Why was NU's running game so effective against Penn State?

[winnetkat]

One of the (other site) free Penn State boards has an interesting post about Penn State's defensive alignment during the game and why Northwestern's stretch run plays were so effective against them.

http://pennstate.247sports.com/Board/18/Contents/UFR-NW-running-attack-40971360

 

[SciCat]

One of the (other site) free Penn State boards has an interesting post about Penn State's defensive alignment during the game and why Northwestern's stretch run plays were so effective against them.

http://pennstate.247sports.com/Board/18/Contents/UFR-NW-running-attack-40971360

Wait a minute. What you're saying is that NUs coaches developed a game plan to take advantage of PSUs defense. I thought the consensus on this Board is that McCall sucks and the team won in spite of the coaches.

The analysis has to be wrong (sarcasm alert).

Thanks for posting.

 

[Hungry Jack]

Great read. Maybe McCall isn't as bad as some around here make out.

 

[Williesfan]

McCalls 247 handle in Gemrich

 

[Turk]

Great read. Maybe McCall isn't as bad as some around here make out.

McCall has called mostly lousy plans. Bottom line. That's the truth as he is mostly awful. That said, I acknowledged and gave him credit myself for two game plans/schemes as he finally pulled it out and figured things that this board has been telling him to consider for quite some time.
Two particular things.

1. Stop the nonsense of relying on WR that simply can't catch. He limited this by playing a lot of two TE sets, AND, having the TE's [Dickerson and Vitale] as the primary receivers or reads. This was great success. Why the hell did he refuse to count on G Dickerson for the first 6 games????

2. Against PSU, McCall finally pulled some OL [FINALLY] to the short side, AND lined up the superback Vitale on that side [sometimes he actually lined up BOTH TE"s on that side]. The result was that we had 6 blockers against 3 or 4 tacklers. We ran the play with Jackson RELIGIOUSLY to that side, even when PSU adjusted and KNEW it was coming....and kicked their ASS. Credit to McCall. Also credit to Vitale who had block after seal block time and again. In the first half, Mogus really blasted some holes, including at least 3 of Jackson's long gainers. Both him and Vitale. PSU was unprepared as I hadn't previously seen this formation from McCall. As I said, I gave McCall credit. I have no idea why he insisted upon tossing the pill to underperforming WR while not incorporating pulling OL or the TE's or the RB screens into the game plan. He did incorporate RB screens lately, even if they haven't produced, but I like them. I mean prior to PSU, McCall's running plays were Dive left, Dive right. No Nothing.

My gripe at this point is that he doesn't move the pocket at all. I've never seen such a stubborn OC that refuses to move the pocket. If you watched the PSU game film, we were eating Hack alive. However, on that one nice drive that changed everything, Franklin moved the pocket. Hack set up on the outside and it didn't take no more than a few minutes for a PSU TD. We need to do the same.

It's not a perfect world, yes, McCall isn't perfect. He needs to move the pocket and I'm not talking about a bootleg with no pulling OL. Oliver booted ONE TIME and got smashed due to poor scheming by McCall.

McCall isn't the best OC, so don't make him out to be superman just because he FINALLY did something the last two weeks.

 

[mikewebb68]

I mean prior to PSU, McCall's running plays were Dive left, Dive right. No Nothing.

OK, I've rewatched a lot of our season, multiple times. Am I missing all of these dive left, dive right plays? Or is Turk correct here?

 

[Aging Booster]

Great read. Maybe McCall isn't as bad as some around here make out.

I have stopped listening to the Cliff Clavens of this board many months ago. They have absolutely no credibility, posting incessantly about the same things for years, in effect contending that they know more about the game and how it should be coached than any of the professionals. One guy presumptuously "rates" the players every week, acting like a wannabe coach. I wish they did not add so much garbage to this board that we all must then avoid. If you are looking for reasoned arguments, such as that presented about game planning, to dissuade these people from their off-putting behaviors, you have much more confidence in their reasonableness than I.

 

[Hungry Jack]

I have stopped listening to the Cliff Clavens of this board many months ago. They have absolutely no credibility, posting incessantly about the same things for years, in effect contending that they know more about the game and how it should be coached than any of the professionals. One guy presumptuously "rates" the players every week, acting like a wannabe coach. I wish they did not add so much garbage to this board that we all must then avoid. If you are looking for reasoned arguments, such as that presented about game planning, to dissuade these people from their off-putting behaviors, you have much more confidence in their reasonableness than I.

C'mon Booster. It's an Internet forum, not a Mensa conference. I like Turk's grades because they spur conversation, some of which is insightful. I myself view and comment on recruit films, though I try to issue every caveat that I am not a professional recruiter (though I generally trust my own eyes).

Re McCall, I know enough to know that I do not know enough about schemes to assess his performance. So I stay out of that. But the article linked here was very illuminating for me.

 

[ricko654321]

Wait a minute. What you're saying is that NUs coaches developed a game plan to take advantage of PSUs defense. I thought the consensus on this Board is that McCall sucks and the team won in spite of the coaches.

The analysis has to be wrong (sarcasm alert).

Thanks for posting.

Yea thanks for posting. Interesting stuff. That's a play we've run plenty before but props to Mick for recognizing that their alignment created a weakness and running it repeatedly. I guess they were overloading the RB side cause they were afraid of all the speed options they'd seen in film in prior weeks?? Way to go Mick finding ways to establish the run.

 

[Hungry Jack]

Yea thanks for posting. Interesting stuff. That's a play we've run plenty before but props to Mick for recognizing that their alignment created a weakness and running it repeatedly. I guess they were overloading the RB side cause they were afraid of all the speed options they'd seen in film in prior weeks?? Way to go Mick finding ways to establish the run.

I would not think that PSUs front four would need a schematic advantage to be effective. Zettel and Nassib both will get drafted earlier rather than later. It also seems to be a dare to throw the ball, especially on the third and fifteen without a deep safety. Carr was very open on that play, but a deep safety over the top might have gotten over there in time to knock it away.

 

[CoralSpringsCat]

I have stopped listening to the Cliff Clavens of this board many months ago. They have absolutely no credibility, posting incessantly about the same things for years, in effect contending that they know more about the game and how it should be coached than any of the professionals. One guy presumptuously "rates" the players every week, acting like a wannabe coach. I wish they did not add so much garbage to this board that we all must then avoid. If you are looking for reasoned arguments, such as that presented about game planning, to dissuade these people from their off-putting behaviors, you have much more confidence in their reasonableness than I.

 

[chicagocatfan24]

McCall has called mostly lousy plans. Bottom line. That's the truth as he is mostly awful. That said, I acknowledged and gave him credit myself for two game plans/schemes as he finally pulled it out and figured things that this board has been telling him to consider for quite some time.
Two particular things.

1. Stop the nonsense of relying on WR that simply can't catch. He limited this by playing a lot of two TE sets, AND, having the TE's [Dickerson and Vitale] as the primary receivers or reads. This was great success. Why the hell did he refuse to count on G Dickerson for the first 6 games????

2. Against PSU, McCall finally pulled some OL [FINALLY] to the short side, AND lined up the superback Vitale on that side [sometimes he actually lined up BOTH TE"s on that side]. The result was that we had 6 blockers against 3 or 4 tacklers. We ran the play with Jackson RELIGIOUSLY to that side, even when PSU adjusted and KNEW it was coming....and kicked their ASS. Credit to McCall. Also credit to Vitale who had block after seal block time and again. In the first half, Mogus really blasted some holes, including at least 3 of Jackson's long gainers. Both him and Vitale. PSU was unprepared as I hadn't previously seen this formation from McCall. As I said, I gave McCall credit. I have no idea why he insisted upon tossing the pill to underperforming WR while not incorporating pulling OL or the TE's or the RB screens into the game plan. He did incorporate RB screens lately, even if they haven't produced, but I like them. I mean prior to PSU, McCall's running plays were Dive left, Dive right. No Nothing.

My gripe at this point is that he doesn't move the pocket at all. I've never seen such a stubborn OC that refuses to move the pocket. If you watched the PSU game film, we were eating Hack alive. However, on that one nice drive that changed everything, Franklin moved the pocket. Hack set up on the outside and it didn't take no more than a few minutes for a PSU TD. We need to do the same.

It's not a perfect world, yes, McCall isn't perfect. He needs to move the pocket and I'm not talking about a bootleg with no pulling OL. Oliver booted ONE TIME and got smashed due to poor scheming by McCall.

McCall isn't the best OC, so don't make him out to be superman just because he FINALLY did something the last two weeks.

1a. McCall doesn't read these boards, or look to anyone on them, especially you, for advise.
1b. Dickerson had a huge drop that would have maybe been a touchdown against PSU, as well as an AWFUL whiff on s block that lead to a big sack. Small sample size, but gonna guess this has a lot to do with why he hasn't been a go-to target much this year.

2. Guessing you only noticed this cuz you read the post on the PSU board

3. I am asking this sincerely - what credibility do you have in assessing football strategy other than watching the games from the stands and on TV? Did you coach, play, attend clinics, etc.? I want to know why someone who claims to have as much expertise as you is sitting assessing a paid professional on an internet forum instead of, you know, actually coaching professional. Waiting with baited breath for your answer.

Good evenin'

 

[Turk]

1a. McCall doesn't read these boards, or look to anyone on them, especially you, for advise.
1b. Dickerson had a huge drop that would have maybe been a touchdown against PSU, as well as an AWFUL whiff on s block that lead to a big sack. Small sample size, but gonna guess this has a lot to do with why he hasn't been a go-to target much this year.

2. Guessing you only noticed this cuz you read the post on the PSU board

3. I am asking this sincerely - what credibility do you have in assessing football strategy other than watching the games from the stands and on TV? Did you coach, play, attend clinics, etc.? I want to know why someone who claims to have as much expertise as you is sitting assessing a paid professional on an internet forum instead of, you know, actually coaching professional. Waiting with baited breath for your answer.

Good evenin'

my credentials include admittance to the uber tent, restocking supplies of coors light, and a new cell phone. And i was a pop warner fill-in coach back in the day. As an oc i called reverses on every play.

 

[DocCatsFan]

I would actually like to hear from some of the former players on this board about this issue. In their weekly podcast with InsideNU and WNUR DCF Jr pointed out that our O Line seems pretty good at run blocking but really bad at protecting the QB and also in straight dive plays for short yardage. His theory is that we zone block much better than we man block. Curious to hear from those who really understand these schemes.

 

[hdhntr1]

my credentials include admittance to the uber tent, restocking supplies of coors light, and a new cell phone. And i was a pop warner fill-in coach back in the day. As an oc i called reverses on every play.

And when they figured that out? Which in the BIG might be on the second time you ran it.

 

[ubercat]

my credentials include admittance to the uber tent, restocking supplies of coors light, and a new cell phone. And i was a pop warner fill-in coach back in the day. As an oc i called reverses on every play.

You got a new cell phone ?!?!

 

[Turk]

You got a new cell phone ?!?!

yes. i left my door open at dd and someone hawked my s2 which was about 4 years old. it was time.

 

[kawacko]

McCall has called mostly lousy plans. Bottom line. That's the truth as he is mostly awful. That said, I acknowledged and gave him credit myself for two game plans/schemes as he finally pulled it out and figured things that this board has been telling him to consider for quite some time.
Two particular things.

1. Stop the nonsense of relying on WR that simply can't catch. He limited this by playing a lot of two TE sets, AND, having the TE's [Dickerson and Vitale] as the primary receivers or reads. This was great success. Why the hell did he refuse to count on G Dickerson for the first 6 games????

2. Against PSU, McCall finally pulled some OL [FINALLY] to the short side, AND lined up the superback Vitale on that side [sometimes he actually lined up BOTH TE"s on that side]. The result was that we had 6 blockers against 3 or 4 tacklers. We ran the play with Jackson RELIGIOUSLY to that side, even when PSU adjusted and KNEW it was coming....and kicked their ASS. Credit to McCall. Also credit to Vitale who had block after seal block time and again. In the first half, Mogus really blasted some holes, including at least 3 of Jackson's long gainers. Both him and Vitale. PSU was unprepared as I hadn't previously seen this formation from McCall. As I said, I gave McCall credit. I have no idea why he insisted upon tossing the pill to underperforming WR while not incorporating pulling OL or the TE's or the RB screens into the game plan. He did incorporate RB screens lately, even if they haven't produced, but I like them. I mean prior to PSU, McCall's running plays were Dive left, Dive right. No Nothing.

My gripe at this point is that he doesn't move the pocket at all. I've never seen such a stubborn OC that refuses to move the pocket. If you watched the PSU game film, we were eating Hack alive. However, on that one nice drive that changed everything, Franklin moved the pocket. Hack set up on the outside and it didn't take no more than a few minutes for a PSU TD. We need to do the same.

It's not a perfect world, yes, McCall isn't perfect. He needs to move the pocket and I'm not talking about a bootleg with no pulling OL. Oliver booted ONE TIME and got smashed due to poor scheming by McCall.

McCall isn't the best OC, so don't make him out to be superman just because he FINALLY did something the last two weeks.

Turk you are right on with your comments on Vitale. He is a great lead blocker and an excellent receiver. I you just watch him you will see how many big plays he is involved in.

 

[pawildcat]

Penn State has been gashed several times by running games this year. Their ends tend to overcommit to the pass rush and leave seams open.

 

[Katatonic]

^ This - way over-aggressive when it comes to trying to get to the QB.

On the big NU runs - there were a couple of PSU defenders in the backfield, but didn't matter as it was a run play away from their side.

I'd say that the PSU OC is overly infatuated w/ the pass rush - which leaves the PSU D vulnerable to long runs when they guess wrong.