Baldwin
- Thread starter Dukeboy
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Dad's job at UWM may hang in the balance. He's had a tough three years there. Lots of pressure on Junior.
Is Pat Sr. doing the right thing here? Serious question. If he wasn't the head ball coach Pat Sr. the father would never steer his son to Milwaukee. Pat Sr. the father would want his kid to go to either Duke or NU. Other schools would be in the mix, but with the high academic backgrounds of Mom and Dad, and their son's athletic options, Milwaukee's e-mails and letters at the beginning of the process would never have been opened. Pat Jr. isn't going to save anybody's job. And nothing good can come from placing Pat Jr. in the cross hairs of his father's career.
I have told each of my 4 children to never do business with family. This could easily turn out to be a great test of the wisdom of that advice...IMHO. Indeed, I don't think I could ever forgive myself for letting my elite hoops son come play for me in Milwaukee. I just don't see how there would be any winners in the family. The real work of Pat Sr. the father is nearly complete. He needs to let his son go fly on his own. Create his own path as his father does the same.
GOUNUII
IMO, worst case scenario is that he has a crappy experience at UWM, goes pro after a year and is a top 10 pick.
That last part is the same wherever he goes.
From the comment about the conference, it reads as though his preference is to play a Power 5 schedule.
Whatever he does and wherever he does it, it's likely he can always return to Evanston to finish up his NU degree...even with a first year somewhere else.
I would totally respect if he plays for his dad, but I also hope that his dad isn’t hard-selling him. Presumably, next year will be the only chance he’s ever had to play for his dad.
One of the greatest moments in the last decade of the NCAA Tourney was RJ Hunter’s game-winner for #14 Ga St., and his head coach/dad’s subsequent injury from celebration.
RJ was a first-round bust, but still a first rounder. (He wasn’t, however, highly ranked out of high school.)
One of the greatest moments in the last decade of the NCAA Tourney was RJ Hunter’s game-winner for #14 Ga St., and his head coach/dad’s subsequent injury from celebration.
RJ was a first-round bust, but still a first rounder. (He wasn’t, however, highly ranked out of high school.)
there is zero way to know this without knowing their relationship. also something to be said for the last time to be around his dad before his "adult" life begins. i imagine coaches don't see their kids often as it is, so maybe they both want to be around each other before the "pro" journey
I think you’re missing the mark here big time. I don’t care how close they are or how cool it might seem to spend a year together. Devoted fathers of gifted kids with great opportunities don’t recruit their kids to Milwaukee.
Now if you have a son who needs a year under the day-to-day supervision of their father, because they are otherwise “at risk,” that’s one thing. But that doesn’t appear to be the case here.
GOUNUII
Man, you have some bad takes. If the kid wants a
Chance to play for his dad, who
The hell are you to tell him it’s a bad idea?
Glad he has a close relationship with his dad. I hope he still comes to NU.
You make a fool of yourself on a daily basis on these boards. And you’ve done it again. Congratulations. When you can spot the issue come on back. Hint. It has nothing to do with Jr’s decisions or me telling Jr. what to do.
GOUNUII
Ok tough guy. Your original posts make some very assumptions that you have absolutely no knowledge of. As in zero. I’ll leave it at that.
SR wouldn't be doing his job if he wasn't recruiting JR.
At the same time, I'll bet he is letting his son make his own decision, and as a parent, has told JR to not take into account his job security.
But from everything have read about them, they have a tight family bond and as a good and bright kid, likely wants to help his father out (even if told not to take that into consideration).
Also, w/ their busy schedules - likely don't see too much of each other, so this would be their last chance to spend quality family time before JR heads off to the NBA.
On the plus side, this may give NU the edge over Dook.
Close enough for mom and other family members to make home games, and maybe even SR every once in a while when his schedule allows for it.
At the same time, I'll bet he is letting his son make his own decision, and as a parent, has told JR to not take into account his job security.
But from everything have read about them, they have a tight family bond and as a good and bright kid, likely wants to help his father out (even if told not to take that into consideration).
Also, w/ their busy schedules - likely don't see too much of each other, so this would be their last chance to spend quality family time before JR heads off to the NBA.
On the plus side, this may give NU the edge over Dook.
Close enough for mom and other family members to make home games, and maybe even SR every once in a while when his schedule allows for it.
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Lol What does it matter what school he goes to? PBJ won't stay anywhere long enough to graduate. He'd have to have a freak injury that ends his career in his freshman season for academics to come into play -- and at that point he can transfer wherever his grades take him and dad can pay for it.
Do you know the family personally?
I ask because this is quite a bit of conjecture off of a single column from a journalist, who while reputable, isn’t necessarily heavily plugged into the recruiting circuit.
Pretty unfair to the elder Baldwin.
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GOU is a father of four successful children.
All GOUNUII said is a smart father should want what's best for his son, like playing in a tougher league for better development, and not the other way around. Borrowing from science, it's an evolutionarily sound strategy and common sense. If the son wants to play for the father, fine but it may not be what's best for his career and his father should at least tell him that. Isn't that obvious?
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I feel kinda bad even saying this because I don't want to speak it into existence, but the worst case scenario is that he has a career ending injury during his one and done year. If that happened to my kid I'd much rather it happen at NU or Duke than UWM
As others have said, the assumptionS GONU is making are gargantuan. He has no idea what’s going on with him and his family. Maybe what’s best for everyone is to play for his dad. That’s really not an outrageous suggestion. Underwood and Mccaffrey both coach their sons.
also, father of 4 successful kids? Good for him but who gives a sh!t?
My original post framed the issue as a question. Focusing on Pat Sr. Is he doing the right thing recruiting his son to Milwaukee? I framed it as a question to spark debate knowing there is no clear cut right answer.
It’s an interesting question to me. One that doesn’t require any assumptions. I laid out my arguments. They are all based on analogous family experiences and a career long history in professional sports. They do not speak to the idiosyncrasies of the Baldwin family. But they do speak to legitimate concerns relevant to how parents should deal with the complex but welcome challenges of guiding a gifted child with lots of options. Many of which pit family considerations at odds with other, more objectively appealing options ... if only it were simple. It rarely is.
GOUNUII
It may be Baldwin Sr would like to keep his son close to him because he knows the many potentially negative influences in and around college basketball (agents, money guys, shoe companies, playing a kid while hurt to win games etc...). Maybe he feels that this is what is best for his son since he knows the landscape of college bball better than anyone.
Two things...and not being argumentative...
* If I had a bad injury, prefer that happen around family;
* I think wherever Pat Jr. starts, he finishes his degree and the diploma has "Northwestern" on it...I'd bet money on that.
I really want to see PBJr at NU for at least one year, but this is exactly the kind of thing many fans of many teams would say about Northwestern.
I think his point was that going to NU as a big-time basketball prospect would be a waste. I agree that many fans would probably think that. We would all defend why that isn't true, but I certainly understand the perception.
That all said, I see nothing wrong with your original post. I agree with you. In a generic scenario, if my kid had a chance to get a free ride to one of the top schools in the country or my own home school where I work, I would want my kid to reach for the best. I don't think its an unreasonable position. There may be specific reasons why that wouldn't be true for everyone, including the Baldwins. But you were just sharing a reasonable opinion on an internet message board that can then be debated. Not sure why the debate had to turn heated.
I think we all struggle having discussions with each other when we can't see faces or hear tone of voice. Maybe we need Rivals to move into the Covid19 era where we Zoom conference these boards!
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So true, gets the best of both worlds at Northwestern.
Reasonable debates of legitimate topics turning heated is unfortunately the norm today. I'm sure it's largely a function of how the internet has become a primary source of communication. But there are other reasons. How many of us have pent up social and economic frustrations related to the pandemic? Pent up political frustrations related to our poisonous political and media climate? Heaped on top of the normal, day-to-day challenges we face under the best of circumstances.
The digital, social media and internet age has created what I call the instant impact phenomenon. Too many opinions are formed and shared based on quick, instant impact expectations. Speed at the expense of thoughtful accuracy. Being right at the expense of getting it right.
I offer curdog's first post and the multiple likes he received as evidence of this phenomenon.
GOUNUII
You asked for his qualifications. I think they're significant. He offered up a good argument in the form of a rhetorical question...then you went into full-dick mode.
Maybe I want to keep GOUNUII for myself to hammer away on.
You asked for his qualifications. I think they're significant. He offered up a good argument in the form of a rhetorical question...then you went into full-dick mode.
Maybe I want to keep GOUNUII for myself to hammer away on.
Have at it Glades.
GOUNUII
half page article on the Baldwin household today's Chicago tribune. Sr., yes he's indeed recruiting his son but must abide by NCAA recruiting restrictions. In fact recruiting phone call had dad upstairs and Jr. downstairs, with mom. It does note that UW-Milwaukee is in the lead. It also mention NU, Duke, Michigan , Georgetown and North Carolina are recruiting him. Said the Duke visit included a great game but also had a lot of good things about NU. In fact he said he liked watching the recruiting tape of recent Wildcat recruit Roper and admitted that the Horizon League was a bit of a drawback. He also added that he has little desire to go pro and skip college. Still sounds like NU is in it and if Dad was still at NU, I'd think they would be a lock. Oh and he plans to decide in October or November.
Thank you Willy for adding actual content to the thread. It's very helpful.
I find it disappointing that anyone would cast judgement on Baldwin Sr. (a decorated NU alumnus!) for recruiting his son. Weird times.
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He came off like a typical pompous NU fan (wouldn’t deign to open a recruiting letter from UWM). I called him out. Then you went off the reservation taklking about his kids. I’m sorry if my response triggered you. Find a safe space.You asked for his qualifications. I think they're significant. He offered up a good argument in the form of a rhetorical question...then you went into full-dick mode.
Maybe I want to keep GOUNUII for myself to hammer away on.
If my kid had a choice between playing for me, Coach K or Chris Collins, I’d send him to Duke without hesitation. But if still wanted to play for me, that’d be way cool too.
But you seem to be ignoring that both parents went to NU, Sr. coached there and Jr. spent a lot of his young life at W-R.
Not angry. Just clapping back at someone who called me a dick (effectively).
You didn't call anybody out. But go ahead. Give yourself chest pumping credit for nothing. Just like Trump.
GOUNUII
Why? I'm having fun hammering on your inconsiderate ass. You asked for his qualifications after failing to see his point (which was COMMON SENSE). I know GOUNUII and he's a very competent and considerate person. You? ???
I'm well aware of NU alum pomposity. I went to an NU alumni gathering in 2005 to hear Mark Murphy speak and enjoyed NU alums constantly telling me how much money they made through the deals they were involved with. When they asked me what I do...blank stares. They had to go refresh their drinks and find someone else to boast to. It totally sucked until I met FloridAlum for the first time. He turned out to be Morey Amsterdam and saved the day.
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