Do you really think recruits didn’t know Collins was in a “win or leave” situation?
It’s a silly narrative. He had had double-digit losing streaks three straight seasons. Just one gets most veteran coaches fired.
Collins will be getting lots of calls
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It’s a silly narrative. He had had double-digit losing streaks three straight seasons. Just one gets most veteran coaches fired.
If we can get a pg who is more than half as good as Boo, sign me up!
I’m expecting Smith to take a big step forward next year, but we might also look for a transfer to replace Langborg.
It’s one thing to see the writing on the wall and a whole other thing to have it all but confirmed.
“I’ve got offers from dozens of regular NCAA qualifying teams. But I’m really interested in one that typically wins five conference games a season — and that’s a good run. Oh, but their AD just said that coach might get fired, which I would’ve never considered.”
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You’re ignoring that Bajakian was also an enormous mistake — arguably a bigger one which is crazy to think about — and one he didn’t fix.
Okay I agree it’s hard and he has done a great job… but if we aren’t going to get results then don’t pay him like a top 25 program coach — that’s where this discussion started.
In hoops if you can get just one legit guy you get a chance. It’s not easy but it’s possible. Very different than a sport like football. The other path — finding diamonds in the rough and developing — also works.
The next few years will be interesting.
But not a coach who took the team to the NCAAs in a historic moment after almost a century of futility. He is the greatest bball coach NU has ever had. Now he just got back to back trips (again, historical). They should literally name the court after him.
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More so a recruiting against tool (other schools coaches used to recruit against NU). Also a stopper from even taking a call from NU. Collins is a good recruiter and that prevented him from getting the chance with a couple recruits. It was not something that moved the needle of the near misses imo. Definitely something that prevented the initial process of at least two guys. (The statement combined with the losing causing uncertainty).
Recruiting has many factors, so I am not saying that this is the only thing that caused difficulties recruiting but I don’t think, unless you talked to recruits at the time, the impact of a statement confirming that coach recruiting you to be a part of his program might not be there when you get there hurt recruiting is fully realized on this board. Recruiting is a relationship game and like it or not most recruits commit to the coach not the school. So the school may as well commit to the coach publicly until it’s time to part ways. Commitable offers and the coaching staff are/were big/the main reasons why guys chose NU.
Realistically when will we see recruiting results from this run/CCC security/improved WR & atmosphere? Is Angelo considered part of it? Should we be expecting the 2025 class to be top 25? This offseason is the last time we can expect Ivy League Covid super seniors so we’ll likely need to eat what we kill from here out, so to speak.
We absolutely need a big to replace Preston. Another TVH type would be nice.
Agreed. Mentioned that in my initial post on the subject
BB will become the double double machine consistency. Mart will either avg 20 or be the another double double.
This is ridiculous. Collins will get another 2-3 year bump and get a salary that puts him in the top-5ish in the conference, and that will be that. He’s not leaving for another Big Ten job, he’s definitely not the kind of coach who would be a low-risk hire into the SEC, and he doesn’t fit the profile of your typical NBA target.
Northwestern is in the Big 2. Basically no chance that anyone outside the Big Ten or SEC can put together a financial package to lure him away from a comfortable position. Any discussion to the contrary is silly.
Northwestern is in the Big 2. Basically no chance that anyone outside the Big Ten or SEC can put together a financial package to lure him away from a comfortable position. Any discussion to the contrary is silly.
That’s because people that feel it didn’t impact ability to recruit have never been a recruit.
I don’t think the Big 2 applies to basketball. I’m sure the Big 12 and ACC have teams who would put together financial packages. Also, Vanderbilt may be a SEC team who would look at a coach like Collins.
It’s fine to speculate but why would Collins go to a place like Louisville or Vandy? He would have to start afresh.
I always admire optimism but it’s not just Buie. We need to replace Langborg as well. Those 2 guys have hit over 140 3’s this year, while shooting more than 40 percent. Berry will hopefully be back, but we were at our best when both he and Langborg were shooting well from 3. Having 2 guys that can come off screens and knock down 3’s was a huge advantage and opened up the court. Barnhizer can hit open 3’s and hopefully Martinelli will get better, but neither has shown the ability to do it when coming off screens. Somebody will need to get them open looks. We are winning this year mostly because we don’t turn the ball over, we have an All-American point guard and we are the best 3-point shooting team in the country. I think we will be competitive next year but it’s going to be really tough to grind out wins without more 3-point shooters.
Vandy is a disaster. They won’t be able to hire a sitting Big Ten coach to take that program and rebuild it. They can’t possibly put together the money it would take to make Collins or any other Big 2 school with resources take that risk.
Yes, there are a few ACC schools who could of course hire a sitting Big Ten or SEC coach (not sure about the Big12). But I think they’d be going after a Nate Oates type rather than someone like Collins.
If Collins didn't go anywhere last year, my guess is he's here for an even longer haul. After that great '22-'23 season and that garbage from Gragg, I wouldn't blame him a bit if he jumped. There were some pretty decent gigs available last year that would play into CC's wheel house - Cal, Georgia Tech (if he wanted to go back to the ACC), Stanford had all sorts of rumors.
There wasn't a single rumor about him. Not a sniff. He didn't seem to shop after the first tournament also. So I don't know why he would now. He seems to be married to the idea of NU as a long term winner. God love 'em!! It's what we need.
He also seems like a guy who truly wants some stability. It's one of the major selling points for NU. I wonder if the journey of his basketball partner-in-crime, Wojo, helped enhance that idea.
There's only a couple relationships that would make me think CC might go shopping:
a) I wonder what year his son is at NU. No need to answer. Could he stay for his son, then hit the road? I doubt it.
b) More importantly, I don't know anything about Gragg and Collins at all. I can't imagine that's a great working relationship. And, from afar, they don't seem like the greatest of bros. Did they say anything to each other during the seniors ceremony on Saturday? Always a comfortable distance. Yes, it's 100% speculation.
OTOH, I imagine that CC only needs to wait out the end of Gragg's tenure. The guy can't even schedule a secondary home for football games that he's known about for 1 1/2 years+.
There wasn't a single rumor about him. Not a sniff. He didn't seem to shop after the first tournament also. So I don't know why he would now. He seems to be married to the idea of NU as a long term winner. God love 'em!! It's what we need.
He also seems like a guy who truly wants some stability. It's one of the major selling points for NU. I wonder if the journey of his basketball partner-in-crime, Wojo, helped enhance that idea.
There's only a couple relationships that would make me think CC might go shopping:
a) I wonder what year his son is at NU. No need to answer. Could he stay for his son, then hit the road? I doubt it.
b) More importantly, I don't know anything about Gragg and Collins at all. I can't imagine that's a great working relationship. And, from afar, they don't seem like the greatest of bros. Did they say anything to each other during the seniors ceremony on Saturday? Always a comfortable distance. Yes, it's 100% speculation.
OTOH, I imagine that CC only needs to wait out the end of Gragg's tenure. The guy can't even schedule a secondary home for football games that he's known about for 1 1/2 years+.
I tried to keep track of that. I saw them close, but never even making eye contact. Having said this, I was too excited and failed to monitor the thin properly. My senses were overloaded by the energy in the place.
Collins took the school to the tournament for the first time ever. It was incredible.
But I also think that there is some collective misremembering of his performance as a whole.
Collin’s first 9 seasons (time here through the ultimatum):
Overall: 133-150 (.470)
Conference: 56-113 (.331)
1 NCAA, 0 NITs
2 20+ win seasons
Carmody’s last 9 seasons:
Overall: 139-146 (.488)
Conference: 49-107 (.314)
4 straight NITs, 0 NCAAs
2 20+ win seasons (and a 19)
And don’t forget, that’s including the tournament year. Up until this year his total body of work wasn’t an improvement outside of the (admittedly awesome) season and the tournament year looked like a huge fluke. He was 60-90 overall (.400) and 26-71 in conference (.268) in the 5 seasons following the tournament year.
He absolutely should have been viewed as on the hot seat.
You did not include last year, which is not fair. As I’ve said before, Gragg’s one conversation has little to no ability to influence the outcome of a developmental program like NU’s.
His body of work looked like a fluke to those not looking really closely. There was plenty of evidence to show how close we were to a very good team and how we improved since the year after the tourney. I won’t rehash two years’ worth of “discussions” on the board, but I’m not sure you were a part of those and there were at least a few saying he should not be on the hot seat.
Mot sure of the greatest but definitely on the list. We had some good performance in a couple of other periods but NCAA was not in existence, or only had 8 or 16 teams and the BIG had only one team that would get in, Best in last 50 years, no argument
Do you remember the worst part of the Carmody era? After he had had success with guys like Jitim, Hardy (ONeil recruits and Vedran plus some success with the dobermans, the program was in very bad shape winning a total of 3 BIG games in years 7 and 8. He was allowed to stay after that terrible 8th year and then built some consistency but with all that he still had a losing record and never had a winning record in the BIG. He really did not get any consistency until after that period. And he only had to deal with 16 or 18 BIG games per year and was able to puff up his performance with non con games playing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Carmody And for all his success and easier ooc games he still left 18 games below 500
He never had a winning record in the BIG and his 20 win seasons were generally built on OOC games
Bill Carmody - Wikipedia
Collins by contrast has had 4 20 win seasons including 21, 23 and 24 and even his 20 win season did not get him to NIT
Chris Collins (basketball) - Wikipedia
It was one thing for Gragg to have a private conversation with him. It was quite another to make things public. That is where he did real damage
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Everything this guy does backfires, ie Wisconsin at Lambeau
Braun, Collins, KAH and Tracey Fuchs should go to the Board of Trustees together and say they want that clown out of there. They have a ton of leverage right now.
Good Lord. Anyone that can’t see by now that CCC is the complete package as a Coach either isn’t looking or has a bias to support their silly call for his ouster two seasons ago.
For the record, I don’t think Carmody was a bad basketball Coach. However, he was a terrible recruiter that didn’t even put in the effort to try.
Look forward to the claims he sucks next year and only win because of number 0.
On point B, it is obvious their relationship sucks. Maybe CMBS can point us to a single Coach, Athlete or Athletics Administrator that believes the good Doctor is even remotely qualified?
I cannot believe that we are awaiting our second straight Big Ten Tournament with a double bye, with a guaranteed spot in the NCAA Tournament for the second straight year, with a unanimous all Big Ten player leading us into the Dance yet the makings of a deep, talented, veteran roster returning, in a state of the art arena that we are selling out and filling up for games against the likes of Minnesota, and this conversation is the busiest thread on this website?
Seriously?
Seriously?
I’d honestly be curious to know who in the athletic department actually HAS a good relationship with Gragg.
I think Coach K is the role model for Collins. He wants to build his own legacy at Northwestern.
Collins had 1 winning season in the Big Ten during that stretch — the tourney season. He also had one 8 win season and one 7 win. There’s a reason the other teams didn’t make the NIT.Do you remember the worst part of the Carmody era? After he had had success with guys like Jitim, Hardy (ONeil recruits and Veran plus some success with the dobermans, the program was in very bad shape winning a total of 3 BIG games in years 7 and 8. He was alloed to stay after that terrible 8th year and then built some consistenccy but with all that he still had a losing record and never had a winning record in the BIG. He really did not get any consistency until after that period. And he only had to deal with 16 or 18 BIG games per year and was able to puff up his performance with non con games playing https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bill_Carmody And for all his success and easier ooc games he still left
He never had a winning record in the BIG and his 20 win seasons were generally built on OOC games
Bill Carmody - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
Collins by contras has had 4 20 win seasons including 21, 23 and 24 and even his 20 win season did not get him to NIT
Chris Collins (basketball) - Wikipedia
It was one thing for Gragg to have a private conversation with him. It was quite another to make things public. That is where he did real damage
The body of work was not great.
I’m not talking about Gragg speaking publicly or privately — it would have been much better if it were in private. But anyone with a brain would look at the performance and see a single outlier season and a steep decline for several seasons thereafter.
Dude it’s The Rock. 4-5 high volume posters find a way to insert a combination of Schill, Gragg, or Fitz into every topic. It’s often extremely creative how they manage to shoehorn one or more of them in, and part of the reason I pay for premium access is to bear witness to their craft.
Please stop it. Collins improved the teams he inherited from Day 1. Look at the build-up in his record. Do you think, after 100 years of ineptitude, a coach who finally makes great progress and achieves the ultimate goal is not likely to fall back? He did, and then he built it back up again, better than ever.
What makes you think Collins can't get another transfer 3 pt shooter which is exactly what he did with Langborg just a year ago? Especially now since the program is even more attractive for a transfer after another great season?
At this point I trust Collins to figure out what he needs to make next years team as good as possible. With some nice pieces back he has earned the benefit of the doubt that he can figure out what they need and get it.
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