First time caller

[stpaulcat]

Yes. Some excellent background history of the Everglades and its neglect up to about the 1950s. I was disappointed that it didn't cover the current problems in the Everglades and south Florida, but that would probably require several more episodes.

What was remarkable to me when I moved there to work was just how little was known about invertebrates in the Everglades and south Florida in general for a State whose insects have been well studied. Many of the most common species there turned out to be new to science, including species that pass through the dry season in a dormant state and then emerge synchronously in huge numbers to serve as food for dispersing fish after rewetting.

Where do the fish go in the dry season?

 

[Gladeskat]

Where do the fish go in the dry season?

Into wading bird gullets, deeper water, or into underground caverns.

 

[stpaulcat]

I miss his diligence in pointing out all of my typos and misspellings, and also his cooler full of New Glarus Spotted Cow.

I remember "linky, linky...!"

 

[Gladeskat]

So they go into the wet muck at the bottom of ponds and go dormant too? I seem to remember that from high school science.

Nope. They literally go underground. The Everglades and much of south Florida is sitting on top of an old, porous coral reef that is riddled with underground channels and caverns. When water levels rise in the Miami area, it comes right up out of the ground. Consequently, there is little SoFla can do to prevent flooding from sea level rise.

When water levels decline during the dry season (November to May), fish and even alligators retreat into these caverns underneath the ground. It was amazing to peer through openings in the rocky ground and see large pools holding fish and even a 5-foot alligator and realize you're standing on a rock dome over water. One can climb into these caverns and stick one's head up through openings at the surface. It's a really amazing karst landscape in places. I always wanted to take a picture of my head and arms popping out of separate holes in the limestone bedrock, reading a college alumni magazine and sending it to them for publication.

When water levels rise in June, the fish pop up out of these caverns and feed on whatever they can find in the freshly inundated marsh. Fortunately for them, there are a few invertebrate species whose larvae are adapted to withstand desiccation and have HUGE synchronous emergences shortly after rewetting.

 

[Turk]

Yes. Some excellent background history of the Everglades and its neglect up to about the 1950s. I was disappointed that it didn't cover the current problems in the Everglades and south Florida, but that would probably require several more episodes.

What was remarkable to me when I moved there to work was just how little was known about invertebrates in the Everglades and south Florida in general for a State whose insects have been well studied. Many of the most common species there turned out to be new to science, including species that pass through the dry season in a dormant state and then emerge synchronously in huge numbers to serve as food for dispersing fish after rewetting.

as an aside, what is the current govt shutdown impact, if any, to the everglades? We know of the laid off federal workers, but haven't really been told if there is anyone still tending to the environment??

 

[Gladeskat]

as an aside, what is the current govt shutdown impact, if any, to the everglades? We know of the laid off federal workers, but haven't really been told if there is anyone still tending to the environment??

I don't know. I do know that all Park staff other than Rangers are off work, as well as all government biologists, hydrologists, etc. In reality, many take their work home with them, but stuff like monitoring and sampling will stop. This shutdown may create a pinch for lower GS-level Park staff.

IDK how this affects activities by the ACE or how much of the system is regulated by the South Florida Water Management District (state government). Most infrastructure and monitoring is run by the Water Management Districts, though that may have changed under Red Tide Rick Scott.

 

[sprinkler2]

I don't know. I do know that all Park staff other than Rangers are off work, as well as all government biologists, hydrologists, etc. In reality, many take their work home with them, but stuff like monitoring and sampling will stop. This shutdown may create a pinch for lower GS-level Park staff.

IDK how this affects activities by the ACE or how much of the system is regulated by the South Florida Water Management District (state government).

Glades - at the risk of taking this way off topic, I'd be curious to get your thoughts on red tide, Lake Okeechobee and the glades. We spend time on the west coast and the red tide was unbelievable this past summer. Fish kill was massive and tourism could die as well if that happens again.

 

[stpaulcat]

as an aside, what is the current govt shutdown impact, if any, to the everglades? We know of the laid off federal workers, but haven't really been told if there is anyone still tending to the environment??

They don't have any federal workers to feed to the piranhas?

 

[Gladeskat]

Glades - at the risk of taking this way off topic, I'd be curious to get your thoughts on red tide, Lake Okeechobee and the glades. We spend time on the west coast and the red tide was unbelievable this past summer. Fish kill was massive and tourism could die as well if that happens again.

The red tides are a naturally occurring event that have become exacerbated by nutrient runoff from the Kissimmee R/Lake Okeechobee watershed. These red tides are becoming more extensive and longer lasting.

There are two distinct though connected toxic bloom problems in Florida. 1) large toxic blue green algal blooms in Lake Okeechobee from ag runoff into the Kissimmee River. These toxic blooms are released to downstream coastal estuaries, and 2) the red tides you're seeing along the Gulf coast that are killing everything from minnows to whale sharks. The Okeechobee nutrient/BGA problem is thought to contribute nutrients that enhance red tide blooms. Both blooms are killing fish either via toxins, oxygen depletion or both. Pretty much there are lots of dead animals and even sick people from Lake Okeechobee all the way into the Gulf and to Atlantic coast estuaries. That's aside from runoff problems affecting the Everglades.

Florida has to realize that you cannot have agriculture, or at least not fertilizer-intensive crops like sugar cane, in the Everglades watershed. The system is too sensitive to nutrient enrichment. Until Florida realizes this and does something major about it, then the problem will just get worse and worse. Yes, tourism will suffer big time. It already is. You're complaining about it.

 

[sprinkler2]

The red tides are a naturally occurring event that have become exacerbated by nutrient runoff from the Kissimmee R/Lake Okeechobee watershed. These red tides are becoming more extensive and longer lasting.

There are two distinct though connected toxic bloom problems in Florida. 1) large toxic blue green algal blooms in Lake Okeechobee from ag runoff into the Kissimmee River. These toxic blooms are released to downstream coastal estuaries, and 2) the red tides you're seeing along the Gulf coast that are killing everything from minnows to whale sharks. Both blooms are killing fish either via toxins, oxygen depletion or both. Pretty much there are lots of dead animals and even sick people from Lake Okeechobee all the way into the Gulf and to Atlantic coast estuaries. That's aside from runoff problems affecting the Everglades.

Florida has to realize that you cannot have agriculture, or at least not fertilizer-intensive crops like sugar cane, in the Everglades watershed. The system is too sensitive to nutrient enrichment. Until Florida realizes this and does something major about it, then the problem will just get worse and worse. Yes, tourism will suffer big time. It already is.

Thanks for the response. Confirms the research I've done. Now I have to figure out how to get local and state officials to do something about the problem.

 

[IGNORE]

Well, this may be it. Big time cut tomorrow - Windsurfing, I will let you know how I fare. I have paid for the bionic arm - so I'm hoping to tryout for the NU FB and BB teams after a year of rehab (and conditioning...). Catch ya all on the other side

 

[Gladeskat]

Well, this may be it. Big time cut tomorrow - Windsurfing, I will let you know how I fare. I have paid for the bionic arm - so I'm hoping to tryout for the NU FB and BB teams after a year of rehab (and conditioning...). Catch ya all on the other side

Well...good luck!

Oh and congrats on choosing/having the best board name on Rivals!

 

[NJCat]

Well, this may be it. Big time cut tomorrow - Windsurfing, I will let you know how I fare. I have paid for the bionic arm - so I'm hoping to tryout for the NU FB and BB teams after a year of rehab (and conditioning...). Catch ya all on the other side

Hope you have a quick rehab and are back to your old crotchety self soon.....

 

[Fiadhaich]

I don't know. I do know that all Park staff other than Rangers are off work, as well as all government biologists, hydrologists, etc. In reality, many take their work home with them, but stuff like monitoring and sampling will stop. This shutdown may create a pinch for lower GS-level Park staff.

IDK how this affects activities by the ACE or how much of the system is regulated by the South Florida Water Management District (state government). Most infrastructure and monitoring is run by the Water Management Districts, though that may have changed under Red Tide Rick Scott.

Is 41 a picturesque drive to Miami or is 75 better?

 

[Gladeskat]

Is 41 a picturesque drive to Miami or is 75 better?

Tamiami Trail (41) is a much more scenic drive with places to stop and see/buy stuff. You should see hundreds of alligators along Tamiami Trail and pass by Miccosukee Indian villages. The Miccosukees were one of the most remote tribes in the US and maintained their culture well into the 20th century. They offer airboat rides to traditional village sites (probably now props) in the Everglades. They also run a casino these days at 41 and Krome Avenue. Numbering only 400 members, their lawsuit against the United States got the ball rolling for Everglades restoration.

Alligator Alley (75) is just a highspeed interstate highway.

 

[Fiadhaich]

Tamiami Trail (41) is a much more scenic drive with places to stop and see/buy stuff. You should see hundreds of alligators along Tamiami Trail and pass by Miccosukee Indian villages. The Miccosukees were one of the most remote tribes in the US and maintained their culture well into the 20th century.

Alligator Alley (75) is just a highspeed interstate highway.

Thanks

 

[Gladeskat]

Thanks

You're welcome. I'll also add that you will pass by the Shark Valley entrance to the Park on 41, which has tram rides to an observation tower over a pond stuffed with gators this time of year. Bugs won't be a problem this time of year unless you go near the coast.

Photographer Clyde Butcher, the "Ansel Adams of the Everglades", has a gallery along the road in Big Cypress that may be of interest if you like nice black & white landscape photography.

 

[stpaulcat]

The red tides are a naturally occurring event that have become exacerbated by nutrient runoff from the Kissimmee R/Lake Okeechobee watershed. These red tides are becoming more extensive and longer lasting.

There are two distinct though connected toxic bloom problems in Florida. 1) large toxic blue green algal blooms in Lake Okeechobee from ag runoff into the Kissimmee River. These toxic blooms are released to downstream coastal estuaries, and 2) the red tides you're seeing along the Gulf coast that are killing everything from minnows to whale sharks. The Okeechobee nutrient/BGA problem is thought to contribute nutrients that enhance red tide blooms. Both blooms are killing fish either via toxins, oxygen depletion or both. Pretty much there are lots of dead animals and even sick people from Lake Okeechobee all the way into the Gulf and to Atlantic coast estuaries. That's aside from runoff problems affecting the Everglades.

Florida has to realize that you cannot have agriculture, or at least not fertilizer-intensive crops like sugar cane, in the Everglades watershed. The system is too sensitive to nutrient enrichment. Until Florida realizes this and does something major about it, then the problem will just get worse and worse. Yes, tourism will suffer big time. It already is. You're complaining about it.

Now, THIS is a national (state) emergency.

 

[stpaulcat]

Well, this may be it. Big time cut tomorrow - Windsurfing, I will let you know how I fare. I have paid for the bionic arm - so I'm hoping to tryout for the NU FB and BB teams after a year of rehab (and conditioning...). Catch ya all on the other side

Take heart, I gave up my Olympic dream in my 60's.

 

[CatManTrue]

I believe in Sasquatch about 60% of the time.

Is getting tricked by a poster’s new handle this board’s version of getting RickRolled?

If so, should we call it getting BobRolled? It looks like a few folks fell for this clever new name.

I wish MidvaleDave still posted here.

Me too. Sadly, if someone started posting as MidvaleDave2 now we’d have no idea if it was really him or just another parody handle.

 

[stpaulcat]

Is getting tricked by a poster’s new handle this board’s version of getting RickRolled?

If so, should we call it getting BobRolled? It looks like a few folks fell for this clever new name.

Me too. Sadly, if someone started posting as MidvaleDave2 now we’d have no idea if it was really him or just another parody handle.

We've survived being Wickerturkrolled, I think we're up to this.

 

[No Chores]

Not Prosecutors, not Defendants (hopefully), not Litigators, not Jurists. May be Jurors. All are Witnesses (Hallelujah, Amen, Sing the Praise!)

Fayjick, hope all is well with you and Freda. Let me know if you're going to Stanford. (In the meantime, it's jurors man).

 

[Fiadhaich]

Fayjick, hope all is well with you and Freda. Let me know if you're going to Stanford. (In the meantime, it's jurors man).

Yes, we plan on going to Palo Alto. Can’t wait.

Regarding jurors, it’s hard to believe the word of a man whose profession loses half of all the court cases it tries, or ends with its jurors being hung.

 

[CatManTrue]

We've survived being Wickerturkrolled, I think we're up to this.

And it’s nothing compared to the WrasslerRolling that took place in the early Hankwitz years. He truly dominated the conversation(s).