Brown is gone

[NUCat320]

Brown's "huge numbers on a bad team" reports his entire senior season had the opposite effect on me as Mc's "huge numbers leading a team to a state title" reports had two years prior. (Needless to say, I'm happy with the reports on Lathon.)

Brown is a unique and talented player. He'll score some points somewhere, but he needs to sloooowwwww down.

I wish he had been given clearer direction last spring, so that this could have happened a year earlier. (That said, perhaps Ash simply developed last summer to earn the time - and the inevitability of a transfer wasn't really recognized until September.) It was clear within the first five or so games this season that Brown was not in the long-term plan.

 

[NJCat]

Fish, meet bait.

Hook, line and sinker...

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

OMG! Coach Walkerfan enlightens us all at last.

Congrats to IB on his decision to transfer. Obviously, the coaching staff knew that decision for months shown by their refusal to give minutes to a more talented guard than a less talented player. He played a key role in NU’s history making season 2 years ago. I will always remember his key plays made in beating OSU in Columbus since the 1970s and the tight win over Rutgers where Doug Collins’ face went through all sorts of contortions.

Too bad NU’s coaching staff could not have harnessed his playmaking ability. That is what makes great coaches (John Beilein) and Collins and his staff are not there yet.

Now we rely on a true freshman to lead a very talented team because his backup is not a PG. We shall see what happens but hopefully we recruit a 5th year graduate transfer to be an able backup PG.

 

[NJCat]

OMG! Coach Walkerfan enlightens us all at last.

Dang it!!

 

[Walker Fan]

For the poster who has set the record for the most posts but brings nothing to the table. Ash is not a PG. He does nothing for the offense in that he creates nothing for his teammates. He simply handed the ball off to Lindsey and would retreat to the corner and if no one guarded him might hit a 3 pointer once every four shots. On defense, he would play with his hands and get beaten. Once in awhile he would gets his hands on a ball on defense, but that does not make a good defender. Ash could not even start on his high school team as a PG because his coach, Gene Pingatore, who knows something about PGs who coached Isiah Thomas and numerous other high caliber PGs did not use him as a starting PG on his high school team. He would not start as PG in the MAC or MVC let alone play PG in the Big 10. I love the ignore function because I can avoid most of this drivel.

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

For the poster who has set the record for the most posts but brings nothing to the table. Ash is not a PG. He does nothing for the offense in that he creates nothing for his teammates. He simply handed the ball off to Lindsey and would retreat to the corner and if no one guarded him might hit a 3 pointer once every four shots. On defense, he would play with his hands and get beaten. Once in awhile he would gets his hands on a ball on defense, but that does not make a good defender. Ash could not even start on his high school team as a PG because his coach, Gene Pingatore, who knows something about PGs who coached Isiah Thomas and numerous other high caliber PGs did not use him as a starting PG on his high school team. He would not start as PG in the MAC or MVC let alone play PG in the Big 10. I love the ignore function because I can avoid most of this drivel.

Dang!

 

[willycat]

For the poster who has set the record for the most posts but brings nothing to the table. Ash is not a PG. He does nothing for the offense in that he creates nothing for his teammates. He simply handed the ball off to Lindsey and would retreat to the corner and if no one guarded him might hit a 3 pointer once every four shots. On defense, he would play with his hands and get beaten. Once in awhile he would gets his hands on a ball on defense, but that does not make a good defender. Ash could not even start on his high school team as a PG because his coach, Gene Pingatore, who knows something about PGs who coached Isiah Thomas and numerous other high caliber PGs did not use him as a starting PG on his high school team. He would not start as PG in the MAC or MVC let alone play PG in the Big 10. I love the ignore function because I can avoid most of this drivel.

Think that's a little harsh, since I think he helps out in short spurts as a combo guard. He was the only option last season at the point, after Mac and might be again if NU doesn't bring in a grad transfer.

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

We need a faster,stronger,better shooting version of BMac! Can we find a guard like that who won't turn pro after two years?

 

[willycat]

Pitt has a grad transfer prospect, Ryan Luther, who is attracting interest. Believe he is a post-type player.

Remember someone kept us up to date on potential grad transfers last off season and hope they do it again. I know that poster got some criticism, mostly unjust but I found the information interesting. So who are they?

 

[NJCat]

Can we find a guard like that who won't turn pro after two years?

I guess that counts Lathon out......too bad, he's bigger, stronger and faster than BMac but.....

 

[hoosboot]

For the poster who has set the record for the most posts but brings nothing to the table. Ash is not a PG. He does nothing for the offense in that he creates nothing for his teammates. He simply handed the ball off to Lindsey and would retreat to the corner and if no one guarded him might hit a 3 pointer once every four shots. On defense, he would play with his hands and get beaten. Once in awhile he would gets his hands on a ball on defense, but that does not make a good defender. Ash could not even start on his high school team as a PG because his coach, Gene Pingatore, who knows something about PGs who coached Isiah Thomas and numerous other high caliber PGs did not use him as a starting PG on his high school team. He would not start as PG in the MAC or MVC let alone play PG in the Big 10. I love the ignore function because I can avoid most of this drivel.

You and willy should grab lunch. You'll be fast friends.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

You and willy should grab lunch. You'll be fast friends.

This isn't Walker Fan's fault, it's Wrestler's fault for beating the hell out of the dead horse that is Jordan Ash. Wrestler has made many of us root against Ash just in spite of Wrestler

 

[willycat]

You and willy should grab lunch. You'll be fast friends.

13 scholarships, use them all!

 

[purplejustice]

Grad transfer is a must. An injury to Lathon or Nash would leave us exposed. We also do not want a five member freshman class. Better to keep the classes balanced if possible. Will miss IB. He was one of the few players who could create on offense.

 

[NJCat]

Wrestler has made many of us root against Ash just in spite of Wrestler

If you rooted against Jordan because of wrassler, you need help. Taking anything seriously written on these dopey message boards is a mistake.

 

[hdhntr1]

Agree with you on this one. I know a hell of a lot less about basketball than CCC, but to me IB is a classic (Tre Demps style) 2-guard. Expecting him to play point would have been nutso.

But smaller so he really didn't fit.

 

[hdhntr1]

Tre had a four-year career here and led several huge, unforgettable wins. I agree that IB was cut from Tre’s cloth, though he wasn’t close to the same level of jump shooter. I’m just still confused about why he couldn’t have been the same guy as last year, a bench player who could turn 4-5 games in a season with a hot streak. How did he regress to the point of being unplayable? The discussion only matters now because in CC’s tenure, he’s developed only one Big Ten caliber PG. That‘s a bigger black mark on his tenure than the five-year record comparisons that were being floated earlier.

He wasn't hitting his shots and without that, no minutes. Basically at 6'2" (if he was really that tall which I doubt) the only position on this team he could fill a role on a regular basis was at PG.

As far as how many PGs CCC has developed, I don't see this as the black mark you do. You can argue that he was not able to recruit a good enough backup but it is more common than you think. You can't really really fault him on development as hard to make a silk purse out of a sows ear and the only PG candidates he had tp work with (you can blame him for this) were Ash and Brown. He may have felt he could do better with them as the role he is trying to fill is LG rather than PG but both had shortcomings. BMac was a four year starter. Top PGs are a funny bunch. They want playing time and when you have BMac getting those minutes, hard to convince another top PG recruit to come to sit on the bench. But as soon as BMac is going to be gone, in comes Lathon to be Lead Guard

 

[hdhntr1]

1) I have no clue what happened in the off season or practice. Maybe that's where the problems arose.

During the season, there was NO gametime evidence of a bad attitude. Quite the opposite considering how he was treated.

2) He was not the only player on this team playing his own game.

It could have been as simple as Brown might not have been willing or able to fill the role CCC needed him to fill.

 

[hdhntr1]

Or maybe two graduate transfers if Rap can not play due to repeated surgeries.

Next season, NU will have six or seven new players in Turner, Nance, Lathon, Kopp, Young, Rap (or someone new) and the player taking off IB’s spot. So NU will have a completely different team, chemistry and dynamic next season.

Maybe we will have someone in IBs spot. Don't know yet. Hopfully we will also have a healthy Falzon

 

[Max_Power]

It could have been as simple as Brown might not have been willing or able to fill the role CCC needed him to fill.

Here's the thing. Something broke between Brown and CCC bc prior to his freshman season, a person with much more knowledge about NU hoops then told me how excited CCC was about Brown. 15 months later and he's gone.

Brown is not 6'2. Closer to 5'11 maybe 6. My middle kid was visiting his brother in Bobb last year and walked into Brown in the hall. Told me they were about the same height. He was 5'10 or so at the time.

Finally, watching Brown play was really frustrating this season. At the beginning of the year we are told nothing is wrong but he is coming off an injury. Then we get the Illinois game where he saves NU from an embarrassing loss. Then he vanishes and then in limited minutes he seems tentative every time he touches the ball. What is so weird about it is to go back to the Vanderbilt game and watch how he ran the team when B-Mac was out bc fouls.

I hope he finds a great fit. I am sure I will hear someday what really went down but I hope it was more than CCC just ran him off.

 

[hdhntr1]

Here's the thing. Something broke between Brown and CCC bc prior to his freshman season, a person with much more knowledge about NU hoops then told me how excited CCC was about Brown. 15 months later and he's gone.

Brown is not 6'2. Closer to 5'11 maybe 6. My middle kid was visiting his brother in Bobb last year and walked into Brown in the hall. Told me they were about the same height. He was 5'10 or so at the time.

Finally, watching Brown play was really frustrating this season. At the beginning of the year we are told nothing is wrong but he is coming off an injury. Then we get the Illinois game where he saves NU from an embarrassing loss. Then he vanishes and then in limited minutes he seems tentative every time he touches the ball. What is so weird about it is to go back to the Vanderbilt game and watch how he ran the team when B-Mac was out bc fouls.

I hope he finds a great fit. I am sure I will hear someday what really went down but I hope it was more than CCC just ran him off.

At 5'11" hard to have a spot for him as a 2. Have to have him at PG. But it always seemed he was shoot first (OK for a 2 if the percentage is high enough but bad for a PG) He could have had a solid spot at backup PG but hard to give it when he continued to have the shoot first mentality

 

[chicagocatfan24]

If you rooted against Jordan because of wrassler, you need help. Taking anything seriously written on these dopey message boards is a mistake.

I embellished when I said that. I never actively rooted against the kid, and I doubt anyone on here did, but his less than stellar play was amplified and pointed out more solely because of Wrestler I feel like

 

[NJCat]

I spoke like Trump when I said that.

Fixed it for you.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

Fixed it for you.

Damn dude. Ya got me. Not sure how I'll recover from that one

 

[IGNORE2]

Tre had a four-year career here and led several huge, unforgettable wins. I agree that IB was cut from Tre’s cloth, though he wasn’t close to the same level of jump shooter. I’m just still confused about why he couldn’t have been the same guy as last year, a bench player who could turn 4-5 games in a season with a hot streak. How did he regress to the point of being unplayable? The discussion only matters now because in CC’s tenure, he’s developed only one Big Ten caliber PG. That‘s a bigger black mark on his tenure than the five-year record comparisons that were being floated earlier.

Well, at this point, CCC:

• Brought in a great deal of excitement
• Brought in a slew of highly ranked players
• BMac - Success
• Lindsey - More than expected, but disappointing by the end
• Skelly - More than expected
• Vassar - colossal failure in recruiting and handling
• Brown - failure
• NCAA Tournament Berth and a win in the dance

Far from the Savior yet. Lots of positive things but plenty of pimples and his in game coaching....well, I don't think it is his strength.

Looks like Pardon will be consider a success, I still withhold a GPA for Law and more talent inbound. His misses are pretty huge and the staff either needs to coach up players better or bring in even more top talent to overcome injuries and regression. I am not ready to jump off the CCC wagon but I am not driving it either. I think the next couple years, playing with his own recruits, will show us a lot about CCC.

 

[IGNORE2]

This isn't Walker Fan's fault, it's Wrestler's fault for beating the hell out of the dead horse that is Jordan Ash. Wrestler has made many of us root against Ash just in spite of Wrestler

Nah, Walker is a blowhard, know it all and has been proven to really know very little. And, we shall see how good IB at his next stop. Otherwise, I am sure Walker will blow hard some BS excuse about another dumb coach mishandling the next Micheal Jordan.

 

[NJCat]

another dumb coach mishandling the next Micheal Jordan.

The Moroccan Michael Jordan perhaps......

 

[MysticCat]

Well, at this point, CCC:

• Brought in a great deal of excitement
• Brought in a slew of highly ranked players
• BMac - Success
• Lindsey - More than expected, but disappointing by the end
• Skelly - More than expected
• Vassar - colossal failure in recruiting and handling
• Brown - failure
• NCAA Tournament Berth and a win in the dance

Far from the Savior yet. Lots of positive things but plenty of pimples and his in game coaching....well, I don't think it is his strength.

Looks like Pardon will be consider a success, I still withhold a GPA for Law and more talent inbound. His misses are pretty huge and the staff either needs to coach up players better or bring in even more top talent to overcome injuries and regression. I am not ready to jump off the CCC wagon but I am not driving it either. I think the next couple years, playing with his own recruits, will show us a lot about CCC.

5 years. 3, 10th places and one 9th.

We will suck again next year.

Let’s hope the arena changes things, since CC10P sometimes can’t remember to hand in the lineup card.

Maybe a few more DII schools to boost his resume.

Think about it: 5 years. 3 10th places and a 9th.

Wow.

 

[NJCat]

resume.

Think about it: 5 years. 3 10th places and a 9th.

Think about it: Collins wins in the NCAA Tournament, 1.

All other NU coaches: Zero.

Wow.

 

[Catreporter]

5 years. 3, 10th places and one 9th.

We will suck again next year.

Let’s hope the arena changes things, since CC10P sometimes can’t remember to hand in the lineup card.

Maybe a few more DII schools to boost his resume.

Think about it: 5 years. 3 10th places and a 9th.

Wow.

Hey Mystic, how many NU coaches are above .500 in our history? I'll wait for your answer. And your BS regarding one game vs. a local Div 2 team is tiring. I remember Carmody beating Wheaton College by A SINGLE POINT one year.

 

[NJCat]

Hey Mystic, how many NU coaches are above .500 in our history? I'll wait for your answer.

Do you know the answer?

Five.

Dennis Grady, 25-10 (1912-1914)
Fred Murphy, 28-24 (1914-1917)
Tom Robinson, 7-6 (1918-1919)
Dutch Lonborg, 236-203-1 (1927-1950)

and Chris Collins. Pretty big time gap between #3 and #4.

Trivia note: there have only been 24 coaches in NU's 114 year basketball history. So over 20% have winning records. Or looking at it another way, almost 80% have losing records. Dang!!!!

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

The grass is greener on the other side! Guys on here like walkerfan have very little idea of the talents of Jordan Ash. Ash is a physical specimen. Strong, fast, and doesn’t turn the ball over. Best defensive guy on the team and a true locker guy, who everyone likes for his unselfish play. I got news for you guys. No way is Lathon beating out a healthy Ash. Ain’t happening. Ash will take us to the final four.

 

[NJCat]

T No way is Lathon beating out a healthy Ash. Ain’t happening. Ash will take us to the final four.

Dang!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

 

[NUCat320]

Think about it: Collins wins in the NCAA Tournament, 1.

All other NU coaches: Zero.

Wow.

Seeing some other thread about how Nebraska or Penn State won a few games in the NIT only made obvious what I already knew: The NIT is utterly meaningless, and anyone who touts an NIT berth as an accomplishment is a loser destined for mediocrity in all pursuits.

(You didn't do this. But "five (or whatever) postseasons" is not an accomplishment if they're all in the Kiddie Tournament.)

And I loved BC! - but nothing compares to that weekend when NU was the biggest sports story in the country.

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

I certainly did not wish any I'll will towards Brown. I felt he had some talent,but needed coaching. I supported him staying as he knows our offense.

 

[NJCat]

I supported him staying as he knows our offense.

He may know it, but he didn't play it......

 

[curdog]

He may know it, but he didn't play it......

We had an offense? Are you counting Lindsey shooting a contested 3 as the shot clock expired as an offense?

 

[EagerFan]

Good luck Mr. Brown!

 

[Wrestlerneverdiesasacatfan]

Brown's "huge numbers on a bad team" reports his entire senior season had the opposite effect on me as Mc's "huge numbers leading a team to a state title" reports had two years prior. (Needless to say, I'm happy with the reports on Lathon.)

Brown is a unique and talented player. He'll score some points somewhere, but he needs to sloooowwwww down.

I wish he had been given clearer direction last spring, so that this could have happened a year earlier. (That said, perhaps Ash simply developed last summer to earn the time - and the inevitability of a transfer wasn't really recognized until September.) It was clear within the first five or so games this season that Brown was not in the long-term plan.

Huge numbers? You mean his .280 from three point land this year?

 

[NUCat320]

Huge numbers? You mean his .280 from three point land this year?

Reading comprehension, wrassler!

Huge numbers on a bad team in high school, his "senior season". Lots of points. Lots of losses.