I mean, there is still time, but to be in the company of Rick Taylor is not a good thing.
The end of the Collins era
- Thread starter MC_Cat
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Drop it. If the only times I take a two is when I can dunk the ball I am going to have a good FG%. You are not even remotely comparing apples to apples.
Can't really speak much for the Australian reality.
But in Europe:
- Sports are just as big, just extremely soccer focused
- Sports are not associated with academics. They are based on clubs. In basketball, some examples of the big clubs, sort of ordered by the quality of the national league:
-Greece - Olympiacos, Panatjinaikos, PAOK, AEK
-Turkey - Fenerbahce, Galatassaray, Efes
-Russia - CSKA, Lokomotiv, Zenit
-Italy - Bologna, Milano, Trieste, Treviso
-France - Cholet, Levallois, Limoges
-Germany - Bayern, Alba, Bonn, Ulm
-Israel - Maccabi, Hapoel
-Lithuania - Zalgiris
I would bet my house that Collins has implored Beran to get more involved, be more willing to shoot the ball and especially to try to get some points in the paint - put the ball on the floor and drive to the basket. Beran just doesn't do it. He has a difficult time finishing at the rim, so he shies away from it.
On the other hand, our offense doesn't seem to include post-up opportunities for anybody other than Young or Nance.
When I look at how Robbie Beran plays, I think small forward because he is too much of a finesse player to play power forward.
When I look at Pete Nance, I think power forward because he doesn't have the body to play center.
Of course, he was the reason we went to the rose bowl if you asked him. I roll my eyes every time I hear his name. I don’t like having this discussion and I want Dr Gragg to be successful.
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That's why US students currently rank 38th in math and 24th in Science in the world? And that is even with the influx and study ethics of Asians that have come in. Sorry but that is abysmal performance in two areas most required to be able to compete in the world. And that is with supposedly the best educational system. One way you get that is to be focused on the wrong things to teach
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He has a core group. Problem is that they have not gotten it doneThanks for this post. It’s demonstrates some reflection, and probably wasn’t fun for you to write
I think CCC’s biggest weakness as a coach is the way in which he deploys his players. It’s inconsistent and scattershot.
And that’s how we’ve had one game where Williams (more confident than he ever should be) and Greer (afraid to even have the ball) taking late threes. (I think it was Providence.)
Against Rutgers, a chance for the win, we ran a set play that resulted in Boo never touching it, in Beran passing up an open look, and in Audige chucking at the buzzer. That’s a case where you’ve literally got the last guy you want with the ball doing the last think you’d want him to do with it.
It just seems like CCC doesn’t have enough confidence to establish a core group and ride with them.
I, for one, would love a game where only six or seven guys got double figure minutes. I’d love to see Boo and Nance on the court for 34 minutes each. But it just never happens — and not because he’s pressing or attacking or tiring guys out — but just because he chooses to play worse guys more minutes.
I don’t care to look into it (maybe Cappy or PWB or Dugan could) but I’d imagine NU’s players’ mpg has the highest standard deviation in the conference.
While I agree with you that our performance in those rankings is appalling, I would argue that those are not the only important things to learn for a functioning society. I would also argue that teaching the "wrong things" is not what is holding us back in math and science.
Being in a science field and being married to a high school teacher, I have some thoughts on things that are wrong with our education system, but that is a long post and not for this thread. Here, we should probably focus on the wrong things being taught in our basketball program.
the main reasons are the teachers union and a broken public school funding system that drives massive inequality. Has nothing to do with wokeness - US primary schools have been bad since way before wokeness was a thing.
There are lots of problems and the main reasons are probably different in different districts. In my wife's district, I don't think the teachers union is an issue at all. The district administration, on the other hand....
Unless you are close to a public school teacher personally, I'm not sure if you can appreciate how miserable their lives are. Teaching kids in the classroom is sadly only about half the job. There is so much administrative crap dumped on teachers these days, it drains their energy and joy for actually... you know... teaching.
Lets assume Nance, Beran, Young, Buie and Audige is the core group?
Is Greer in there? Berry?
What percent of the available minutes have been played by lineups consisting solely of guys in the core group? It isn't a large number. Why is that? Is it possible Collins doesn't think much of the core group? Is there any way the players in the core group would react negatively to that?
No hate from me directed towards individual teachers. And it was probably overly simplistic for me to fingerpoint mainly the union. But I think the ecosystem created by the interplay between the union, administrators, and government has resulted in a broken system. Multiple chicken and egg problems in public education. Main point is that ‘wokeness’ isn’t the problem for this specific issue.
Here is the article I got it from
Education Rankings by Country 2023
worldpopulationreview.com
Here is the money quote
Ironically, despite the United States having the best-surveyed education system on the globe, U.S students consistently score lower in math and science than students from many other countries. According to a Business Insider report in 2018, the U.S. ranked 38th in math scores and 24th in science.
Just saying, not sure what they are teaching but sure not doing well teaching math and science
My point was that it was likely that someone from another culture would be able to succeed so it is reasonable to think that top players are more likely to be able to get into NU than much of the top talent in the US
It is extremely hard to teach students that don't want to learn or are dealing with so much crap in their life that focusing on learning is a challenge.
I also hate worrying about some stupid score to decide if we are doing well with students. Testing is a horrible motivator. I think our schools are not doing a very good job of making these topics resonate with students. Kids are rarely given a good explanation why they should learn something. Kids are just like us.... we learn about things that are interesting to us.
Kids have always had to deal with crap. In fact, they had to deal with more of it in the past, when true hardships were more common. Perhaps...perhaps...it has to do with how we deal with kids who complain of these things, or, more precisely, how we teach kids to deal with their stressors? The increasing push in K-12 public education is to turn schools into mental health treatment centers. I see it firsthand. And such therapeutic services is to be supervised by a physician. That's like a baseline requirement outside of education. Within education, it's almost unheard of. And I don't mean someone with a graduate degree in educational psychology. They are not physicians. Instead, we have people untrained to deal with treating mental health issues doing just that. Beyond that, when you offer these services, you invariably create demand for such services. One of the first costs is less time in class for those students.
The biggest thing that schools can offer students with disordered lives outside of school is stability and discipline, not mental health services. The connections that students form with teachers and coaches will almost always benefit them more than a relationship with any school counselor or undertrained mental health coordinator. In other words, maximize the amount of time that they can spend with adults in the education system who will be there for them day-in-and-day-out.
1. Most elite talent in BB can’t pass NU admissions.
2. Elite talent might not want a program that has gone to the big dance once in its history.
3. Elite talent with academic credentials has Duke, Georgetown, Stanford as options. They go to dance every year.
So he's like "You need to do your homework or I'm going to have to fail you"
And I'm like "Naahhaah, Maff be boring , bro!"
And I'm like "Naahhaah, Maff be boring , bro!"
Super interesting. I would have thought that the "money quote" in the article that you cite to support your opinion that lower math and science in U.S. scores are due to "wokeness being taught in schools" would have actually put the blame on "wokeness" instead of saying,
"Discussions about why the United States' education rankings have fallen by international standards over the past three decades frequently point out that government spending on education has failed to keep up with inflation."
Yup, the Chinese are known for sugar coating everything….
such BS - but ok, the country’s dominance couldn’t last forever…
Not really interested in living like the Chinese myself. Are you?
We have literally 30 years of research that demonstrates that the academic performance of students is not correlated to spending on education. In general, people are entirely ignorant about this and about what is spent on K-12 public education. In reality, high-poverty schools have higher per pupil revenue than low-poverty schools. Unfortunately, pathologies present in most of our high-poverty communities are embedded and education reform cannot address many of them. Sometimes there aren't solutions to problems, at least solutions that can be successfully undertaken by grand secular institutions. As Americans, we hate to have to accept this truth,
I'm not making the argument. hdhntr1 is. I'm just letting him know that the link he provided to back up his assertion doesn't back up his assertion...it contradicts it.
But congrats on the thoughtful rant board post tho.
You have a strange understanding of the word "rant."I'm not making the argument. hdhntr1 is. I'm just letting him know that the link he provided to back up his assertion doesn't back up his assertion...it contradicts it.
But congrats on the thoughtful rant board post tho.
But you seem like a real gem. Back to sports bro talk.
Having a bad day? Maybe you aren't familiar with the famous former "Rant Board" that this site had? The one where all political discourse was moved to so that the football board was about football and the basketball board was about basketball? I guess you don't like me complimenting you on what would have been a good and thoughtful post on that board? That post would have been. It was very thoughtful.
I do think you have a bad sense of "sports bro talk" though. My expeience is that it very rarely delves into whether the challenges of the American education system are due to teaching woke policies or education funding. It's usually just inadequately informed conversations about sports, but if your favorite sports talk show does education policy, send a link!
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Nope but interested in returning our educational results to exceeding theirs. Wonder what changed in the last 25 years…
So, I've spent several weeks in China and several weeks in India. Like 6 trips each country of a week each. Qualifier, all in very large cities. Tell me which is better. One country that is relatively clean, safe, citizens educated and relatively prosperous, crowded but manageable, amazing public transit, decent housing, but is a one party dictatorship that imprisons 10s of millions of people. The other country is the largest democracy in the world, but 90% of its citizens live in squalor, can't afford the basic necessities of life, and are in danger of personal/property crime. Public transport is laughable and traffic is unbearable. One of these countries has per capita GDP that is multiple X as much as the other, and has far less of an income distribution disparity.
I don't know the answer, but I do know that the answer isn't as obvious as people think it is.
India is nominally a democracy but has its own deeply problematic civil rights issues - see Kashmir for ex. Modi also isn’t exactly a virtuous pro-democracy liberal reformer.
At the end of the day, democracy isn’t something tangible that can feed your kids, it can’t provide you shelter, it can’t provide an education, it can’t protect you from crime. For most regular people, the choice as you’ve laid out would be pretty clear.
This thread is about the end of the Collins era?
Take your pick, China's Xi Jinping, India's Narendra Modi or Northwestern's Chris Collins?
Now that I think of it, coaching the Chinese national team might be a good gig for one of those 3.
Take your pick, China's Xi Jinping, India's Narendra Modi or Northwestern's Chris Collins?
Now that I think of it, coaching the Chinese national team might be a good gig for one of those 3.
The kicker though is that the group of students we're complaining about who can't attack a zone defense, clearly can do basic math or they wouldn't be here!
My comedic post got deleted??? Democracy goes on life support when comedians, the political conscious of any society, are muzzled. It also makes it much harder to suffer through another tourney miss!
The question was about recruits from different countries being able to get through NU admissions. I am just suggesting it is not as far fetched as people would think. We get the best from the US but in those areas the product of the US educational system is not that great so not hard to believe that the student athletes from many other countries are not as likely to find it impossible to compete. It would therefore be reasonable to think there might be some opportunities for us with overseas talent.
Fact is that in BB we have very little shot at elite US talent. Vast majority could not get through NU admissions and the ones that could have everyone going after them. For the overseas BB athlete, there is likely a bigger emphasis on education as there is less emphasis on going pro for the big money as there is here. And many of the school system may be better than the US system at preparing them. Coupled with the likelyhood that there are fewer programs going after them and just maybe there is an opportunity for us
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