hall of Fame, College Football Hall of Fame. He might not be a good coach (or maybe he needed a second chance like Pete Carroll and Bill Belicheck) but he is an ordained Minister and winner of tons of "Father of the Year" types of awards. He would salvage that school's reputation methinks in the wake of all this. I can't believe they kept an insider onboard. It's not like the season starts next week.
http://sportsday.dallasnews.com/col...ter-blasts-disgusting-baylor-witch-hunt-media
Very emotional day and of course, what else do you expect a daughter to write? On the other hand, why is the head of Campus Police or the Police Chief of Waco not fired? I think this goes back to an issue that is becoming more and more of a problem and that is universities investigating their own crimes on their own campuses. Unless it is truly college mischief like a knock-on-the-door-and-run kinda thing, Anyone who has kids on any campus should want crimes that allegedly take place (yes, allegedly, not every claim is founded) to be investigated by outside professionals not insider "Keystone Cops" or even worse - academics with biased agenda's.
It does seem that Baylor was recruiting some really bad characters, but who knew what and when and who did what, I can't follow all the twists and turns. I dunno if Briles was a guilty bastard or an unlucky hands off manager who was deemed to "have to take the fall". I just don't know.
What now?
They should hire Mike Singletary. Baylor Alumn. Baylor Hall of Fame, College Football Hall of Fame. He might not be a good coach (or maybe he needed a second chance like Pete Carroll and Bill Belicheck) but he is an ordained Minister and winner of tons of "Father of the Year" types of awards. He would salvage that school's reputation methinks in the wake of all this. I can't believe they kept an insider onboard. It's not like the season starts next week.
Bingo. Having a bunch of rent-a-cops investigate serious crimes like rape is just plain wrong. Talk about a conflict of interest. You are right, this needs to change.
"The choices made by football staff and athletics leadership, in some instances, posed a risk to campus safety and the integrity of the University. In certain instances, including reports of a sexual assault by multiple football players, athletics and football personnel affirmatively chose not to report sexual violence and dating violence to an appropriate administrator outside of athletics. In those instances, football coaches or staff met directly with a complainant and/or a parent of a complainant and did not report the misconduct."
"In addition, some football coaches and staff took improper steps in response to disclosures of sexual assault or dating violence that precluded the University from fulfilling its legal obligations. Football staff conducted their own untrained internal inquiries, outside of policy, which improperly discredited complainants and denied them the right to a fair, impartial and informed investigation, interim measures or processes promised under University policy. In some cases, internal steps gave the illusion of responsiveness to complainants but failed to provide a meaningful institutional response under Title IX."
"Actions by University administrators directly discouraged some complainants from reporting or participating in student conduct processes and in one instance constituted retaliation against a complainant for reporting sexual assault."
These are direct quotes from an independent investigation done by one of the better law firms in the country.
As I said after the Penn State scandal, everyone's best option right now is to shut their mouth. Especially Briles' daughter. Pathetic.
"In addition, some football coaches and staff took improper steps in response to disclosures of sexual assault or dating violence that precluded the University from fulfilling its legal obligations. Football staff conducted their own untrained internal inquiries, outside of policy, which improperly discredited complainants and denied them the right to a fair, impartial and informed investigation, interim measures or processes promised under University policy. In some cases, internal steps gave the illusion of responsiveness to complainants but failed to provide a meaningful institutional response under Title IX."
"Actions by University administrators directly discouraged some complainants from reporting or participating in student conduct processes and in one instance constituted retaliation against a complainant for reporting sexual assault."
These are direct quotes from an independent investigation done by one of the better law firms in the country.
As I said after the Penn State scandal, everyone's best option right now is to shut their mouth. Especially Briles' daughter. Pathetic.
Don't get me wrong, I'm under not false impression that NU is immune from a player (or players) tarnishing the program, but I believe Fitz will leave a top recruit behind if he thinks the kid is trouble. For whatever my criticisms are of Fitz and the coaching staff, I appreciate the premium value they place on character, which I sincerely do believe will always keep NU as far away from the negative headlines as a program can be.
If Briles deserved firing so do most of these coaches, no?
http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...sted-college-football-teams-in-america-081815
http://www.foxsports.com/college-fo...sted-college-football-teams-in-america-081815
Are you missing the part where Briles and co. actively messed with investigations, intimidated victims, and covered up possible crimes? If Baylor had a few players arrested and convicted of sexual assault, Briles would be fine. They covered it up, which is why he is now gone.
Absolutely! I truly believe that NU is one of the only truly clean programs in the country.
Interesting article but given that Baylor looked pretty good on that list, it really shows how an extreme lack of ethics in a program can make the program look good on paper.
In the newspaper articles I have seen it does not show he knew.
If he knew, he should be fired and perhaps imprisoned.
Do you realize just how bad KSU was? KSU had a lower winning percentage than NU had. They were the absolute pits of college football, below NU. At least Barnett had a world class degree, a beautiful campus on a lake, and Chicago as enticements. Snyder did this with absolutely nothing to offer recruits compared to Barnett (Manhattan, KS! please!), and with facilities worse than NU, if you can imagine that. With nothing but dust to offer, I don't care if it took a while for his program to reach national championship challenging success. I agree that what Barnett did was incredible and I'd give him the nod, but Snyder is right up there with Barnett because he sustained his success better than Gary did.
Baylor also sucked eggs since the dawn of time. He raised Baylor higher than Barnett ever did and sustained it. Still, he's below both Barnett and Snyder, IMO, and it looks like he recruited a whole bunch of sketchy characters.
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The fact that anything was done within 3 years constitutes swift for these minor league franchises that call themselves universities.
I mean like Notre Dame, Floeida State, Oklahoma State, Tennessee, etc. where there are enough complaints and circumstances of similar nature to Baylor to warrant an unbiased investigation by independent outside agencies where the integrity of the investigation is not compromised by interests in the program being investigated.
At least the Baylor University Regents did the right thing and got rid of a highly successful coach and wouldn't put up with this mess. This is before any pressure from the NCAA.
If Klemman is lurking, this is what you're supposed to do when felonies occur instead of trying to sweep them under the rug.
What do you mean? They minded by booting him. And they WERE WINNING STILL. At the peak of winning. So with that, I give credit to Baylor University for taking action that would be unheard of at the likes of the SEC schools or dOSU.
The lesson here is that bad things can happen, but you can still make a choice not to look the other way and take action that demonstrates intolerance. The University acted correctly here. Sadly, many schools do not act correctly and come from the Bowden school of thought. Including the entire cesspool that is the SEC and even the B1G's own like dOSU.
Never said he did but just pointing out that Baylor has done despicable things before. Still if Pen St didn't receive the "death penalty" then Baylor won't and no other program will either. Maybe if it's proven that they have hatched a terrorist attack, maybe the stuffed shirts would do so but probably not due to the money involved.
