OT: NL will use DH for EVER :(

[IGNORE2]

The Sox window should open next year. Nobody expected anything this year before Covid hit. The playoff experience was a bonus.

LuBob will become a beast. Moncada will get his energy back. Madrigal won’t be a rookie. Tons of good experience. Main loss is the rookie pitcher (too late in night to spell). But lots of good experience. Add dunning and cease - kopech.

With a small, controlled payroll - should be able to buy a couple decent FA arms. Engel might be RF solution. The team is ready next year - please no injuries!

Hey, anyone seen @willycat ? His big racist mouth has been active on the rant but disappeared like the Cubs offense over here. Oh willy, come out and take your medicine.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

The soft schedule might of helped both sides of town. Cubs, Sox, cardinals, Twins, Indians, Reds, Brewers ! How did they do in the playoffs? 0-7 with 5 sweeps.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

The Sox are absolutely a win now team. Any team in the playoffs with a core of young players like they have should be focused on winning as soon as possible before contracts and/or injuries take their toll. The Cubs are a cautionary tale. Win when you have a chance and don’t assume you’ll have more chances because windows close much faster than you expect. Besides, Reinsdorf is in his late 80s and a huge baseball fan. I am sure he’d like win another World Series before he kicks the bucket.

Hahn has done a great job with contracts. Moncada, Robert, Eloy, Anderson all controlled thru at least 2024 at below market prices. Giolito in ARB years, Madrigal, Cease, Kopech at rookie minimum. There is money to spend. There are pitchers in the system that will contribute when the time comes. Injuries could always happen, but there are at least 3 more seasons where the entire core is together. The glaring hole on this team is at the Manager position.

 

[hoosboot]

Where do the Sox get the frontline pitching they need to pair with Giolito to compete in the playoffs if not in a trade like this?

By developing it from the young, talented group of arms they have and supplementing it with smart veteran free agent signings like Keuchel.

The Dodgers still have run in them

Still have run in them? I hope that is code for "The Dodgers will be good for a very long time." They should be what the White Sox are trying to model themselves after (the development side, not the massive payroll side). They were able to go get Mookie Betts because they had a stockpile of young and talented players to build around AND deal from. Their entire rotation was drafted and developed by the Dodgers, so the cost control is unbelievable. The White Sox aren't going to be able to make deals to trade for the best player in the American League, but they should be able to develop a pitching staff in the way the Dodgers have.

 

[NUera]

Here to flame. Poor Cubbies! Go Fish!!

It’s been a long time since I even remotely cared about baseball. Couldn’t be happier for Mattingly and the boys - and thrilled to see the Fish continue their postseason domination of the Cubs. Also, for a few more days, let’s all enjoy the fact that the franchise has never lost a postseason series.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

By developing it from the young, talented group of arms they have and supplementing it with smart veteran free agent signings like Keuchel.



Still have run in them? I hope that is code for "The Dodgers will be good for a very long time." They should be what the White Sox are trying to model themselves after (the development side, not the massive payroll side). They were able to go get Mookie Betts because they had a stockpile of young and talented players to build around AND deal from. Their entire rotation was drafted and developed by the Dodgers, so the cost control is unbelievable. The White Sox aren't going to be able to make deals to trade for the best player in the American League, but they should be able to develop a pitching staff in the way the Dodgers have.

I meant the Dodgers are a finished product. They are at their peak, the system doesn’t have a bunch of stars left to supplement the roster. They are already on the team.

The Braves and Padres are the teams that I would compare to the White Sox. A year or two ahead of them in the development cycle. They will be good for awhile.

 

[hoosboot]

I meant the Dodgers are a finished product. They are at their peak, the system doesn’t have a bunch of stars left to supplement the roster. They are already on the team.

The Braves and Padres are the teams that I would compare to the White Sox. A year or two ahead of them in the development cycle. They will be good for awhile.

While the Dodgers have the most talent in baseball, I think it's wrong to say that the system doesn't have many stars left. Rather, I'd say that their window is wide open and remaining so for a really long time. While I don't think anyone can compare with San Diego's prospect depth (I think they have something like 18 guys in the Top 250 overall), the Dodgers prospect depth (13 in the top 250) is much better than either the Braves (7) or White Sox (6). Gavin Lux hardly played at all this year and is a huge part of the future of that team. Keibert Ruiz is a future all-star at catcher (although likely for another team with Will Smith in front of him) Josiah Gray is a future strong rotation piece who is close, and Diego Cartaya is another top 100 prospect that they love. And Kody Hoese, Edwin Rios and Michael Busch are all bats they are really high on for the future. The Dodgers talent is mostly pretty young at the major league level (three of their SP are in their first year of starting), but they have another wave of great prospects lined up behind them as well. That gives them flexibility as guys like Corey Seager, Max Muncy, and Cody Bellinger emerge from their team control years and guys like Joc Pedersen and Kiki Hernandez move on.

That said, I love the future for the Sox. Corbi is right that they need to generate more SP depth, but that's where they've been drafting.

 

[IGNORE2]

It’s been a long time since I even remotely cared about baseball. Couldn’t be happier for Mattingly and the boys - and thrilled to see the Fish continue their postseason domination of the Cubs. Also, for a few more days, let’s all enjoy the fact that the franchise has never lost a postseason series.

Where’s @willycat ? Poor ole guy just can’t face the music when he has been such an obnoxiously wrong arse. Lol. Keep hiding willy - come back when the Flubs become relevant again - in a 100 years

 

[IGNORE2]

Hey @chicagocatfan24 - are you hearing TJS for Crochet? Does this plummet is value?

 

[chicagocatfan24]

Got caught up on this. The Sox are 100% a win now team and as Corbi said, it started this year.

They're not trading Vaughn though - they are as high on him as any one of their core guys. I am of the opinion he will be the very best hitter in their lineup as soon as next year. His power/patience/hit tool combo is freaky good. Tracy Smith (ASU head coach) told me he's the best pure hitter he's seen in a long time. The Sox could have used him to acquire a few different pieces at this year's deadline and opted not to, mike clevenger being one of them. Sox said hell no to that.

Not sure on Crochet yet. I assume since we haven't heard that that's a good sign. Fingers crossed.

Sox young core is very good and they're going to be a great team for a long time. The only thing that scares me is their unwillingness to spend at the top of the market like the Cubs did for Yu, Lester, etc. There's no reason for them not to, but Reinsdorf gonna Reisndorf I have a feeling, and that's a goddamn shame. This core is incredible

It should have had Tatis Jr. too, Jesus Christ

 

[Hungry Jack]

Got caught up on this. The Sox are 100% a win now team and as Corbi said, it started this year.

They're not trading Vaughn though - they are as high on him as any one of their core guys. I am of the opinion he will be the very best hitter in their lineup as soon as next year. His power/patience/hit tool combo is freaky good. Tracy Smith (ASU head coach) told me he's the best pure hitter he's seen in a long time. The Sox could have used him to acquire a few different pieces at this year's deadline and opted not to, mike clevenger being one of them. Sox said hell no to that.

Not sure on Crochet yet. I assume since we haven't heard that that's a good sign. Fingers crossed.

Sox young core is very good and they're going to be a great team for a long time. The only thing that scares me is their unwillingness to spend at the top of the market like the Cubs did for Yu, Lester, etc. There's no reason for them not to, but Reinsdorf gonna Reisndorf I have a feeling, and that's a goddamn shame. This core is incredible

It should have had Tatis Jr. too, Jesus Christ

Point is they should not mortgage the future to bring in Darvish. He’s good. He is also 34 with a history of arm trouble.

 

[hoosboot]

Point is they should not mortgage the future to bring in Darvish. He’s good. He is also 34 with a history of arm trouble.

Yup. Unless the pitcher is the perfect guy (and Darvish isn't), trading for a pitcher isn't the way to go. Pursuing aces on the right side of 30 is. Trevor Bauer would be a fantastic addition if he and Giolito are cool (both are SoCal guys who go way back) and Bauer can be a prickly personality (hopefully he's grown up some.) Unfortunately, I don't see them signing Bauer.

 

[Hungry Jack]

Yup. Unless the pitcher is the perfect guy (and Darvish isn't), trading for a pitcher isn't the way to go. Pursuing aces on the right side of 30 is. Trevor Bauer would be a fantastic addition if he and Giolito are cool (both are SoCal guys who go way back) and Bauer can be a prickly personality (hopefully he's grown up some.) Unfortunately, I don't see them signing Bauer.

I think COVID will also blow up budgets in 2021. Very bad luck for guys entering FA. I think we will see a lot of short deals this offseason.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

I think COVID will also blow up budgets in 2021. Very bad luck for guys entering FA. I think we will see a lot of short deals this offseason.

I think that's a shit excuse and hope the Dodgers extending Mookie for what they did makes it so other teams don't use the pandemic as an excuse

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Yup. Unless the pitcher is the perfect guy (and Darvish isn't), trading for a pitcher isn't the way to go. Pursuing aces on the right side of 30 is. Trevor Bauer would be a fantastic addition if he and Giolito are cool (both are SoCal guys who go way back) and Bauer can be a prickly personality (hopefully he's grown up some.) Unfortunately, I don't see them signing Bauer.

Bauer and Anderson would square off with 30 days. The free agent SP class is not great this year. Maybe you take a flyer on a one year deal switch Rob Ray or even James Paxson ( who seems to be hurt a lot). You go all in with the 2022 FA class by paying what it takes to get Syndergaard or Mad Max if he still looks good. If you have to spend money this year, George Springer would fit the need big time. Of course, he’ll cost plenty. Adding Vaughn and Springer to the line up and you and me could be the 5th starter.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

Bauer and Anderson would square off with 30 days. The free agent SP class is not great this year. Maybe you take a flyer on a one year deal switch Rob Ray or even James Paxson ( who seems to be hurt a lot). You go all in with the 2022 FA class by paying what it takes to get Syndergaard or Mad Max if he still looks good. If you have to spend money this year, George Springer would fit the need big time. Of course, he’ll cost plenty. Adding Vaughn and Springer to the line up and you and me could be the 5th starter.

Bauer and Anderson would be fine I think but I understand where people would think they wouldn't be

 

[IGNORE2]

Man, @willycat is really hiding these days - c'mon willy, come take your Flubbie medicine!

 

[willycat]

Man, @willycat is really hiding these days - c'mon willy, come take your Flubbie medicine!

Just maybe because it's a FOOTBALL BOARD!

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Just maybe because it's a FOOTBALL BOARD!

He sure popped in quickly with his usual nonsense when the Sox were eliminated.

BTW- Willy turns the FOOTBALL BOARD into the Rant Board lite more than anyone around these parts.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

He sure popped in quickly with his usual nonsense when the Sox were eliminated.

BTW- Willy turns the FOOTBALL BOARD into the Rant Board lite more than anyone around these parts.

Honestly can't tell if he's just one big message board schtick or actually lacks any and all self awareness

 

[willycat]

He sure popped in quickly with his usual nonsense when the Sox were eliminated.

BTW- Willy turns the FOOTBALL BOARD into the Rant Board lite more than anyone around these parts.

Sox LOSE! And no-one goes to there games!!!

 

[chicagocatfan24]

Highest ratings increase in tv ratings in baseball by a huge amount

MLB Sees Local TV And Streaming Viewership Up Over 4% For 2020

MLB saw viewership on regional sports networks increase in 2020. But as with so much else this year, everything is upside-down relative to 2019.

www.google.com

 

[Alvious]

Madrigal won’t be a rookie.

I believe technically he still will be.

He needs to show improvement defensively and get his head out of his ass on the basepaths.

 

[IGNORE2]

Sox LOSE! And no-one goes to there games!!!

Flubs lose. No the lowly Marlins. Hey, where are they WATCHING the World Series willy?

 

[IGNORE2]

Just maybe because it's a FOOTBALL BOARD!

there he is. Funny, his message was different before. Something about cubs and World Series... hmmm... what was it again willy? Remind us who’s playing in the World Series this year?

Btw, Sox matched cubs in attendance this year, beat them in wins, tied them head on and did it on a fraction of the payroll.

How about a wager on 2021? Number of total regular season wins. Loser stops posting for a year? Or winner renames losers handle? C’mon willy - be brave old man, just for once.

 

[Hungry Jack]

The current Cubs should probably be dismantled with an eye toward accumulating prospects. They are probably stuck with Heyward and Darvish and Kimbrel. Hendricks could fetch a very good haul (one of my favorite MLB pitchers) in a crappy FA market for pitching, but I think they hold onto him. They need to trade Bryant and perhaps Baez or Contreras. Those are the guys with any real value.

A core of Rizzo, Hendricks, Darvish (if healthy), Heyward, Schwobber, and (say) Contreras could probably compete in the mediocre NL Central, but the Cubs window has closed on this group, IMO.

 

[IGNORE2]

there he is. Funny, his message was different before. Something about cubs and World Series... hmmm... what was it again willy? Remind us who’s playing in the World Series this year?

Btw, Sox matched cubs in attendance this year, beat them in wins, tied them head on and did it on a fraction of the payroll.

How about a wager on 2021? Number of total regular season wins. Loser stops posting for a year? Or winner renames losers handle? C’mon willy - be brave old man, just for once.

Oh @willycat

 

[hoosboot]

The current Cubs should probably be dismantled with an eye toward accumulating prospects. They are probably stuck with Heyward and Darvish and Kimbrel. Hendricks could fetch a very good haul (one of my favorite MLB pitchers) in a crappy FA market for pitching, but I think they hold onto him. They need to trade Bryant and perhaps Baez or Contreras. Those are the guys with any real value.

A core of Rizzo, Hendricks, Darvish (if healthy), Heyward, Schwobber, and (say) Contreras could probably compete in the mediocre NL Central, but the Cubs window has closed on this group, IMO.

Yeah, in terms of World Series championship dreams, that's probably the case. Atlanta and the Dodgers are just younger and better right now. The Marlins are coming and other teams are in similar situations as the Cubs that could go up or down based on next steps.

The challenge for the Cubs is the recency bias with the performance in this season of the guys they'd want to trade. They aren't likely to get a top haul for most of those guys. They should have dealt Bryant last year because this year stacked on top of the previous suppresses his value. Baez is probably the most valuable, but this season again probably took a tick off what you can get for him. Honestly, I think corbi is right that Darvish is probably who they can get the most for because he's coming off of some sustained success and is a starting pitcher. A really nice #2 on a really good team. Hendricks could net a solid return as well, but obviously Kimbrel isn't going anywhere and I don't think most people will buy on a Heyward rennaissance.

 

[NUCat320]

The degree to which Baez was terrible in what, age-wise, should be a peak of peak season, was shocking.

It‘s a credit to his mental game that the loss of in-game video was such a detriment. The policy itself seems dumb to me — punishing everyone for the violations of two teams.

Has MLB ruled on whether it’ll be allowed next year? I sure hope it is.

 

[Hungry Jack]

The degree to which Baez was terrible in what, age-wise, should be a peak of peak season, was shocking.

It‘s a credit to his mental game that the loss of in-game video was such a detriment. The policy itself seems dumb to me — punishing everyone for the violations of two teams.

Has MLB ruled on whether it’ll be allowed next year? I sure hope it is.

Honestly, I think you have to give all players a pass on this season. Just such weird circumstances to play under. Some guys adjusted well, but in a game that seems to be so much about finding a rhythm with your mechanics and your mindset, this season just seemed to negate that.

 

[NUCat320]

Honestly, I think you have to give all players a pass on this season. Just such weird circumstances to play under. Some guys adjusted well, but in a game that seems to be so much about finding a rhythm with your mechanics and your mindset, this season just seemed to negate that.

It’s pretty remarkable that the best player in the NL (my biased, watched-him-every-day) started the season off terribly while recovering from COVID. M-V-Free!

 

[corbi296]

Yeah, in terms of World Series championship dreams, that's probably the case. Atlanta and the Dodgers are just younger and better right now. The Marlins are coming and other teams are in similar situations as the Cubs that could go up or down based on next steps.

The challenge for the Cubs is the recency bias with the performance in this season of the guys they'd want to trade. They aren't likely to get a top haul for most of those guys. They should have dealt Bryant last year because this year stacked on top of the previous suppresses his value. Baez is probably the most valuable, but this season again probably took a tick off what you can get for him. Honestly, I think corbi is right that Darvish is probably who they can get the most for because he's coming off of some sustained success and is a starting pitcher. A really nice #2 on a really good team. Hendricks could net a solid return as well, but obviously Kimbrel isn't going anywhere and I don't think most people will buy on a Heyward rennaissance.

I’d look to trade Darvish, Bryant and possibly Schwarber to try to pull off a quick on the fly retool and create payroll flexibility. If Colorado is still interested in a trade based on Bryant and Nolan Aronado as the core pieces in a larger trade, I’d be on the phone right now. Dangle Darvish over the break but possibly wait until the next trade deadline to maximize return from a contending team that needs one more top starter to put them over the top.

 

[hoosboot]

Honestly, I think you have to give all players a pass on this season. Just such weird circumstances to play under. Some guys adjusted well, but in a game that seems to be so much about finding a rhythm with your mechanics and your mindset, this season just seemed to negate that.

Yeah...I don't think fans will penalize guys, but for execs and teams I suspect it's just more data to throw into the hopper. I think a guy like Cody Bellinger may have been looking at losing some money on his coming big deal based on his regular season (which wasn't even half of a normal regular season), but that catch last night may have gotten some of it back! The meh season for Bryant is bad for him and his value because it's stacked upon recent injuries and meh performance. He could have changed that narrative with a few weeks of hot hitting.

If I'm a team looking for a shortstop, I 100% try to pry away Baez in a trade that makes the Cubs sell low. I don't think Theo is foolish enough to do so, but how the Cubs are able to retool on the fly will be telling in regard to the management team's abilities.

 

[corbi296]

Yeah...I don't think fans will penalize guys, but for execs and teams I suspect it's just more data to throw into the hopper. I think a guy like Cody Bellinger may have been looking at losing some money on his coming big deal based on his regular season (which wasn't even half of a normal regular season), but that catch last night may have gotten some of it back! The meh season for Bryant is bad for him and his value because it's stacked upon recent injuries and meh performance. He could have changed that narrative with a few weeks of hot hitting.

If I'm a team looking for a shortstop, I 100% try to pry away Baez in a trade that makes the Cubs sell low. I don't think Theo is foolish enough to do so, but how the Cubs are able to retool on the fly will be telling in regard to the management team's abilities.

Baez, Hendricks, Contreras and Happ aren’t going anywhere. That’s the core Theo will retool on. I could see Contreras being traded for a ransom in a year or two because the cubs are stacked with minor league catching talent but nothing will happen near term.

 

[IGNORE2]

I’d look to trade Darvish, Bryant and possibly Schwarber to try to pull off a quick on the fly retool and create payroll flexibility. If Colorado is still interested in a trade based on Bryant and Nolan Aronado as the core pieces in a larger trade, I’d be on the phone right now. Dangle Darvish over the break but possibly wait until the next trade deadline to maximize return from a contending team that needs one more top starter to put them over the top.

If Colorado swapped Bryant for Aronado, someone in denver should be fired and banned from baseball. Cubs window has closed. Another 100 years and another might open, right @willycat?

 

[hoosboot]

Baez, Hendricks, Contreras and Happ aren’t going anywhere. That’s the core Theo will retool on. I could see Contreras being traded for a ransom in a year or two because the cubs are stacked with minor league catching talent but nothing will happen near term.

There's not a lot other than Darvish to retool on then. Contrearas, Happ, and Baez are the guys that teams are going to actually want. Not gonna get much a haul for Schwarbs (in particular) and Bryant because they are entering the last year of their contract and Bryant is damaged goods. You'd have to pay people to take Heyward. I thought this was an interesting article on the situation the Cubs find themselves in (with the quote that kind of sums it up for me highlighted):

"The trouble for Epstein is that Chicago’s current roster is flush with semi-expensive players on short-term deals who are coming off disappointing seasons."

The Cubs don't have a Mookie Betts to trade and next season presents a lot of uncertainties still for MLB clubs. With what you want to hold back, I'll be surprised if the Cubs get a haul for anything other than a trade that includes Darvish.

What do you think about rumors that Theo will be gone after next year, too?

 

[chicagocatfan24]

I believe technically he still will be.

He needs to show improvement defensively and get his head out of his ass on the basepaths.

He said he couldn't

The degree to which Baez was terrible in what, age-wise, should be a peak of peak season, was shocking.

It‘s a credit to his mental game that the loss of in-game video was such a detriment. The policy itself seems dumb to me — punishing everyone for the violations of two teams.

Has MLB ruled on whether it’ll be allowed next year? I sure hope it is.

....wasn’t just two teams. I guess at least 10 in various ways

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

Yeah...I don't think fans will penalize guys, but for execs and teams I suspect it's just more data to throw into the hopper. I think a guy like Cody Bellinger may have been looking at losing some money on his coming big deal based on his regular season (which wasn't even half of a normal regular season), but that catch last night may have gotten some of it back! The meh season for Bryant is bad for him and his value because it's stacked upon recent injuries and meh performance. He could have changed that narrative with a few weeks of hot hitting.

If I'm a team looking for a shortstop, I 100% try to pry away Baez in a trade that makes the Cubs sell low. I don't think Theo is foolish enough to do so, but how the Cubs are able to retool on the fly will be telling in regard to the management team's abilities.

The Cubs pop gun offense needs to be overhauled. They haven’t had a lead off hitter since Fowler and team has too many strikeout guys that can’t steal a base. They just can’t manufacture runs. So they either bludgeon teams or are held to below 2 runs or less depending on the other teams SP.

The Baez excuses are never ending. No fans, no video, Blah Blah Blah. This is from a guy who refuses to shorten his stroke to advance a runner or hit the opposite way. Bode is probably better than KB at this moment. You won’t get value for either one of them, so Cubs are stuck. The silver lining is that can probably get them cheaper than originally planned if they want to keep them.

A few currently in the starting 8 have to go. Theo can use his last year to get the team out of its slide.

 

[Hungry Jack]

It’s pretty remarkable that the best player in the NL (my biased, watched-him-every-day) started the season off terribly while recovering from COVID. M-V-Free!

Proof that COVID really isn't much worse than the flu

(ducks)

The Braves sure got nice production out of Marcell Ozuna.

 

[corbi296]

There's not a lot other than Darvish to retool on then. Contrearas, Happ, and Baez are the guys that teams are going to actually want. Not gonna get much a haul for Schwarbs (in particular) and Bryant because they are entering the last year of their contract and Bryant is damaged goods. You'd have to pay people to take Heyward. I thought this was an interesting article on the situation the Cubs find themselves in (with the quote that kind of sums it up for me highlighted):

"The trouble for Epstein is that Chicago’s current roster is flush with semi-expensive players on short-term deals who are coming off disappointing seasons."

The Cubs don't have a Mookie Betts to trade and next season presents a lot of uncertainties still for MLB clubs. With what you want to hold back, I'll be surprised if the Cubs get a haul for anything other than a trade that includes Darvish.

What do you think about rumors that Theo will be gone after next year, too?

Darvish would yield a haul. He is a top 10-15 starter in baseball. The guy shows no sign of deterioration. In fact his velocity and stuff seems to be getting better.

Bryant and Schwarber are less likely to yield much because of performance and contract status. You’d have to find a match with another player looking for a change of scenery like an Aranado.

As far as Heyward is concerned, I don’t think the Cubs have any intention of trading him. He just posted his best back to back seasons at the plate, continues to be a gold glove right fielder and is a key leader in the clubhouse. He and Happ posted the highest WAR of any Cub position players this season.