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86 Ex NU players criticize NU administration in open Letter

I mean get comfortable from a legal / contractual standpoint. Doesn’t take that long to read and digest a contract. The BOT had to be comfortable with the PR optics fallout of firing the icon of the last 25 years of NU football.

Not sure former players and coaches can all be trusted at this point. Clearly the allegations were more serious than just playful hazing as reporting from multiple outlets seems to have unearthed more claims than what was in the original report. More has come out since that infamous weekend of trying to sweep this all under the rug.
I knew what you meant and you are still very wrong. This was a $50 million + decision. If he
Made it after a weekend review by lawyers, he is even more of an idiot than I thought.

And yes, I agree with allThose saying what an expensive mistake Schill wil end up being. You
Don’t need to be F Lee Bailey to just hang the report and intial 2 week suspension around NU’s neck. We will never know but I bet Fitz gets every penny he is owed in his contract.
 
I mean get comfortable from a legal / contractual standpoint. Doesn’t take that long to read and digest a contract. The BOT had to be comfortable with the PR optics fallout of firing the icon of the last 25 years of NU football.

Not sure former players and coaches can all be trusted at this point. Clearly the allegations were more serious than just playful hazing as reporting from multiple outlets seems to have unearthed more claims than what was in the original report. More has come out since that infamous weekend of trying to sweep this all under the rug.

“Clearly the allegations were more serious?” Ah, no…not even close.
 
Of course I haven’t seen the report. I’d call naked pull ups, car washes, and running more serious than the nebulous initially reported hazing. If the first investigation had anything “sexual” uncovered, any self respecting law firm would have counseled more caution and transparency, maybe even immediate settlement to keep this out of the press. Instead they give Fitz a 2 week vacay that pisses off the victims (plural).

I don’t think the accusers would go thru all this public cluster solely to get PF fired no matter how much they may have disliked him... had to be some actual mental abuse associated. You don’t subject yourself to the legal process unless you’re ready for the battle. The accusers know that, the admins maybe know that. Not sure if PF does. And I would bet PF’s contract isn’t so ironclad. Most corporate exec level contacts have clauses for termination / arbitration if you embarrass the organization. Maybe a settlement will happen, but doubt for what’s left on his contract.
 
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Of course I haven’t seen the report. I’d call naked pull ups, car washes, and running more serious than the nebulous initially reported hazing. If the first investigation had anything “sexual” uncovered, any self respecting law firm would have counseled more caution and transparency, maybe even immediate settlement to keep this out of the press. Instead they give Fitz a 2 week vacay that pisses off the victims (plural).

I don’t think the accusers would go thru all this public cluster solely to get PF fired no matter how much they may have disliked him... had to be some actual mental abuse associated. You don’t subject yourself to the legal process unless you’re ready for the battle. The accusers know that, the admins maybe know that. Not sure if PF does. And I would bet PF’s contract isn’t so ironclad. Most corporate exec level contacts have clauses for termination / arbitration if you embarrass the organization. Maybe a settlement will happen, but doubt for what’s left on his contract.
You’re naive. Desperate people will do almost anything for money.
 
Don’t disagree but there are so many of these BS thrown out by the Enablers, I’m just trying to speak their language.

The whole notion that nobody has to ultimately be responsible for things happening in the program, in the locker room, apparently well known beyond the athletes is another BS item.
Those damn enablers!
 
Desperate people who don’t have a leg to stand on end up paying the defendant’s legal fees. I’m sure they’ve been counseled just as well as the University. You seem to think this a slip and fall / ambulance chasing case. Too many corroborating facts. The naive crowd is the one that thinks Fitz’s denial mode holds any water, saves, or protects him from his responsibility. I think he FAFO’d and the administration knows it, even if both Schill and Gragg added to the mess in their poor handling.
 
Desperate people who don’t have a leg to stand on end up paying the defendant’s legal fees. I’m sure they’ve been counseled just as well as the University. You seem to think this a slip and fall / ambulance chasing case. Too many corroborating facts. The naive crowd is the one that thinks Fitz’s denial mode holds any water, saves, or protects him from his responsibility. I think he FAFO’d and the administration knows it, even if both Schill and Gragg added to the mess in their poor handling.
They fully expect Schill to roll over and throw money at them to settle because of the stance he took. What, is Schill now suddenly going to fight their allegations in court?
 
They fully expect Schill to roll over and throw money at them to settle because of the stance he took. What, is Schill now suddenly going to fight their allegations in court?
Not sure. There are multiple suits. One may settle, the other seems to want a trial. Fitz hasn’t filed yet. Schill may be forced to fight or at least come clean with the deets of the internal investigations. Discovery and taking of witness statements is when all the dirty laundry will come out. Victims will name names and perps will flip. Maybe deals made. Scholarships are on the line and university discipline is waiting behind the legal system. Gonna git bumpy for a lotta folks.
 
Desperate people who don’t have a leg to stand on end up paying the defendant’s legal fees. I’m sure they’ve been counseled just as well as the University. You seem to think this a slip and fall / ambulance chasing case. Too many corroborating facts. The naive crowd is the one that thinks Fitz’s denial mode holds any water, saves, or protects him from his responsibility. I think he FAFO’d and the administration knows it, even if both Schill and Gragg added to the mess in their poor handling.
Well, there are going to have to PROVE Fitz knew and even the players that clearly couldn’t stand him have yet to produce a shred of evidence to support he knew!
 
Well, there are going to have to PROVE Fitz knew and even the players that clearly couldn’t stand him have yet to produce a shred of evidence to support he knew!
Maybe. The lawsuits aren’t just against Fitz. Admins (past & present) and other coaches included. The university may have to prove that it was Fitz‘s responsibility to know. It’ll all become clear in time. Beauty of the legal process. If settlements are forced, I’m not sure NU will want to cover both victims and Fitz. That could lead to mutual defense cooperation or counter suits from the various parties involved. A very Gordian knot without a sharp sword.
 
Maybe. The lawsuits aren’t just against Fitz. Admins (past & present) and other coaches included. The university may have to prove that it was Fitz‘s responsibility to know. It’ll all become clear in time. Beauty of the legal process. If settlements are forced, I’m not sure NU will want to cover both victims and Fitz. That could lead to mutual defense cooperation or counter suits from the various parties involved. A very Gordian knot without a sharp sword.
Schill is a very expensive hire.
 
Of course I haven’t seen the report. I’d call naked pull ups, car washes, and running more serious than the nebulous initially reported hazing. If the first investigation had anything “sexual” uncovered, any self respecting law firm would have counseled more caution and transparency, maybe even immediate settlement to keep this out of the press. Instead they give Fitz a 2 week vacay that pisses off the victims (plural).

I don’t think the accusers would go thru all this public cluster solely to get PF fired no matter how much they may have disliked him... had to be some actual mental abuse associated. You don’t subject yourself to the legal process unless you’re ready for the battle. The accusers know that, the admins maybe know that. Not sure if PF does. And I would bet PF’s contract isn’t so ironclad. Most corporate exec level contacts have clauses for termination / arbitration if you embarrass the organization. Maybe a settlement will happen, but doubt for what’s left on his contract.
It’s really comical, in retrospect, to read the initial release. No mention of running. No mention of car washes. Nothing about masks or d*cks. Just ‘hazing activities’.

And even as he’s being suspended, Fitz’s quote is about NU being better than other programs — upholding the highest standards.

Being that he’s been named in lawsuits as having witnessed naked pull-up sessions, I wonder if MacPherson was interviewed.

No proof that any coaches knew — but I wonder if we had any interviews that indicated ‘it wasn’t a secret’ — after all, running was common knowledge even among a first-year manager who wasn’t even allowed in the locker room.

What a colossal f*ck*p.




Maybe Schill and Gragg and Fitz will be welcome to audit a class in the fall:
 
Of course I haven’t seen the report. I’d call naked pull ups, car washes, and running more serious than the nebulous initially reported hazing. If the first investigation had anything “sexual” uncovered, any self respecting law firm would have counseled more caution and transparency, maybe even immediate settlement to keep this out of the press. Instead they give Fitz a 2 week vacay that pisses off the victims (plural).

I don’t think the accusers would go thru all this public cluster solely to get PF fired no matter how much they may have disliked him... had to be some actual mental abuse associated. You don’t subject yourself to the legal process unless you’re ready for the battle. The accusers know that, the admins maybe know that. Not sure if PF does. And I would bet PF’s contract isn’t so ironclad. Most corporate exec level contacts have clauses for termination / arbitration if you embarrass the organization. Maybe a settlement will happen, but doubt for what’s left on his contract.
I think you are correct. No quick lawsuit here by PF. Doesn’t mean it isn’t coming. But they might be waiting to see what shoes drop. And who those John Does might be.

PF might redeem some career but if he files something and gets caught looking really bad, he will become untouchable.

It is possible no lawsuit will ever be filed. Discovery is a bitch 🤷‍♂️
 
Desperate people who don’t have a leg to stand on end up paying the defendant’s legal fees. I’m sure they’ve been counseled just as well as the University. You seem to think this a slip and fall / ambulance chasing case. Too many corroborating facts. The naive crowd is the one that thinks Fitz’s denial mode holds any water, saves, or protects him from his responsibility. I think he FAFO’d and the administration knows it, even if both Schill and Gragg added to the mess in their poor handling.
Here you are wrong. IL is not a state that grants attorney fees easily. It’s one of the best strong arm tactics a litigant had in low level litigation - the amount the defendant will spend just to get to a judgement.
 
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Well, there are going to have to PROVE Fitz knew and even the players that clearly couldn’t stand him have yet to produce a shred of evidence to support he knew!
Not true as far as we know. Very possible the contract could be written that he should have known. I haven’t seen the contract but can envision boiler plate type language. Do you have inside information?
 
Here you are wrong. IL is not a state that grants attorney fees easily. It’s one of the best strong arm tactics a litigant had in low level litigation - the amount the defendant will spend just to get to a judgement.
Didn’t know that. All states are different. At this point, not sure what I want to see more; the initial report or Fitz’s contract? 😂
 
It’s really comical, in retrospect, to read the initial release. No mention of running. No mention of car washes. Nothing about masks or d*cks. Just ‘hazing activities’.

And even as he’s being suspended, Fitz’s quote is about NU being better than other programs — upholding the highest standards.

Being that he’s been named in lawsuits as having witnessed naked pull-up sessions, I wonder if MacPherson was interviewed.

No proof that any coaches knew — but I wonder if we had any interviews that indicated ‘it wasn’t a secret’ — after all, running was common knowledge even among a first-year manager who wasn’t even allowed in the locker room.

What a colossal f*ck*p.




Maybe Schill and Gragg and Fitz will be welcome to audit a class in the fall:
See, this is where releasing the report would (hopefully) clear up any potential nusindersstanding. Did people do naked pushups? If yes, were they forced to? If yes that’s a problem, if no then it’s not.
 
See, this is where releasing the report would (hopefully) clear up any potential nusindersstanding. Did people do naked pushups? If yes, were they forced to? If yes that’s a problem, if no then it’s not.
The intrepid @lou v nailed it with this column, published ~3-6 hours before Fitz was fired.


It’s so dumb.
 
The intrepid @lou v nailed it with this column, published ~3-6 hours before Fitz was fired.


It’s so dumb.
Lou's open letter to Schill and Gragg ended with this sentence

"But, if you continue to let this raging wildfire burn without doing something to douse it, you might end up cleaning out your desks, too."

It was as if Schill read that sentence, said "Oh Sh*t" to himself and freaked out, taking the most idiotic option.
 
Because I disagree with you. He is paid handsomely to run that program. Make all the decisions - for better or worse. He is not paid to win, clearly. He, per many on this very board, was paid handsomely to run a clean program and be the sparkling face of the school.

He failed on both. I get the goalposts have now been moved since none of the Enablers could have ever imagined such a scandal. But boy did we get plenty of face of the school, clean program when anyone questioned PFs continued employment at $5MM / year as we sucked three of the last four years and were not looking good for this year either.

Sorry PWB, we agree on much, but here we differ. He was very well paid to know. (Hell, managers knew and PF professed a zero tolerance policy - not a ‘boys will be boys’ policy, not a ‘done everywhere else so ok here’ policy - a self proclaimed zero tolerance policy - his words, his clean program)

Personally, I don't think the "scandal" was that serious until Schill started freaking out.
So, at present, I think NU ran an admirably clean program that people could be proud of.
But that depends on what you view as the standard for NCAA football programs.

My opinion is subject to change as facts come out.
 
Personally, I don't think the "scandal" was that serious until Schill started freaking out.
So, at present, I think NU ran an admirably clean program that people could be proud of.
But that depends on what you view as the standard for NCAA football programs.

My opinion is subject to change as facts come out.
You, and others, want to look at things in isolated bubbles. That’s not life.

His field results were worthy of firing at any legit P5 school but defended because he ran the cleanest program in the country and was the face of the university.

Performance - fail
Cleanest program in the country - fail
Face of the university - fail

Add his self proclaimed ‘zero tolerance for hazing’ - unconditionalized, not simply what he might witness in person, but period. Kinda like when he said the terrible season would never happen again, then two years later is does and he snaps at the media that dares remind him of his own damning words.

He’s gone. Not returning. I’m ok with that part.

Need a new Prez, AD and quality FB coach given the keys to run the program.
 
You, and others, want to look at things in isolated bubbles. That’s not life.

His field results were worthy of firing at any legit P5 school but defended because he ran the cleanest program in the country and was the face of the university.

Performance - fail
Cleanest program in the country - fail
Face of the university - fail

Add his self proclaimed ‘zero tolerance for hazing’ - unconditionalized, not simply what he might witness in person, but period. Kinda like when he said the terrible season would never happen again, then two years later is does and he snaps at the media that dares remind him of his own damning words.

He’s gone. Not returning. I’m ok with that part.

Need a new Prez, AD and quality FB coach given the keys to run the program.
After 15 years with Fitzgerald as head coach, NU had gone to 10 bowl games (and won 5).

Then Hankwitz retired, Fitzgerald hired the wrong guy and NU's record in the Big Ten went from 63-60 to 65-76.

Anybody who considers that a fail is filled with crazy expectations.

The reputational damage was inflicted by Schill.. Most people aren't that gullible.
 
After 15 years with Fitzgerald as head coach, NU had gone to 10 bowl games (and won 5).

Then Hankwitz retired, Fitzgerald hired the wrong guy and NU's record in the Big Ten went from 63-60 to 65-76.

Anybody who considers that a fail is filled with crazy expectations.

The reputational damage was inflicted by Schill.. Most people aren't that gullible.
Again, agree to disagree. Was it Fitz or Hank that really deserves the credit? Regardless, who stubbornly held onto JON, and Cushing and Springer?

And I’m pretty sure, in big time FB programs, you don’t get a lifetime guarantee for old accomplishments (unless you run the cleanest program in the country and are the face…) - do we need to look back at highly successful coaches that were ultimately fired and measure the time span from success to failure to fire? I’m pretty sure that’s an easy case to make.
 
Again, agree to disagree. Was it Fitz or Hank that really deserves the credit? Regardless, who stubbornly held onto JON, and Cushing and Springer?

And I’m pretty sure, in big time FB programs, you don’t get a lifetime guarantee for old accomplishments (unless you run the cleanest program in the country and are the face…) - do we need to look back at highly successful coaches that were ultimately fired and measure the time span from success to failure to fire? I’m pretty sure that’s an easy case to make.
With JON specifically, it makes sense to me that after the first year was terrible, Fitzgerald gave him one more year because thats what normal people do. It was fair. After history repeated itself, Fitz had to fire JON - and did. Yes, it was a mistake to hire JON - probably the biggest mistake of Fitzgerald's career.
 
Schill and Gragg are an embarrassment for sure, but the root cause of that embarrassment is a blind football CEO and some deviant football players. When corporations clean house for scandal they usually fire the offending employees and their managers. It’s the professional response.
 
Schill and Gragg are an embarrassment for sure, but the root cause of that embarrassment is a blind football CEO and some deviant football players. When corporations clean house for scandal they usually fire the offending employees and their managers. It’s the professional response.
What about the perpetrators? The fact that Fitz is the only coach to be fired and no players suspended/expelled is a huge red flag.
 
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What about the perpetrators? The fact that Fitz is the only coach to be fired and no players suspended/expelled is a huge red flag.
Their day will come. Wheels of justice grind slowly. I expect names will be named at some point. The question will be whether legal or university disciplinary repercussions hit first.
 
With JON specifically, it makes sense to me that after the first year was terrible, Fitzgerald gave him one more year because thats what normal people do. It was fair. After history repeated itself, Fitz had to fire JON - and did. Yes, it was a mistake to hire JON - probably the biggest mistake of Fitzgerald's career.
Ok - that responds to the first part of the first paragraph. Leaves plenty of good reason.
 
I have an idea, how about a 2:1 trade? Schill & Gragg for Fitz. NU buys out contracts for Schill and Gragg and reinstates Fitz under his old contract. Then we hire a competent President and and a competent AD. Problem solved-we get Fitz back, we upgrade two key administrative positions and NU is money ahead!
That just makes too much cents.
 
Ok - that responds to the first part of the first paragraph. Leaves plenty of good reason.
I didn't respond to your statements that Fitzgerald

a) failed as the face of the university
b) failed to run a clean program

Because had Schill not acted like an idiot we wouldn't be arguing about it - and I know I won't change your mind.

To me, Fitzgerald WAS the face of the university and represented it well. Only Schill wrecked that - at least for the time being.

And the program was highly regarded, with recent questions about the won/loss record.
 
I didn't respond to your statements that Fitzgerald

a) failed as the face of the university
b) failed to run a clean program

Because had Schill not acted like an idiot we wouldn't be arguing about it - and I know I won't change your mind.

To me, Fitzgerald WAS the face of the university and represented it well. Only Schill wrecked that - at least for the time being.

And the program was highly regarded, with recent questions about the won/loss record.
Really? In the recent years, his approach to media has been the face you want to be that of the university? Seriously?

And regardless of schill, I would have called for dismissing PF because he had become a bad coach performance wise and the only justification for keeping him was the whole cleanest program in the country.

So, if that’s not true as the report said it wasn’t, then he should be gone on performance alone. Everything else is insult to injury.

S & G are terrible. But PF and his Enablers set the table to ruin his legacy a long time before they arrived.
 
And regardless of schill, I would have called for dismissing PF because he had become a bad coach performance wise and the only justification for keeping him was the whole cleanest program in the country.

So, if that’s not true as the report said it wasn’t, then he should be gone on performance alone. Everything else is insult to injury.
Buy out his contract if it's about performance.
 
Buy out his contract if it's about performance.
Ok - I’m down w that too. Quite frankly, I’m thinking there may not be a lawsuit from fitz. Again, the discovery process can be unkind. If I was NU, I would start deposing players on every roster. Penalty of perjury is a thing. If a few high level guys take the fifth or worse….

Those two student managers spoke volumes. If these two ladies, never in the locker room, knew and said it was well known… well… believe what you want to believe to sleep at night.

He’s not coming back and hasn’t filed a damn thing yet to ‘clear his name’…. (Btw…over / under on point in time the Enablers start defending his decision not to sue to clear his name as another act of martyrdom? I say end of year.)
 
Those two student managers spoke volumes. If these two ladies, never in the locker room, knew and said it was well known… well… believe what you want to believe to sleep at night.
They wouldn't give me a straight answer on whether they knew the players dry-humped each other. I asked them directly, multiple times, and they would not answer. So I don't really know what exactly they knew, because they wouldn't tell me.
 
...And regardless of schill, I would have called for dismissing PF because he had become a bad coach performance wise and the only justification for keeping him was the whole cleanest program in the country...
This is nonsense. To dimiss the previous 15 years of what Fitz brought to this program and base everything on the last two years is the height of ignorance.

Yes, he screwed up the last two years. Hiring JON was probably the biggest mistake he could have made. And yes, he should have corrected it after the first year and not wait for the second one.

But he did get it done and hired what we hope now is going to be an excellent coach. Time will tell, but Fitz did take corrective action. It's two bad people like you are willing to forget the majority of his tenure and just base everything on the last two years.
 
This is nonsense. To dimiss the previous 15 years of what Fitz brought to this program and base everything on the last two years is the height of ignorance.

Yes, he screwed up the last two years. Hiring JON was probably the biggest mistake he could have made. And yes, he should have corrected it after the first year and not wait for the second one.

But he did get it done and hired what we hope now is going to be an excellent coach. Time will tell, but Fitz did take corrective action. It's two bad people like you are willing to forget the majority of his tenure and just base everything on the last two years.
Actually three of the last four and this wasn’t looking good for this year. Again, either performance or cleanest program. He offered neither.
 
Ok - I’m down w that too. Quite frankly, I’m thinking there may not be a lawsuit from fitz. Again, the discovery process can be unkind. If I was NU, I would start deposing players on every roster. Penalty of perjury is a thing. If a few high level guys take the fifth or worse….

Those two student managers spoke volumes. If these two ladies, never in the locker room, knew and said it was well known… well… believe what you want to believe to sleep at night.
As a point of reference... When Joan Esposito filed a lawsuit against Eddie and Jobo and their network it was filed by Webb 6 months and multiple further stupid statements later by them despite it being well known that she had retained Webb. Time is in Fitz's favor here... The coaching carousel resumes in the winter. Webb may be waiting to secure damages. Also, the ebb and flow of the media narrative favors time
 
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After 15 years with Fitzgerald as head coach, NU had gone to 10 bowl games (and won 5).

Then Hankwitz retired, Fitzgerald hired the wrong guy and NU's record in the Big Ten went from 63-60 to 65-76.

Anybody who considers that a fail is filled with crazy expectations.

The reputational damage was inflicted by Schill.. Most people aren't that gullible.
We won 3 B1G titles over a span of 6 years before Fitz. In 17 years we had zero B1G titles, despite him saying that was our goal every year. We had some good defenses, shitty offenses, and once Hank retired, we were shitty on both sides of the ball. 4-20 in our last two years. I’d say it was a fail. And no the expectations were not too high. Effing 4-20. 110’s ranked offenses and defenses. Big fat F.
 
This is nonsense. To dimiss the previous 15 years of what Fitz brought to this program and base everything on the last two years is the height of ignorance.

Yes, he screwed up the last two years. Hiring JON was probably the biggest mistake he could have made. And yes, he should have corrected it after the first year and not wait for the second one.

But he did get it done and hired what we hope now is going to be an excellent coach. Time will tell, but Fitz did take corrective action. It's two bad people like you are willing to forget the majority of his tenure and just base everything on the last two years.
Don’t worry Bob was calling for Collins head for years. Pretty sure he’ll be doing it again with Collins as soon as NU isn’t contending for the B1G.
 
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