P6 Coaching changes

[GatoLouco]

As of 03/22 - 1 spot opened

Duke: Mike Krzyzewski / Jon Scheyer (Internal AC)
Florida: Mike White / Todd Golden (San Francisco)
Georgia: Tom Crean / Mike White (Florida)
Kansas State: Bruce Weber / Jerome Tang (Baylor AC)
Louisville: Chris Mack / Kenny Payne (Knicks AC)
LSU: Will Wade / Matt McMahon (Murray State)
Maryland: Mark Turgeon / Kevin Willard (Seton Hall)
Mississippi State: Ben Howland / Chris Jans (NM State)
Missouri: Cuonzo Martin / Dennis Gates (Cleveland State)
Seton Hall: Kevin Willard / Shaheen Holloway (Saint Pete's)
South Carolina: Frank Martin / Lamont Paris (Chattanooga)
Xavier: Travis Steele / Sean Miller (unemployed)
Butler: Lavall Jordan / Thad Matta

 

[CoralSpringsCat]

As of 03/21 - 3 spots opened

Duke: Mike Krzyzewski / Jon Scheyer (Internal AC)
Florida: Mike White / Todd Golden (San Francisco)
Georgia: Tom Crean / Mike White (Florida)
Kansas State: Bruce Weber / Jerome Tang (Baylor AC)
Louisville: Chris Mack / Kenny Payne (Knicks AC)
LSU: Will Wade /
Maryland: Mark Turgeon / Kevin Willard (Seton Hall)
Mississippi State: Ben Howland / Chris Jans (NM State)
Missouri: Cuonzo Martin / Dennis Gates (Cleveland State)
Seton Hall: Kevin Willard /
South Carolina: Frank Martin /
Xavier: Travis Steele / Sean Miller (unemployed)

Thanks for posting this.

 

[CappyNU]

As of 03/21 - 3 spots opened

Duke: Mike Krzyzewski / Jon Scheyer (Internal AC)
Florida: Mike White / Todd Golden (San Francisco)
Georgia: Tom Crean / Mike White (Florida)
Kansas State: Bruce Weber / Jerome Tang (Baylor AC)
Louisville: Chris Mack / Kenny Payne (Knicks AC)
LSU: Will Wade /
Maryland: Mark Turgeon / Kevin Willard (Seton Hall)
Mississippi State: Ben Howland / Chris Jans (NM State)
Missouri: Cuonzo Martin / Dennis Gates (Cleveland State)
Seton Hall: Kevin Willard /
South Carolina: Frank Martin /
Xavier: Travis Steele / Sean Miller (unemployed)

LSU hired Murray St's coach Matt McMahon, and you can likely put Shaheen Holloway's name down for Seton Hall whenever the Peacocks finish their run.

 

[NUCat320]

As of 03/21 - 3 spots opened

Duke: Mike Krzyzewski / Jon Scheyer (Internal AC)
Florida: Mike White / Todd Golden (San Francisco)
Georgia: Tom Crean / Mike White (Florida)
Kansas State: Bruce Weber / Jerome Tang (Baylor AC)
Louisville: Chris Mack / Kenny Payne (Knicks AC)
LSU: Will Wade /
Maryland: Mark Turgeon / Kevin Willard (Seton Hall)
Mississippi State: Ben Howland / Chris Jans (NM State)
Missouri: Cuonzo Martin / Dennis Gates (Cleveland State)
Seton Hall: Kevin Willard /
South Carolina: Frank Martin /
Xavier: Travis Steele / Sean Miller (unemployed)

Not specifically pertinent to this topic, but Archie Miller also was hired off the unemployment line, at Rhode Island.

Even less related to the topic, URI’s AD is named Thorr Bjorn.

 

[GatoLouco]

LSU hired Murray St's coach Matt McMahon, and you can likely put Shaheen Holloway's name down for Seton Hall whenever the Peacocks finish their run.

thanks!

 

[CatManTrue]

LSU hired Murray St's coach Matt McMahon, and you can likely put Shaheen Holloway's name down for Seton Hall whenever the Peacocks finish their run.

Is Seton Hall that much stronger of an opportunity than Saint Peter’s? Wouldn’t he rather hold out for NU instead?

 

[NJCat]

Is Seton Hall that much stronger of an opportunity than Saint Peter’s? Wouldn’t he rather hold out for NU instead?

Ha. Going home to his Alma Mater.

 

[Catfanincolo]

Is Seton Hall that much stronger of an opportunity than Saint Peter’s? Wouldn’t he rather hold out for NU instead?

Yes. St. Peter’s is probably a $250K-$300K job. Seton Hall is $1-$2M.

 

[CatManTrue]

Yes. St. Peter’s is probably a $250K-$300K job. Seton Hall is $1-$2M.

Counterpoint: NU is $3M. Guaranteed for years.

 

[GatoLouco]

Counterpoint: NU is $3M. Guaranteed for years.

From what I could find, Willard latest salary at SH was $1,961,262. His contract, at MD, is $29.4M for 7 years.

 

[GatoLouco]

South Carolina is hiring Lamont Paris. Seton Hall is the only "open" seat. Probably closing as soon as St. Pete's loses.

 

[CappyNU]

Might be the end of the P6 carousel for this year, though Butler's coach is on the hot seat, they haven't committed to him for next year yet. Capel at Pitt is coming back largely because his buyout this year is apparently a whopping $15 million but "drops dramatically" after next season. Clemson's coach Brownell is definitely on the hot seat for next year, and there are growing rumblings of dissatisfaction with Bobby Hurley at ASU.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Those Duke guys know how to get the guaranteed money.

The $$$ flushed down the toilet by the NBA and NCAA universities to pay Coach K's minions is staggering.

 

[7th Cir. Cat]

Counterpoint: NU is $3M. Guaranteed for years.

And you can have five losing seasons in a row before you’re officially on the hot seat! It’s the ultimate low pressure job.

 

[CatManTrue]

From what I could find, Willard latest salary at SH was $1,961,262. His contract, at MD, is $29.4M for 7 years.

So Maryland is only paying Willard $1.2M more per year than we pay CCC?

That indicates we should be able to attract a top tier coach if CCC doesn’t turn it around next year if we pay market value. We’re not far off.

 

[Purple Pile Driver]

So Maryland is only paying Willard $1.2M more per year than we pay CCC?

That indicates we should be able to attract a top tier coach if CCC doesn’t turn it around next year if we pay market value. We’re not far off.

Kevin Willard is top tier? Has been good recently, but entire body of work isn’t mind blowing.

 

[GatoLouco]

So Maryland is only paying Willard $1.2M more per year than we pay CCC?

That indicates we should be able to attract a top tier coach if CCC doesn’t turn it around next year if we pay market value. We’re not far off.

Kind of hard to know for sure what each coach makes, as there are incentive structures to add to the base salaries.

I found this as recent info on B1G coaches (source is USA Today):

Coach	Total Pay
Ben Johnson	$1,950,000
Micah Shrewseberry	$2,000,000
Steve Pikiell	$2,600,000
Greg Gard	$2,835,000
Fran McCaffrey	$3,000,000
Chris Holtmann	$3,045,179
Mike Woodson	$3,125,000

Coach	Total Pay
Matt Painter	$3,225,000
Chris Collins	$3,262,250
Mark Turgeon	$3,315,840
Fred Hoiberg	$3,500,000
Brad Underwood	$3,500,000
Juwan Howard	$3,500,000
Tom Izzo	$8,341,000

Average is: $3,371,399
Average without Izzo is: $2,989,098
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,075,689

Replacing Turgeon by Willard, with Willard at $4,200,00:

Average is: $3,434,554
Average without Izzo is: $3,057,110
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,149,369

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Kind of hard to know for sure what each coach makes, as there are incentive structures to add to the base salaries.

I found this as recent info on B1G coaches (source is USA Today):

Coach	Total Pay
Ben Johnson	$1,950,000
Micah Shrewseberry	$2,000,000
Steve Pikiell	$2,600,000
Greg Gard	$2,835,000
Fran McCaffrey	$3,000,000
Chris Holtmann	$3,045,179
Mike Woodson	$3,125,000

Coach	Total Pay
Matt Painter	$3,225,000
Chris Collins	$3,262,250
Mark Turgeon	$3,315,840
Fred Hoiberg	$3,500,000
Brad Underwood	$3,500,000
Juwan Howard	$3,500,000
Tom Izzo	$8,341,000

Average is: $3,371,399
Average without Izzo is: $2,989,098
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,075,689

Replacing Turgeon by Willard, with Willard at $4,200,00:

Average is: $3,434,554
Average without Izzo is: $3,057,110
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,149,369

Wow did we pay a lot for an imitation coach.

 

[7th Cir. Cat]

Kind of hard to know for sure what each coach makes, as there are incentive structures to add to the base salaries.

I found this as recent info on B1G coaches (source is USA Today):

Coach	Total Pay
Ben Johnson	$1,950,000
Micah Shrewseberry	$2,000,000
Steve Pikiell	$2,600,000
Greg Gard	$2,835,000
Fran McCaffrey	$3,000,000
Chris Holtmann	$3,045,179
Mike Woodson	$3,125,000

Coach	Total Pay
Matt Painter	$3,225,000
Chris Collins	$3,262,250
Mark Turgeon	$3,315,840
Fred Hoiberg	$3,500,000
Brad Underwood	$3,500,000
Juwan Howard	$3,500,000
Tom Izzo	$8,341,000

Average is: $3,371,399
Average without Izzo is: $2,989,098
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,075,689

Replacing Turgeon by Willard, with Willard at $4,200,00:

Average is: $3,434,554
Average without Izzo is: $3,057,110
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,149,369

Just went to say thanks for doing the leg work and putting some facts/context into the coaching discussion.

This is even more important since we now know that Gragg reads the board….

 

[Vassar69]

Kind of hard to know for sure what each coach makes, as there are incentive structures to add to the base salaries.

I found this as recent info on B1G coaches (source is USA Today):

Coach	Total Pay
Ben Johnson	$1,950,000
Micah Shrewseberry	$2,000,000
Steve Pikiell	$2,600,000
Greg Gard	$2,835,000
Fran McCaffrey	$3,000,000
Chris Holtmann	$3,045,179
Mike Woodson	$3,125,000

Coach	Total Pay
Matt Painter	$3,225,000
Chris Collins	$3,262,250
Mark Turgeon	$3,315,840
Fred Hoiberg	$3,500,000
Brad Underwood	$3,500,000
Juwan Howard	$3,500,000
Tom Izzo	$8,341,000

Average is: $3,371,399
Average without Izzo is: $2,989,098
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,075,689

Replacing Turgeon by Willard, with Willard at $4,200,00:

Average is: $3,434,554
Average without Izzo is: $3,057,110
Average removing top and bottom values is: $3,149,369

So what is Collins pulling then after his incentives are added to that base pay?

 

[NJCat]

So what is Collins pulling then after his incentives are added to that base pay?

The same as his base. How could he possibly be meeting criteria for incentive-based pay????

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

The same as his base. How could he possibly be meeting criteria for incentive-based pay????

He's got incentives like

$1,000,000 for winning a Big Ten tournament game

$10,000 for every game we play where no Northwestern player fouls out
$500,000 if Northwestern leads the Big Ten in substitutions
$100,000 if NU's worst game of the season is also its last game of the season

stuff like that.

 

[CoralSpringsCat]

He's got incentives like

$1,000,000 for winning a Big Ten tournament game

$10,000 for every game we play where no Northwestern player fouls out
$500,000 if Northwestern leads the Big Ten in substitutions
$100,000 if NU's worst game of the season is also its last game of the season

stuff like that.

Another fair and balanced take from PWB.

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

Another fair and balanced take from PWB.

Oh it was a joke. Its okay to have a little fun, right?

 

[12375CAT]

So which one of those was the best hire?

 

[4IUSox2]

Dane Fife now available for an Assistant’s or HC spot as he was let go at IU today. He was thought by some to be the coach In waiting…guess not.

 

[Vassar69]

The same as his base. How could he possibly be meeting criteria for incentive-based pay????

I was being sarcastic; tone isn’t conveyed well on here!

 

[Sec.112]

So Maryland is only paying Willard $1.2M more per year than we pay CCC?

That indicates we should be able to attract a top tier coach if CCC doesn’t turn it around next year if we pay market value. We’re not far off.

"If we pay market value" ... key term.

Everybody wants to ignore that NU brought in Collins around $1.4M - not very close to market value at that time. $3M brought him up to B10 mid range.

You'll have to excuse me if I'm not confident NU will pay market value for first time P6 coaches - especially with a potential $6M on the books.

A strong majority of these contracts so far are 6 years+ also - Gates, Golden, White, McMahon, Paris, Payne.

 

[hoosboot]

"If we pay market value" ... key term.

Everybody wants to ignore that NU brought in Collins around $1.4M - not very close to market value at that time. $3M brought him up to B10 mid range.

You'll have to excuse me if I'm not confident NU will pay market value for first time P6 coaches - especially with a potential $6M on the books.

A strong majority of these contracts so far are 6 years+ also - Gates, Golden, White, McMahon, Paris, Payne.

To be fair, the $3.2 mill did not bring him up to the mid-range at the time it was signed. It brought him near the top. It was under $200,000 less than the #2 salary (Thad Matta @ OSU) in the B1G and was Top 15 IN THE COUNTRY at the time.

While it is mid-pack in the B1G now, at the time he signed that extension, Collins made more than Underwood...Howard and Hoiberg weren't even in the league yet...and Izzo made "just" $4.2 million a season.

Your point about paying buyout money is well-taken, but NU has at least shown a willingness to pay market value for a coach who has shown they deserve it.

 

[GatoLouco]

"If we pay market value" ... key term.

Everybody wants to ignore that NU brought in Collins around $1.4M - not very close to market value at that time. $3M brought him up to B10 mid range.

You'll have to excuse me if I'm not confident NU will pay market value for first time P6 coaches - especially with a potential $6M on the books.

A strong majority of these contracts so far are 6 years+ also - Gates, Golden, White, McMahon, Paris, Payne.

I think Collins was paid market value when he came in. Like Johnson or Shrewseberry were. To me, market value is not the average of what a conference pays. It is what a coach is worth considering his background and, mostly, what other schools would pay him. Collins would not have accepted $1.4M if some other school was offering him $3M.

Woodson or Howard were paid more as first time B1G coaches. So did Willard. Coaches' market value is, like for anything else, what a school is willing to pay. Not the average of the conference. Upon renewal, yeah, they showed they can hang, their value goes up to at least average in the conference.

Some more data points:
1) Piekell renewed this year for $16M/4 years - $4M
2) Dennis Gates $21/7 years - $3M
3) Golden $18M/6 years - $3M
4) Paybe $20.1M/6 years - $3.35M
5) McMahon $20.3M/7 years - $2.9M
6) Tang $13.1M/6 years - $2.18
7) Jans $9.6M/4years - $2.4M

Could not find info for Paris or Miller.

 

[Sec.112]

A) Matta did not coach the first year of Collins latest contract.
B) Collins first season under that contract was 17-18. According to USA Today and Detroit Free Press, Holtmann, Izzo, Beilein and Archie made more than $3M.

I'm trying to deal with the reality of today's market. You guys are playing the semantics game to define five years ago in a way any good negotiator would laugh off. It's probably a good exercise since that's what NU administrators will probably do next year.

It's pretty clear the market for high-demand, first-time P6 coaches with head coaching experience is $3M/ years for 7 years.

The search of South Carolina (another graveyard) this year is probably similar to what NU will encounter next year. Jeff Goodman reported Paris was the third or fourth option with a standing/begging offer to Sean Miller to take as much time as he needed. They ended up with Paris for $2.5M for five years on top of Martin's $3M buyout.

 

[elgatoloco]

Fife's situation was a strange one and according to one pretty credible report partly came down to Fife wanting to play the youngers so that they're ready when Fife takes over vs Woodson wanting to play the transfers so he can win now. It got complicated from there.

This same report also said that the assistants split up the scouting responsibilities and Fife's games came out worse than the others. Not sure I'm as ready to believe this.

Whatever the truth, I don't think he'd be a good fit for Collins' staff. His eyes are already elsewhere

 

[GatoLouco]

Holloway ended up, as predicted, going to Seton Hall.

There are no seats open in P6 schools.

There continue to be rumors that Butler might open and Jeff Boals be hired (also rumors Thad Matta would be AD).

Not sure how Georgetown is retaining Ewing. 0-20 was atrocious. As of now, 4 players in the portal.

 

[CatJones]

Not sure how Georgetown is retaining Ewing.

Even Dartmouth, the unlucky team champion, beat Georgetown.

 

[IGNORE2]

Oh it was a joke. Its okay to have a little fun, right?

Ummm, not allowed if NU programs are the punch line. Can I offer you some more koolaid?

 

[GatoLouco]

Butler job is open

 

[PurpleWhiteBoy]

I'm assuming a lot of people missed this, but Xavier fired their coach Travis Steele after winning their first round game in the NIT, beating Dennis Gates' Cleveland State team.

Xavier went on to win that tournament, coached by assistants, beating Florida, Vanderbilt, Saint Bonnie's and Texas A&M in succession.

They're bringing back cheating Sean Miller, fired a year ago from Arizona as a result of the FBI investigation.

The coach Xavier fired (Steele) has already been hired by Miami of Ohio.

 

[elgatoloco]

Butler firing not cool. Not only was the timing meant to greatly reduce the buyout (from what I understand), the staff will have a harder time finding jobs. Because of Zoom, the ability of search firms to do the background work quickly and the need to hit the transfer portal, most jobs are closing before the Final 4, the traditional time for interviews.

 

[GatoLouco]

Butler firing not cool. Not only was the timing meant to greatly reduce the buyout (from what I understand), the staff will have a harder time finding jobs. Because of Zoom, the ability of search firms to do the background work quickly and the need to hit the transfer portal, most jobs are closing before the Final 4, the traditional time for interviews.

Rumor in the Butler base is the Jeff Boals has been a done deal for a while. And that they were trying to convince Thad Matta to be AD.

 

[NJCat]

Thad Matta hired for a second stint at Butler. Hope this means his health has improved.