PurpleWhiteBoy said:

I feel like Windham has to take minutes from Berry. When your two starting guards can't handle the ball or beat guys off the dribble, you've got a big problem. Berry and Leach are similar in their limitations, though Leach is a more flexible scorer and I like him shooting midrange pull-up jumpers and 3's. Windham is quicker than either and a better ballhandler. He is also a better on-ball defender. We are getting torched by guards that Berry, Leach and Mullins can't stay in front of.

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Windham might have the best ability on this team to break down a defender off the dribble, outside of maybe Leach. Leach can get by his man and either hit that pull-up midrange or drive it all the way to the basket. Berry, on the other hand, is more limited in handling the ball but he excels coming off screens and getting his shot without the ball. That’s something Windham and Leach don’t quite do as well; they're more rhythm guys who need a couple of dribbles to get their looks.

Offensively, Berry is really solid in that he doesn’t force bad shots or try to do too much. That’s something most freshmen struggle with, even the really talented ones. Berry knows his role, plays within it, and doesn’t overstep. That’s a benefit especially when you’re going through shooting woes.

Now, defensively, Windham is not on the level of Leach, Mullins, or Berry. Those guys are good defenders on the ball. Mullins is an elite defender, Berry might not get enough credit for his defensive impact, especially now that everyone’s focused on his shooting struggles. Berry is one of the top three perimeter defenders we’ve got, and I think his defensive value is often overlooked. Mullins and Berry have very quick hands that really get into passing lanes and alter drives of opposing players. Windham’s not quite there yet. He doesn’t have the instincts or positioning down, and his help defense still needs work. But he’s quick enough and has the tools to develop into a very solid defender in the next year or two.

Look at Martinelli’s progression – his defensive positioning from freshman to sophomore year improved drastically. By his junior year, his footwork and speed were at a whole new level, and that’s when he became a solid defender for us. Windham has a much higher ceiling and floor defensively than Martinelli did at that stage. So, I’m high on this freshman class, but they’re a year or two away. Positioning, communication, and footwork are more than half the battle on defense, and Windham will get there. He just needs the time in the program.

Purple Pile Driver said:

Looks more mental than physical with Ty to me. He needs to see the first one go down.

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If he is defending like he did last year (appears to be for the most part, though he is called for more ticky-tack fouls it seems), then the "mental" explanation is much more plausible.

EDIT: sorry Gordie did not read your post before I posted. I think we have similar views.

"It was 17-16 and we took some bad shots, couple turnovers, they got to get out and run and we melted down...," Collins said.

Nicholson got called for his 2nd foul on a missed MSU shot that would normally be a jump ball (he and Carson Cooper grabbed it but Cooper ripped it away and the ball went out of bounds) Cooper made both free throws, Nicholson went to the bench. It was 19-16 with 10:35 to go in the first half.

Jalen Leach committed an offensive foul with 9:42 to go, Cats down 21-16. He also went to the bench with 2 fouls.

Leach returned with MSU up 28-16 at the 8:00 mark after 2 Mullins turnovers.

Nicholson returned at the 5:03 mark with MSU ahead 36-19.

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ThatkidfromHolland said:

The starting lineup does not need to change. Leach played better than a lot of guys out there yesterday, and Berry is still one of the best defenders we’ve got on this team. The best shot we have at winning is having this group play at a high level together. Berry as a Senior, despite his struggles offensively, still has a higher ceiling than anyone coming off the bench right now. Same with Leach.

Now, I’ll be honest, Berry isn’t the same player he was last year. His offense has been inconsistent, and that's something we've seen before in his career. But you still start him. When he’s on, he can win you games. When he’s off, you start adjusting. Last night, he played 16 minutes – that’s an example of adjusting his minutes. He’s a streaky shooter, but defensively, he's solid, and that's why he stays out there. We see what we get on the offensive end, then make adjustments as needed. Don’t put much stock into the starting lineup. Look at minutes played.

I also don’t think enough of you are paying attention to the defensive side of the game. Too much ball watching going on here. Berry is a darn good defender, and even if his offense isn’t clicking, he deserves some minutes. The freshmen are still learning, and while they’ve made progress offensively, they’ve still got a lot to clean up on defense. They’re picking their spots much better now than early in the season on offense, but they still have moments where they force shots or try to do too much. I’m excited about their growth, but let's be real. I don’t think they’re going to be the consistent answer for winning games this year unless they improve a lot on the defensive end. Hopefully something starts clicking soon. Gotta start the season turnaround ASAP.

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Berry has a LOT more silly fouls than I would attribute to as good a defender as you are making him out to be (he generally is good,
but not great). And his shot is WAY off; not even close in the last few games. Still not sure there are better options, but he can’t continue this level of play and start the rest of the year.

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Similarly, our "ability" to chip away at big deficits at garbage time has limited the damage in KenPom. But we gotta beat some good teams if a Tournament is to be any possibility.

Another rough loss for NU sees us drop a bit more to #56. We're not being punished that much for struggling against a brutal schedule but at some point NU has to start winning to bring that number up. Butler needs to start winning as well - if they drop out of the top 100 that officially becomes a bad loss.

QUAD 1 (1-5)
H #9 Illinois - W
H #14 Michigan State - L
A #15 Purdue - L
A #45 Iowa - L
A #51 Penn State - L
A #61 Dayton - L

QUAD 2 (0-1)
N #88 Butler - L

QUAD 3 (4-0)
H #119 UIC - W
N #124 UNLV - W
H #133 DePaul - W
N #146 Georgia Tech - W

QUAD 4 (5-0)
H #190 Pepperdine - W
H #191 Montana State - W
H #206 Northeastern - W
H #286 Lehigh - W
H #335 Eastern Illinois - W

Unfortunately, this week doesn't get much easier, with a Quad 1 home game against #22 Maryland and a Quad 1 road game against #11 Michigan.

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GatoLouco said:

There's an aspect to changing the starting five that has not been mentioned: when it's an attempt to shake things up, to send a message to the group that we are trying something new. Not so much related to X's and O's, but just related to trying to energize a group that might be suffering from some lack of confidence.

This is something coaches attempt when going through slumps. We are on a losing streak, just trying something new might make sense from a group dynamic stand point. "Hey, the coach acknowledges something is off and is working to correct it".

Having said this, historically, Collins sticks with his starting five. It is rare to see a change. When was the last time that happened? When Matt became a starter over Vehoeven? I mean, he stuck with Beran even as his minutes kept being less and less.

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I feel like Windham has to take minutes from Berry. When your two starting guards can't handle the ball or beat guys off the dribble, you've got a big problem. Berry and Leach are similar in their limitations, though Leach is a more flexible scorer and I like him shooting midrange pull-up jumpers and 3's. Windham is quicker than either and a better ballhandler. He is also a better on-ball defender. We are getting torched by guards that Berry, Leach and Mullins can't stay in front of.

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hdhntr1 said:

Barney was not playing his game. Not sure if it was because MSU prevented him from doing it or he was under the weather or he is having issues with the teeth but that was not his game, He wasn't really going inside with those contested 10 ft shots that he destroys the opponents with and also get him to the foul line. Today he was taking most of his shots from the perimeter. 0-6 from three but other shots from outside. (that is more a tertiary part of his game but he is much more of an inside out player) No real driving or using his strengths

He worked inside twice or maybe three times and that is when he got his 4 pts

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The only thing the Spartans liked more than forcing Barnhizer to take 3's...
was forcing him to shoot 18 foot jumpers.

It was very noticeable that the Spartan defenders weren't letting him get into the paint.
Off the top of my head it seems like Martinelli is able to get position in the paint and receive a pass, then go to work, whereas Barnhizer doesn't have that luxury - he tries to dribble his way in and its not working.

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There's an aspect to changing the starting five that has not been mentioned: when it's an attempt to shake things up, to send a message to the group that we are trying something new. Not so much related to X's and O's, but just related to trying to energize a group that might be suffering from some lack of confidence.

This is something coaches attempt when going through slumps. We are on a losing streak, just trying something new might make sense from a group dynamic stand point. "Hey, the coach acknowledges something is off and is working to correct it".

Having said this, historically, Collins sticks with his starting five. It is rare to see a change. When was the last time that happened? When Matt became a starter over Vehoeven? I mean, he stuck with Beran even as his minutes kept being less and less.

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Skunkpilot said:

If Barney scores his norm season avg they win. Instead he just kept chucking up bricks. Sparty had 0 fast break points against us I think they avg 17 or so.

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The opposing defense plays a large role in how many points our guys score.

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The starting lineup does not need to change. Leach played better than a lot of guys out there yesterday, and Berry is still one of the best defenders we’ve got on this team. The best shot we have at winning is having this group play at a high level together. Berry as a Senior, despite his struggles offensively, still has a higher ceiling than anyone coming off the bench right now. Same with Leach.

Now, I’ll be honest, Berry isn’t the same player he was last year. His offense has been inconsistent, and that's something we've seen before in his career. But you still start him. When he’s on, he can win you games. When he’s off, you start adjusting. Last night, he played 16 minutes – that’s an example of adjusting his minutes. He’s a streaky shooter, but defensively, he's solid, and that's why he stays out there. We see what we get on the offensive end, then make adjustments as needed. Don’t put much stock into the starting lineup. Look at minutes played.

I also don’t think enough of you are paying attention to the defensive side of the game. Too much ball watching going on here. Berry is a darn good defender, and even if his offense isn’t clicking, he deserves some minutes. The freshmen are still learning, and while they’ve made progress offensively, they’ve still got a lot to clean up on defense. They’re picking their spots much better now than early in the season on offense, but they still have moments where they force shots or try to do too much. I’m excited about their growth, but let's be real. I don’t think they’re going to be the consistent answer for winning games this year unless they improve a lot on the defensive end. Hopefully something starts clicking soon. Gotta start the season turnaround ASAP.

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